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Sky Doping/Hate Thread
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| solano |
Posted on 23-07-2012 07:33
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Stagiare
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Well, the UCI and WADA don't test for being an alien. 
Damn, new page.
Edited by solano on 23-07-2012 07:33
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| 9-Ball |
Posted on 23-07-2012 14:46
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Domestique
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Super-human-alien-dopers .... I believe there's something in the CIA handbook about these.
It was eleven more than necessary.
Jacques Anquetil
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| sutty68 |
Posted on 23-07-2012 19:04
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Tour de France Champion
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Latest pic of Chris Froome he he
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| issoisso |
Posted on 23-07-2012 22:56
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Tour de France Champion
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https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/othe...ds-newsxml
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 23-07-2012 23:06
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Nice article.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| kumazan |
Posted on 23-07-2012 23:12
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Team Leader
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It's good that we still have Kimmage to offer some insight beyond the "WOOOT OUR FELLOW *random nation* WON THE TOUR!!1" that plagues the media.
Well Kimmage and that Dane. Uhm. Yeah, Mike Jensen. 
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 23-07-2012 23:47
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Tour de France Champion
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Nice to see how this thread has some genuine debate in it
although that is balanced by an equal number of they are, they arnt, why, just cause, debates.
The fundamental facts of the matter are this;
The TDF Sky team look suspicious, as do all winners or over-performers in cycling.
There is no proof Sky have doped ,where proof is a failed test.
There is a lot of science to suggest they may have doped.
It is not only Sky that may have doped, but those that could stick with them, or beat them.
Also;
So what if people are using the "Armstrong" defense, it works for a while.
Everyone is biased to some extent.
Some nice jokes throughout the thread, well done
I hope this debate can roll on as more science is done, and test results are released.
My final point here;
Who wants Sky to be found doping? (Please answer this honestly)
Now think, why do i want them to be caught? what will that do to the sport?
Then re-think do i want them to be found doping.
There is more to this than did they or didn't they dope.
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 24-11-2024 13:53
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 23-07-2012 23:54
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I do not think that if let's say Nibbles was able to stick to lets say Maxime Monfort next year who has a great spike in climbing that implicates Nibbles at all. 
Your questions.
1. I want justice. I didn't wake up and say "I want Team Sky to dope." If they are which I do believe they are,, I want justice.
2. Getting rid of doping fromt the sport would definetley help it IMO.
3. Why? See #1
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| lluuiiggii |
Posted on 24-07-2012 00:11
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Grand Tour Champion
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"I’ve nothing to hide,’ Brailsford said. ‘There is nothing I won’t talk about."
Ah, so that's why they handled the journalists a list of acceptable questions (none of which included doping of course)
[Wiggins] "‘I’m not claiming the sport is out of the woods but doping in the sport is less of a worry to me personally, it’s less at the forefront of my mind, because I’m no longer getting beaten by people who then go on and test positive or whatever."
Yes, you're not getting beaten by those people, now you're beating them (Frank says hi, if he wants positives only)
Interesting article, if not quite comic
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| Neillster |
Posted on 24-07-2012 00:26
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Having followed this thread for a while now, I'm going to throw my hat into the ring.
Firstly, Sky have worked incredibly hard for this years Tour de France and this has really shown forth. Not that I'm saying other teams didn't, but as Jens Voigt has said in an interview with the BBC, "if you get an extra 1% in training, 1% in fitness, 1% in equipment, it all starts to add up." This is what Sky have been gearing up for ever since they were formed.
Also a win for Bradley isn't without presidence. He rode to a very solid 4th in 2009, and the main reason he won this time is all down to his brilliant team. Froome was phenomenal, as he was last year in Spain, Rogers and Porte have always been part of the elite of domestiques, with Knees and Boasson Hagen also very strong riders.
Finally, Sky have not just dominated this Tour, but this season. Bradley has been in great shape right the way through ever since winning Paris-Nice. Whilst he may not have had a chance to win last year, he could arguably have been very successful, with possibly even a top 5. This followed by a 3rd in Spain and now getting in my opinion his just deserts for all his hard work over a Tour course which suited him.
As for his competitors, none of them had ever shown any real form. Nibali disappointed at last year's Vuelta and despite his Tirreno-Adriatico victory has looked totally convincing, while Evans even less so.
So to all those that think that Wiggins has doped I say this: I do genuinely believe that it is all down to hard work and dedication. If he has doped throw the book at him, but please don't be too cynical. The last thing cycling needs is another champion to be torn down. 
Edited by Neillster on 24-07-2012 00:28
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| pcm2009fan |
Posted on 24-07-2012 00:34
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baseballlover312 wrote:
I do not think that if let's say Nibbles was able to stick to lets say Maxime Monfort next year who has a great spike in climbing that implicates Nibbles at all.
Okay but what if Monfort was to start churning out the atmospheric wattage counts that were being achieved Sky this year? If you're not assuming this then your point doesn't actually relate to the matter in hand.
