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Tour of Norway Discussion
Ulrich Ulriksen
Tour of Norway

pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/profiles/pthc_nor.jpg

Preview

The PTHC Tour of Norway returns for its 7th edition. After some varied parcours it settled into its current 5-stage TT/hill mix format in 2017. The past two years it has been finely balanced between the puncheurs and the TT men. This year stage 4 gets some additional climbing and stage 5 adds 30 km and some more hills, moving it from a flat to hill classification. Seeing this shift managers of the big boys from the Ardennes have smelled blood and we have AGR winner Ponzi and LBL/FW double winner Bakelants as well as one of their biggest rivals in Sagan. Ironically, another Ardennes big dog, EBH, who is both the defending Tour of Norway champion and a Norwegian cycling god, is not on the start list.

Perhaps the changing parcours also explains why 2017 champion and 2018 runner up Coppel and 2016 champion Fiedler both skip the race as does Jonas Ahlstrand who has won 6 stages in the last 4 years and twice taken the points jersey.

The question is whether the shift in parcours is enough to move the race in the favor of the punchier riders. Stage 4 features some relatively long climbs so the mountain stat may also play a role. There are 11 80+ Hill riders in the field

FLMTHITTRSAC
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/fab.png Ponzi767384687280
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/ino.png Bakelants717483667777
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/min.png Claeys736783646873
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/mos.png Sagan727483687476
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/itd.png Izagirre717481777264
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/fpc.png McCarthy706781587574
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/gen.png Ulissi766680627175
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/vvg.png Gautier726880647277
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/kul.png Vakoc717180697174
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/ebd.png Boswell707180677376
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/vlv.png Jensen717080677376

pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/itd.png Izagirre, coming from the PCT level, immediately catches the eye with a TT significantly better than any of his rivals as well as one of the strongest MT stats. His weak AC might be an issue but he should get into the late stages with a significant cushion so some small time losses won’t matter.

Putting him aside pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/fab.png Ponzi, pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/ino.png Bakelants and pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/mos.png Sagan all stand out with strong HI, solid MT and reasonable TT stats. It seems likely the rest of the riders on this list will be fighting for top 5s, rather than a podium, barring a daring escape. Flat stat is shown because this reporter is obsessed with it and Stage 1 features a lumpy course where the pack could split and one or two unprepared GC men could find themselves in a hole. Luckily, none of the contenders are too weak here.

But what if the Ardennes specialists have it wrong and the TT is still enough to win the race? Below are the TT guys who have a better TT than Izaguirre and also a hill value of at least 75.

Oops nobody meets that criteria.

If we go to 72 hill we get pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/gen.png Oliveira (73 HI) and pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/des.png Fraile (72). Fraile finished 4th in 2018. Unless the hilly stages are totally non-selective it seems unlikely that any of the top TT guys are going to beatpcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/itd.png Izagirre. So we will consign them to the stage analysis below.

The Stages

Stage 1 features a 188 km trek from Sandefjord to Tønsberg, with a sprint finish likely. But with multiple bumps along the way expect a mad dash for the line rather than a structured sprint with pretty lead outs.

There are 13 80+ sprinters in the field:

FLRSSPAC
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/t3a.png Ewan75718381
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/ubs.png Reinhardt71667984
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/fab.png Guardini72698082
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/cdb.png Appollonio74668178
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/tti.png Samolenkov74718079
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/t3a.png Keukeleire72688079
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/ino.png Goss73708177
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/fpc.png Van der Sande75737979
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/min.png Vantomme72638176
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/mos.png Soupe72697977
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/vvg.png Vanderaerden72657975
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/tti.png Van Heerden72668172
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/yor.png Rowe72588070

Ewan has a clear advantage in the sprint stat and with strong flat and resistance as well as a good hill stat he seems like the clear favorite. In addition he brings a strong lead out with pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/t3a.png Alaphilippe as well as pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/t3a.png Keukeleire, who makes it onto the list of top sprinters above. The rest seem relatively evenly matched except pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/min.png Vantomme and pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/yor.png Rowe with the weak resistance.

Stage 2 offers up a more routine sprint stage at just 150 km from Oslo to Drammen. There are still some bumps but it should offer more chance for sprint trains to form. pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/t3a.png Ewan’s strong Podium Ambition lead out stands out but pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/cdb.png Appollonio and pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/min.png Vantomme both bring lead out riders in pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/cdb.png Kvist and pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/min.png Avila, respectively. Perhaps this is the stage for one of them to pull off a victory.

