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Café Pedro 3: Who is this Pedro Person Anyway?
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 09-08-2012 19:46
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I'm a Republican. I just don't like having to pay for other people's problems in taxes that can pay. And especially paying for there freakin abortions.
Edited by baseballlover312 on 09-08-2012 19:47
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| SweatyViking |
Posted on 09-08-2012 19:47
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valverde321 wrote:
SweatyViking wrote:
Norway has the best health care system in the world and it's all free for everyone. In the USA, people who are dying are thrown out of hospitals because they can't afford the bills... SHAME, SHAME on USA!
Is it actually free or is it part of your taxes like Canada?
Not sure if it is a part of the taxes, but the taxes are average here.
The conservative parties who have a big time lead in the polls before the election next year want to cut taxes for the rich to the half.. |
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| SweatyViking |
Posted on 09-08-2012 19:49
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baseballlover312 wrote:
I'm a Republican. I just don't like having to pay for other people's problems in taxes that can pay. And especially paying for there freakin abortions.
I am opposed to abortion myself, but saying that within my party (Labor Party Youth) is like russian roulette.. Lots of hardcore feminists there. |
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 09-08-2012 19:51
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A person should work to earn money. No one gets by for free.
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| Ian Butler |
Posted on 09-08-2012 19:51
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baseballlover312 wrote:
I'm a Republican. I just don't like having to pay for other people's problems in taxes that can pay. And especially paying for there freakin abortions.
You don't say...
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 09-08-2012 19:54
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SweatyViking wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
I'm a Republican. I just don't like having to pay for other people's problems in taxes that can pay. And especially paying for there freakin abortions.
I am opposed to abortion myself, but saying that within my party (Labor Party Youth) is like russian roulette.. Lots of hardcore feminists there.
How come if I get in a car crash with a woman when she's pregnant I get charged for murder, but she can go kill it for free?
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| Levi4life |
Posted on 09-08-2012 19:57
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Not everyone will be covered. It's a step in the right direction, but not universal. The Affordable Care Act was modeled off the Massachusetts plan put in place by Romney. Romney got the idea from Newt Gingrich who got the idea from the Heritage Foundation, who came up with the idea as an alternative to a universal single payer system proposed by Hillary Clinton in the late 80's early 90's. Obamacare is supposed to be the "free market alternative" which means people will be left out.
Texas and New Jersey have stated their intent to turn down the expansion of medicaid, which will leave between 1.5 and 2 million without coverage. Plus there are exemptions and loopholes out the ass.
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| SweatyViking |
Posted on 09-08-2012 20:00
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Levi4life wrote:
Not everyone will be covered. It's a step in the right direction, but not universal. The Affordable Care Act was modeled off the Massachusetts plan put in place by Romney. Romney got the idea from Newt Gingrich who got the idea from the Heritage Foundation, who came up with the idea as an alternative to a universal single payer system proposed by Hillary Clinton in the late 80's early 90's. Obamacare is supposed to be the "free market alternative" which means people will be left out.
Texas and New Jersey have stated their intent to turn down the expansion of medicaid, which will leave between 1.5 and 2 million without coverage. Plus there are exemptions and loopholes out the ass.
Exactly.. BTW, where in the political landscape do you stand?
The US is the land of the free, but apparently that doesn't include freedom for the poor.. |
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 09-08-2012 20:01
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Where is freedom involved?
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 24-11-2024 22:56
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| wackojackohighcliffe |
Posted on 09-08-2012 20:04
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baseballlover312 wrote:
I'm a Republican. I just don't like having to pay for other people's problems in taxes that can pay. And especially paying for there freakin abortions.
Do you realise that yanks pay more per capita in taxes for their "healthcare system" than in a humane country like the UK? |
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| Levi4life |
Posted on 09-08-2012 20:08
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baseballlover312 wrote:
SweatyViking wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
I'm a Republican. I just don't like having to pay for other people's problems in taxes that can pay. And especially paying for there freakin abortions.
I am opposed to abortion myself, but saying that within my party (Labor Party Youth) is like russian roulette.. Lots of hardcore feminists there.
How come if I get in a car crash with a woman when she's pregnant I get charged for murder, but she can go kill it for free?
Because it's her vagina? It don't see the equivalence here. If you kill someone in a car accident and your negligence lead to the accident then you can be charged with manslaughter whether she's preggers or not.
I think I can turn your logic on it's head. If a woman is raped and becomes pregnant as a result and the pro-life crowd forces her to keep the little shit is that not the same thing? What if she dies giving birth?
I think the safest way to go is to allow women control over their own reproductive health. Keep it or abort it, not my business.
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| SweatyViking |
Posted on 09-08-2012 20:11
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Levi4life wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
SweatyViking wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
I'm a Republican. I just don't like having to pay for other people's problems in taxes that can pay. And especially paying for there freakin abortions.
I am opposed to abortion myself, but saying that within my party (Labor Party Youth) is like russian roulette.. Lots of hardcore feminists there.
How come if I get in a car crash with a woman when she's pregnant I get charged for murder, but she can go kill it for free?