If Wiggins'/Froome's figures point towards doping this year then Nibali's almost certainly do too. Unless of course we have a third "perfect being" to add to the list. |
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| Coop |
Posted on 24-07-2012 00:48
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I have no doubt that Sky worked incredibly hard for this victory. Hell, the team was founded with the bold statement that they wanted a British TDF winner within 5 years. Sadly it's their performance from the end of last year through the TDF this year that brings so much suspicion. They almost made it look too easy, almost robotic. No one has ever done what Brad did in winning what he has the way he has. Every race he won this year was done in the exact same manner. The black cloud of Sky setting a 420 watt pace up climbs so that nobody could attack and Brad crushing everybody in the TT. I give much credit to Brad for evolving into the rider that he has become in the last 3-4 years. Doping or not, he had to put in the training and the effort that most of us could never comprehend. But, we've all seen this story before, and from riders who've had a much better road pedigree than Brad, it doesn't end well. Performance with dominance in this fashion will bring much suspicion, and with history against them Sky has the responsibility to not only address all the questions, but prove their innocence to validate this win. JMHO! |
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| pcm2009fan |
Posted on 24-07-2012 00:51
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Neillster wrote:
Also a win for Bradley isn't without presidence. He rode to a very solid 4th in 2009, and the main reason he won this time is all down to his brilliant team. Froome was phenomenal, as he was last year in Spain, Rogers and Porte have always been part of the elite of domestiques, with Knees and Boasson Hagen also very strong riders.
Finally, Sky have not just dominated this Tour, but this season. Bradley has been in great shape right the way through ever since winning Paris-Nice.
I really hate to be the cynacist here but what has really stirred up the argument about Wiggo/Froome is that those prior excellent results did really come without (significant and relevant) presidence, although of course that isn't really a strong argument against them being doped by itself.
I've learned from this forum that, if we're interested, we can let the subsequent figures do the talking if we really want to dig deep. Although I think my avatar makes it fairly obvious I'm probably not so much one of the "interested" ones |
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 24-07-2012 00:56
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Nibbles is a great climber. He won the Vuelta and has grown. Wiggins came out of nowhere. So if a average climber dopes, he may only slightly exceed the ability of the already great ckimber, understand?
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| pcm2009fan |
Posted on 24-07-2012 00:57
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Well just seeing as I'm on a posting spree...
Coop wrote:
Sky has the responsibility to not only address all the questions, but prove their innocence to validate this win.
I agree with all else you say, but really?
Innocent till proven guilty doesn't prove anything, but turning it around makes even less sense (in interest of mental-wellbeing if nothing else!).
Besides, how on earth can they fully prove their innocence when even reliable figures can be heavily influenced and misjudged.
Edited by pcm2009fan on 24-07-2012 00:57
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| pcm2009fan |
Posted on 24-07-2012 01:02
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baseballlover312 wrote:
Nibbles is a great climber. He won the Vuelta and has grown. Wiggins came out of nowhere. So if a average climber dopes, he may only slightly exceed the ability of the already great ckimber, understand?
I'm meaning in a purely statistical sense. I'm saying only a doper can match an "enhanced" pace on a mountain (Nibali matching Froome's supposed pace, for example). Feel free to medically contradict me here cause I haven't done science since I was 13!
As for the point you are trying to make about a "bad" rider only able to match a "good" rider by using drugs, last time I checked:
baseballlover312 wrote:
Assumptions based on opinion mean nothing. |
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 24-07-2012 01:05
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That is not an assumption nor an opinion.
Bad = bad
good = good
Bad does not equal good.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| pcm2009fan |
Posted on 24-07-2012 01:12
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baseballlover312 wrote:
That is not an assumption nor an opinion.
Bad = bad
good = good
Bad does not equal good.
I'm afraid Good/bad is the most subjective word in the english language, so is naturally highly opinionative
In fairness the results themselves would give a little more objective grounding to your argument. But who are we to assume that Wiggins wasn't training and racing at only 50% of his maximum before, be it due to illness, mentality, diet etc.
I'm not disputing that his turn-around is nearing inexplicable measures. I'm more meaning in a broader sense that you can only really stake a claim on a rider's head when you can tell what his physical limits are (regardless of who he is racing against). And Wiggins statistics this tour certainly point more to doping than those of me on my evening cycle.
Edited by pcm2009fan on 24-07-2012 01:14
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 24-07-2012 02:05
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If someone is a better climber, they can naturally climb better.
And why Would Wiggins only go 50%? 
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| Coop |
Posted on 24-07-2012 03:16
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pcm2009fan wrote:
"I agree with all else you say, but really?
Innocent till proven guilty doesn't prove anything, but turning it around makes even less sense (in interest of mental-wellbeing if nothing else!).
Besides, how on earth can they fully prove their innocence when even reliable figures can be heavily influenced and misjudged."
Pro cycling is far from the criminal justice system. If you've followed it long enough you have to recognize that. SKY started transparent and open, but as performance improved they've become less transparent and open and even began associating with shady doctors. It may not be fair to SKY, but in the interest of "clean" cycling and the statement they made about having a clean winner within 5 years, they owe it to the their fans and distractors to put it all on the table and prove they did it the way they said they would, or there will be suspicion that they and their fans will just have to deal with. I mean, if they have nothing to hide, what do they have to lose? |
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![imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg](https://imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg)