Stage 3, the hump stage, brings the pivotal time trial – 30 pan flat kms in Hokksund. Clearly a number of riders are targeting this stage as a the peloton features 13 quality TT specialists.
FL HITTPRRS
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/rpn.png Zmorka7466828275
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/t3a.png Sergent7969808074
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/ebd.png Howson7165808074
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/tti.png Yatsevich7068808081
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/tti.png Malori7868797973
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/des.png Fraile6972797976
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/fab.png Goldstein7461797972
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/t3a.png Cataford7470797975
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/t3a.png Hepburn7166797977
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/gen.png Viviani7866797977
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/vlv.png Haugard7260797977
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/tti.png Vorobev7565797871
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/tti.png Dal Col7164797872

Since this seems like a pure test of TT skills pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/rpn.png Zmorka is the clear favorite, while pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/vlv.png Haugard carries the home nation’s hopes for a stage win. pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/t3a.png Sergent, pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/tti.png Malori and pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/gen.png Viviani are all strong roulers who will also be looking to do some damage in Stage 1.

Stage 4 is the key stage for the puncheurs where we expect our GC favorites to come to the front. Most will have significant TT losses to make up so it should be the recipe for an exciting stage. The question is will it be selective enough for them to shake off the TT/HI riders like pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/itd.png Izagirre. In addition to the Spaniard some others with hopes to hold on to the top puncheurs in Stage 4 and snatch the leaders jersey include:

FLMTHITTRS
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/gzl.png Kangert7575777775
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/gzl.png Bibby7276757673
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/gen.png Rosskopf7373757671
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/xr0.png Bazhkou7169757675
pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/isa.png Sepulveda7075777573

Gazelle with two riders on this list will have multiple tactical cards to play including pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/gzl.png Kangert who has the the best all around skill set after pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/itd.png Izagirre

Stage 4 has a hilltop finish and longer climbs but the revamped Stage 5 gives the punchy riders another opportunity with multiple short sharp climbs over 198 km. Whichever rider holds yellow will need a strong team to control the race. Perhaps because the Vuelta conflict none of pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/fab.png Ponzi, pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/ino.png Bakelants or pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/mos.png Sagan brings a particularly deep team. Arguably, the PCT Iberia – Team Degenkolb riders supporting pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/itd.png Izagirre make for a better supporting cast. pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/itd.png Gougeard is a strong lieutenant and pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/itd.png Brockhoff and pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/itd.png Jans are tough all-rounders.
Gazelle with their multiple GC options will also be a threat while pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/isa.png Sepulveda and ISA-Hexacta bring a dangerous group with the 3 additional punchy riders in pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/isa.png Boily, pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/isa.png Rodriguez Galindo and pcmdaily.com/images/mg/2019/Micros/isa.png Zakarin.

Overall though, with his all around skills and solid team Jon Izaguirre must be the favorite for the 2019 edition of the Tour of Norway.