Because it's her vagina? It don't see the equivalence here. If you kill someone in a car accident and your negligence lead to the accident then you can be charged with manslaughter whether she's preggers or not.
I think I can turn your logic on it's head. If a woman is raped and becomes pregnant as a result and the pro-life crowd forces her to keep the little shit is that not the same thing? What if she dies giving birth?
I think the safest way to go is to allow women control over their own reproductive health. Keep it or abort it, not my business.
Don't think we should outlaw abortion, but I certainly think it's immoral except in cases of rape or health risks for the mother. |
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| Aquarius |
Posted on 09-08-2012 20:13
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I definitely agree with Levi here. To throw a few more arguments in, I'll borrow those of Albert Camus. Read anything you can by him if not done yet, by the way.
So, in Reflections on the Guillotine, written in the late 50's while the death penalty was still going on in France, he stated that :
- Crime levels had not risen in countries who had already abolished death penalty
- The threat of death is not going to prevent someone determined to commit a murder, as anyway, we'll all die at some point
- Most murders are not premeditated anyway (and I'll add that many are committed by people with a mental condition)
- Death penalty just adds more violence to the process. It's revenge by society against an individual. Revenge is not justice (I remember we debated this here when Bin Laden was killed by US Force and Obama commented that "Justice had been done" )
- It made sense in religious societies, because human justice deprived the executed person from his terrestrial life, sending him/her to the divine justice. But in atheist societies, the argument doesn't make sense.
- Another argument was that Death Penalty is meant to be exemplary, so, at first, in would be done publicly, during day time. Then people realised it was too horrible and moved it inside prisons. Then they made it private. And then again, they decided to make it early in the morning before other prisoners would wake up. So, how does the "see what horrible thing is going to happen to you if you commit a crime" argument work here ? It doesn't.
- His last argument is that being of the family of someone in jail is not easy, but being of the family of someone condemned to the death penalty is even worst, and just adds more suffering in the process.
I mostly agree with him.
edit : this message was of course part of the death penalty discussion of the previous page. I started typing before dinner and ended afterwards.
Edited by Aquarius on 09-08-2012 20:20
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| Aquarius |
Posted on 09-08-2012 20:19
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SweatyViking wrote:
Levi4life wrote:
Because it's her vagina? It don't see the equivalence here. If you kill someone in a car accident and your negligence lead to the accident then you can be charged with manslaughter whether she's preggers or not.
I think I can turn your logic on it's head. If a woman is raped and becomes pregnant as a result and the pro-life crowd forces her to keep the little shit is that not the same thing? What if she dies giving birth?
I think the safest way to go is to allow women control over their own reproductive health. Keep it or abort it, not my business.
Don't think we should outlaw abortion, but I certainly think it's immoral except in cases of rape or health risks for the mother.
You know that going through an abortion is certainly not like a walk in the park, don't you ?
It's something quite serious. I have no figures to back it up, but I guess that very little abortions are done because "future" parents just changed their mind about the right time to have a baby. |
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 09-08-2012 20:24
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Umm. It's a human being, not property. I find it morally wrong. Go kill babies if you want, but I'm not paying for it.
And Levi. About the rape scenario, way to bring up an extreme circumstance to prove your point. I find that invalid. However, rape is a different story, it's not a choice.
I mean really. They make feraking condoms.
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| cio93 |
Posted on 09-08-2012 20:27
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baseballlover312 wrote:
And Levi. About the rape scenario, way to bring up an extreme circumstance to prove your point.
baseballlover312 wrote:
How come if I get in a car crash with a woman when she's pregnant I get charged for murder, but she can go kill it for free?
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 09-08-2012 20:28
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Hypothetical interpretations are not your specialty. My point stays firm. If I kill a baby, how is it different from abortion? How is killing a newborn different from killing a baby in the whom? That's like saying it's okay to kill a 5 year old but not a six year old.
Edit: I agree with sweatyviking. If the mother could die or was raped, fine. But not by choice. Back to my point that if you wanna find a loophole to kill babies, fine. But I'm not paying for it.
Edited by baseballlover312 on 09-08-2012 20:34
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| fcancellara |
Posted on 09-08-2012 20:31
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For the first time in history, the discussions in the Café are actually about something serious, I believe 
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| lluuiiggii |
Posted on 09-08-2012 20:39
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Are people arguing over abortion or death penalty? I'm confused now
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| Aquarius |
Posted on 09-08-2012 20:40
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No idea how it works in the U.S.A. but in France there's a limit of 10 weeks of pregnancy for abortion, except for medical emergencies.
A pregnancy normally lasts around 38 weeks, and there are very little chances of survival under 29 or 30 weeks for a pre maturate.
At 10 weeks (and I doubt most happen at 10 weeks), I'm not sure if it's still an embryon or if it's already a foetus, but that's definitely not a human being yet.
And, who gets abortions ? People who got condom or pill accidents, immature teenagers who made a "big mistake", and possibly raped girls. Who else ? None of those I listed are fully responsible for their pregnancy...
Of course I'm against forced abortions at 7 months like it happened in China recently (I saw the disgusting picture). That was paid by the governement... |
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