Full Start List

Spoiler
TeamLast nameFirst name
Campari/Asahi developmentRocchettiFederico
Campari/Asahi developmentJungHa Jeon
Campari/Asahi developmentKoishiYuma
Campari/Asahi developmentFiorelliFilippo
Campari/Asahi developmentMatsumotoYosukue
Campari/Asahi developmentYamamotoMasaki
Campari/Asahi developmentChristianMark
Campari/Asahi developmentPichonLaurent
Carlsberg - Danske BankJuul-JensenChristopher
Carlsberg - Danske BankAranburuAlex
Carlsberg - Danske BankAppollonioDavide
Carlsberg - Danske BankHaasNathan
Carlsberg - Danske BankHansenJesper
Carlsberg - Danske BankSinkeldamRamon
Carlsberg - Danske bankSteensenAndre
Carlsberg - Danske BankKvistThomas Vedel
cycleYorkshireKorenKristjan
cycleYorkshireBellisJonathan
cycleYorkshireSkaarsethAnders
cycleYorkshireRoweMatt
cycleYorkshireCullaighGabriel
cycleYorkshireFennAndrew
cycleYorkshireRedeckerHeiko
cycleYorkshireThwaitesScott
DesigualKozhatayevBakhtiyar
DesigualJonesCarter
DesigualFraileOmar
DesigualYechezkelAviv
DesigualNazaretMagno
DesigualTsatevichAlexey
eBuddyVan der KooijBas
eBuddyHowsonDamien
eBuddyLampaertYves
eBuddyAriesenTim
eBuddyMeijersJeroen
eBuddyBoswellIan
eBuddyRoosenTimo
eBuddyGoldsteinOmer
Fablok - Bank BGZEliadDaniel
Fablok - Bank BGZGuardiniAndrea
Fablok - Bank BGZJallaysWelle
Fablok - Bank BGZRumacJosip
Fablok - Bank BGZGoldsteinRoy
Fablok - Bank BGZPonziSimone
Fablok - Bank BGZKalfSteven
Fablok - Bank BGZBostnerJaka
Farfetch Pro CyclingMentenMilan
Farfetch Pro CyclingDe BodStefan
Farfetch Pro CyclingMinKyeng Ho
Farfetch Pro CyclingAtkinsJosh
Farfetch Pro CyclingKrigbaumMathias
Farfetch Pro CyclingVan der SandeTosh
Farfetch Pro CyclingMcCarthyJay
Farfetch Pro CyclingZhupaEugert
GazelleBibbyIan
GazelleBoaroManuele
GazelleSenyenovRoman
GazelleKangertTanel
GazelleFejesGabor
GazelleKonradPatrick
GazelleHoflandMoreno
GazelleDe GendtThomas
GeneraliGhyselinckJan
GeneraliUlissiDiego
GeneraliOliveiraNelson
GeneraliRosskopfJoey
GeneraliKungStefan
GeneraliDeesTim
GeneraliVivianiElia
GeneraliSterbiniLuca
Grieg - MaerskRingheimJo Kogstad
Grieg - MaerskNardinThiago Duarte
Grieg - MaerskLaengenVegard Stake
Grieg - MaerskMoulinguiClenne Morvan
Grieg - MaerskVassdalKen Sebastian
Grieg - MaerskAndersenSoren Kragh
Grieg - MaerskJansenAmund Grondahl
Grieg - MaerskKorsaethTruls Engen
Iberia - Team DegenkolbCosnefroyBenoit
Iberia - Team DegenkolbSolerMarc
Iberia - Team DegenkolbIzagirreIon
Iberia - Team DegenkolbGougeardAlexis
Iberia - Team DegenkolbBrockhoffJan
Iberia - Team DegenkolbJansRoy
Iberia - Team DegenkolbBartheCyril
Iberia - Team DegenkolbNychArtem
Indosat Ooredoo - ANZJiCheng
Indosat Ooredoo - ANZLuchshenkoSergey
Indosat Ooredoo - ANZOkbamariamTesfom
Indosat Ooredoo - ANZBakelantsJan
Indosat Ooredoo - ANZGossMatthew
Indosat Ooredoo - ANZDe DeckerAlfdan
Indosat Ooredoo - ANZVan AvermaetGreg
ISA - HexactaDe LunaFlavio
ISA - HexactaSepulvedaEduardo
ISA - HexactaFengChun Kai
ISA - HexactaBoilyDavid
ISA - HexactaRodriguez GalindoMichael
ISA - HexactaZakarinIlnur
ISA - HexactaVandousselaereSven
ISA - HexactaContrerasEmiliano
Kulczyk - AlitaliaBrozynaPiotr
Kulczyk - AlitaliaGrippoChiaffredo
Kulczyk - AlitaliaVakocPetr
Kulczyk - AlitaliaBarbinEnrico
Kulczyk - AlitaliaGradekKamil
Kulczyk - AlitaliaDruckerJempy
Kulczyk - AlitaliaMarczynskiTomasz
Kulczyk - AlitaliaTeweldeJani
MinionsHodegAlvaro
MinionsAvilaEdwin
MinionsSelanderBjorn
MinionsVantommeMaxime
MinionsJanse van RensburgReinhardt
MinionsKiflayMetkel
MinionsClaeysDimitri
MinionsBruFulgencio
Moser - SygicPolnickyJiri
Moser - SygicMaryczJaroslaw
Moser - SygicBorosMichael
Moser - SygicBaskaErik
Moser - SygicSoupeGeoffrey
Moser - SygicSaganPeter
Moser - SygicPradoIgnacio Jesus
Moser - SygicTurekDaniel
Podium AmbitionQuaadeRasmus
Podium AmbitionSergentJesse
Podium AmbitionPostlbergerLukas
Podium AmbitionCatafordAlexandor
Podium AmbitionHepburnMichael
Podium AmbitionAlaphilippeJulian
Podium AmbitionEwanCaleb
Podium AmbitionKeukeleireJens
Repsol - NetflixTeggartMatthew
Repsol - NetflixSerranoRafael
Repsol - NetflixDunbarEddie
Repsol - NetflixCastroviejoJonathan
Repsol - NetflixBassoLeonardo
Repsol - NetflixNovakJakub
Repsol - NetflixHerradaJesus
Repsol - NetflixZmorkaMarlen
Swisslion Cycling TeamKasaGabor
Swisslion Cycling TeamPenkoIzidor
Swisslion Cycling TeamMartinezDaniel Felipe
Swisslion Cycling TeamBilbaoPello
Swisslion Cycling TeamPetrovskiStefan
Swisslion Cycling TeamPibernikLuka
Swisslion Cycling TeamSeibebCosta
Swisslion Cycling TeamPoljanecMiha
Team TinkoffMaloriAdrian
Team TinkoffVorobevAnton
Team TinkoffVan HeerdenJuan
Team TinkoffDal ColAndrea
Team TinkoffChernetskiySergey
Team TinkoffTrakhovDmitry
Team TinkoffSamolenkovArtem
Team TinkoffYatsevichKiril
Team UBSGrigrianArtur
Team UBSMüllerPatrick
Team UBSFuchsDominik
Team UBSSchäppiMartin
Team UBSReichenbachSebastien
Team UBSBadilattiMatteo
Team UBSReinhardtTheo
Team UBSFumeauxJonathan
Valio - Viking GeneticsNepomnyachsniyYevgeni
Valio - Viking GeneticsBlumsMartins
Valio - Viking GeneticsGautierCyril
Valio - Viking GeneticsHelmeSasu
Valio - Viking GeneticsGebremedhinAwet
Valio - Viking GeneticsKanervaJoni
Valio - Viking GeneticsPaajanenPaavo
Valio - Viking GeneticsVanderaerdenMichael
Volvo acc. by SpotifyErikssonLucas
Volvo acc. by SpotifyCampenaertsVictor
Volvo acc. by SpotifyHalvorsenKristoffer
Volvo acc. by SpotifyBlikraHavard
Volvo acc. by SpotifyTillerRasmus
Volvo acc. by SpotifyTanfieldHarry
Volvo acc. by SpotifyJensenKristian Haugaard
Volvo acc. by SpotifyHaugardPhan Age
Xero Racingde KleijnArvid
Xero RacingVan NiekerkMorne
Xero RacingKennettDylan
Xero RacingBazhkouStanislau
Xero RacingAreruyaJoseph
Xero RacingDyrnesKristian
Xero RacingBesterShaun Nick
Xero RacingSchomberNils

Man Game: McCormick Pro Cycling
 
jandal7
Bazhkou hasn't done anything yet, this would be a hell of a race to turn that around in Grin He did very well last year iirc but still waiting for him to click with PCM18. Dyrnes in some breaks would be nice to look for a stage win but I fear he'll be our leader and come somewhere in the 30s Pfft

Thanks for the preview Ulrich!
24/02/21 - kandesbunzler said “I don't drink famous people."
15/08/22 - SotD said "Your [jandal's] humour is overrated"
11/06/24 - knockout said "Winning is fine I guess. Truth be told this felt completely unimportant."

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DubbelDekker
Exciting tour! Of course we hope Kangert and Bibby will manage to hold on to the elite puncheurs and score big through their TT skills. But they might also get obliterated in stages 4 and 5.

Kangert has been in bad form all season, so fingers crossed.
i.imgur.com/5iNQj.png
 
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Marcovdw
Not looking forward to the TT, that's where Claeys will lose big time, but I hope he can conquer the hilly stages
Manager of Minions
 
Tamijo
Every time our jersey make it to a screenshot here, it will be a good day Smile
 
tastasol
Would have liked to have a stronger team in our home race, but had to place a rider like Wurtz in the Vuelta for experience. Still, we have the mighty Stake Laengen. A repeat from his previous race in Sweden would be great, though I guess top 20 is a more realistic hope. Looking forward to the race!
 
TheManxMissile
This is pretty much an all-in squad for this race, despite having no punchuers to capitalise in the final two days.
Pocket Rocket has to win a stage, he has a clear gap over the rest as well as a proper lead out in Julian and Kek (backed up with all those flat powers in the TT'ers i brought). Anything else is just a failure of PCM at a basic level!
Then stacked up the trialists to target stage three. Can't match Zmorka but we should be right in the chase for a podium place there, and a few guys into the Top10.
Don't sleep on AC, he'll TT well and has proven to be surprisingly resiliant on climbs, could slip himself into a weirdly good GC position for a non-climber. Maybe after losing time in the TT we can get Julian attacking on those final two days, especially the finish of Stage 5 would suit the Frenchman.

Feeling good about this one having seen the startlist Smile

i.makeagif.com/media/7-07-2018/9Sr3Zt.gif
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baseballlover312
Like usual, we are way below the level of competition.

We shouldn't have a brought a puncheur here. Warbasse might have done better with all the "mountains." Juul-Jensen will be useless like all year.

Appo will also struggle. The fact that we have one of the better sprint trains is actually a curse in PCM 18. It means he'll definitely go too early and end up 14th, cause for some reason that's just how it works.

Steensen likewise will never do okay in hills again thanks to his mountain, and there are way better time trialists than him, so he means nothing.

This isn't even a good dev race for us, with only Aranburu here, and besides that a bunch of depth domestiques that won't do anything but maybe get dropped early from breaks.

Gonna be an embarrassing Scandinavian trip this year. Frown
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy
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baseballlover312
:lol:

Can't draw it up any better. Appo launches with perfect position and less than a km to go, and then cracks and falls out of the top 5. I'd blame it on him missing the split, which also seems to be a strangely common occurrence lately, but the fact is, this would have happened anyway. He goes early every single damn time. I guess I missed the DB update where his flat was decreased to 55.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy
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jandal7
Tosh! So happy for him, congrats jph GrinGrinGrin
24/02/21 - kandesbunzler said “I don't drink famous people."
15/08/22 - SotD said "Your [jandal's] humour is overrated"
11/06/24 - knockout said "Winning is fine I guess. Truth be told this felt completely unimportant."

[ICL] Santos-Euskadi | [PT] i.imgur.com/c85NSl6.png Xero Racing

i.imgur.com/PdCbs9I.png
i.imgur.com/RPIlJYr.png
5x i.imgur.com/wM6Wok5.png x5
i.imgur.com/olRsxdu.png
2x pcmdaily.com/images/mg/Awards2021/funniest21.png x2
2x i.imgur.com/TUidkLG.png x2
 
DubbelDekker
Imagine having Ponzi as your leadout

Congrats jph!
i.imgur.com/5iNQj.png
 
tastasol
More or less as expected. Good that we tried to get in the break. Without a sprinter a great result would always be hard, but at least good to see a couple of them well up amongst the first behind the sprinters. Congrats Jph!
 
Marcovdw
Vantomme going backwards seems to be the norm rather than the exception
Manager of Minions
 
TheManxMissile
Thank f*ck i commited to a Sprint based team for the PCM with, and i quote a lot of managers, "the best AI yet in PCM". No way having clearly the best sprinter with quality leadout could backfire there.
*checks result*
Ah yes, there we go. Just as i expected, f*cking useless game Smile I will stilll buy any unwanted sprinters in the off-season because i'm so far down this hole i can only keep going in hopes of breaking the game entirely by owning the entire sprint field in a race!
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Tamijo
Perfect start for the Campari boys. Great day one, lets keep it up.

Congrats to Van der Sande and thanks for another quality report.
 
beagle
With Degenkolb failing everywhere he participates, Izagirre remains our only hope to not relegate. C'mon Ion, you can save the team!

(Top 10 goal here iirc)
Manager of Polar in Man-Game
 
baseballlover312
Is Appo going early hardcoded into the DB? This isn't a joke anymore, this is insane.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy
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OlegTinkov
Ok flat stages done, let's get this race started!
 
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roturn
TheManxMissile wrote:
Thank f*ck i commited to a Sprint based team for the PCM with, and i quote a lot of managers, "the best AI yet in PCM". No way having clearly the best sprinter with quality leadout could backfire there.
*checks result*
Ah yes, there we go. Just as i expected, f*cking useless game Smile I will stilll buy any unwanted sprinters in the off-season because i'm so far down this hole i can only keep going in hopes of breaking the game entirely by owning the entire sprint field in a race!

:lol:
 
Tamijo
Congrats to ManxMissile, glad so see that it is not all bad.

Thanks for another quality report.

Regarding Campari, still all over the place with a developing squad, could not possibly expect more than we are able to do here.
 
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