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TdF'13 Stage 13 - Tours to Saint-Amand-Montrond (July 12)
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| Pellizotti2 |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:05
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jonathangeek wrote:
Dont understand why people are in jizz mode over Porte and Quintana etc. ... I dont think they can beat Contador, Froome or Valverde yet, just wait till we know something, before saying: "Quintana and Porte can only beat Froome" ... Thats just my opinion
We do know for a fact that Contador is worse than ever, and that Quintana and Porte both climbed brilliantly on Saturday.
Nobody is saying that they're better than Froome, though.
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| Wilier |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:06
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issoisso wrote:
ruben wrote:
Mollema said after the race they were planning echelons anyway. And they heard Valverde was dropped when they were already riding. He also said Valverde shouldn't complain because he did exactly the same in the past. Obviously referring to Suisse 2011 when Movistar rode when Mollema flatted.
Old bills always get paid...
Try watching that stage. It was Leopard on the front, with....guess who...Andy Schleck.
But yeah, bills get paid. Belkin will suffer for this, bank on it
But I don't think Mollema was referring to Tour de Suisse, because that was indeed Leopard. I do vagely remember a similar situation with Caisse d'Epargne and Rabobank in opposite positions, but I can't put my finger on it where it was. Or Mollema refers to Valverde's doping use (in the past).
Edited by Wilier on 12-07-2013 17:08
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| Spilak23 |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:10
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Mollema might have been only a minute behind Froome had they conserved their energy by not attacking someone who had a flat tire.
A Saxo-Belkin combo would have put Froome multiple minutes behind.
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| Jacdk |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:11
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jonathangeek wrote:
Dont understand why people are in jizz mode over Porte and Quintana etc. ... I dont think they can beat Contador, Froome or Valverde yet, just wait till we know something, before saying: "Quintana and Porte can only beat Froome" ... Thats just my opinion
Quintana so far doesnt look like someone who can win a grand tour, yes he can drive in mountains but his TT and flat are about 60-70 if we talk PCM terms.
Porte, i cant believe anyone would consider him for a grandtour win, i think today and the TT showed that he isent more than a absolut brilliant backup, |
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:12
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Jacdk wrote:
jonathangeek wrote:
Dont understand why people are in jizz mode over Porte and Quintana etc. ... I dont think they can beat Contador, Froome or Valverde yet, just wait till we know something, before saying: "Quintana and Porte can only beat Froome" ... Thats just my opinion
Quintana so far doesnt look like someone who can win a grand tour, yes he can drive in mountains but his TT and flat are about 60-70 if we talk PCM terms.
Porte, i cant believe anyone would consider him for a grandtour win, i think today and the TT showed that he isent more than a absolut brilliant backup,
Quintana is a GT winner in the future though.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| Miguel98 |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:12
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Jacdk wrote:
jonathangeek wrote:
Dont understand why people are in jizz mode over Porte and Quintana etc. ... I dont think they can beat Contador, Froome or Valverde yet, just wait till we know something, before saying: "Quintana and Porte can only beat Froome" ... Thats just my opinion
Quintana so far doesnt look like someone who can win a grand tour, yes he can drive in mountains but his TT and flat are about 60-70 if we talk PCM terms.
Porte, i cant believe anyone would consider him for a grandtour win, i think today and the TT showed that he isent more than a absolut brilliant backup,
 I'm laughing at this right now. |
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| alexkr00 |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:16
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Wilier wrote:
issoisso wrote:
ruben wrote:
Mollema said after the race they were planning echelons anyway. And they heard Valverde was dropped when they were already riding. He also said Valverde shouldn't complain because he did exactly the same in the past. Obviously referring to Suisse 2011 when Movistar rode when Mollema flatted.
Old bills always get paid...
Try watching that stage. It was Leopard on the front, with....guess who...Andy Schleck.
But yeah, bills get paid. Belkin will suffer for this, bank on it
But I don't think Mollema was referring to Tour de Suisse, because that was indeed Leopard. I do vagely remember a similar situation with Caisse d'Epargne and Rabobank in opposite positions, but I can't put my finger on it where it was. Or Mollema refers to Valverde's doping use (in the past).
Maybe in 2008? I remember Menchov losing time due to a crash in the first week and Valverde had a pretty good opening week in 2008
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| Wilier |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:17
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Spilak23 wrote:
Mollema might have been only a minute behind Froome had they conserved their energy by not attacking someone who had a flat tire.
A Saxo-Belkin combo would have put Froome multiple minutes behind.
That would've been really convenient had they known that beforehand. 
And they weren't really attacking since they were already riding before that. They only stopped a short while during the feeding zone.
Edited by Wilier on 12-07-2013 17:19
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| valverde321 |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:19
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Wilier wrote:
issoisso wrote:
ruben wrote:
Mollema said after the race they were planning echelons anyway. And they heard Valverde was dropped when they were already riding. He also said Valverde shouldn't complain because he did exactly the same in the past. Obviously referring to Suisse 2011 when Movistar rode when Mollema flatted.
Old bills always get paid...
Try watching that stage. It was Leopard on the front, with....guess who...Andy Schleck.
But yeah, bills get paid. Belkin will suffer for this, bank on it
But I don't think Mollema was referring to Tour de Suisse, because that was indeed Leopard. I do vagely remember a similar situation with Caisse d'Epargne and Rabobank in opposite positions, but I can't put my finger on it where it was. Or Mollema refers to Valverde's doping use (in the past).
Which is probably pretty fucking hypocritical.
The part Im most upset about is that Valverde was 20 seconds down at one point. But then Belkin hit the front and now Valverde's Tour is completely ruined. Just once I wanted him to make the podium. Now thats probably never going to happen. This was his best chance, and thanks to a puncture at literally the worst time, and you can say it was unsporting by Belkin, but I guess its just something to expect in cycling these days.
The peloton probably wont even let him get in a break now, so he's basically fucked. I hope Movistar just put the hammer down later in the race and even if the yellow jersey falls they just keep riding, because thats apparently how this thing is played.
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| alexkr00 |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:20
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Spilak23 wrote:
Mollema might have been only a minute behind Froome had they conserved their energy by not attacking someone who had a flat tire.
A Saxo-Belkin combo would have put Froome multiple minutes behind.
Not really.
If they had waited for Valverde, there is a good chance that Kittel would have made it back as well. No reason for Quick-Step to go full gas then with no important name left behind. I doubt Saxo would have attacked with the entire pack together.
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| kimiopn |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:20
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Mwuhi wrote:
Belkin was already riding, so why should they stop riding? Because someone is going to wait half a minute for a wheel? That's just stupidty of Movistar.
I recorded the stage and i just watched it again.
- The gap to Kittel's group started with over 100 kms to go.
- The gap was 1'45 when Belkin went to the front with 100 km to go.
- With 98 km to go the gap was in 1'10.
- With 96 km to go the break was caught and the difference to Kittel group was 1 minute. No sign of Belkin riders at the front.
- With 88 km to go no Belkin rider at the front, just OPQS with Saxo behind and the gap in 1'10.
- With 87 km to go you see Rui Costa speaking to OPQS guys in front of the peloton and there was no Belkin rider in there. The image then shows Valverde stopped.
- The next image is of Boeckmans escaping with 85.5 km to go.
- Then with 83.9 km to go you see Belkin at the front.
Only one thing to say: LIARS!
Edited by kimiopn on 12-07-2013 17:22
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| Jacdk |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:20
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baseballlover312 wrote:
Quintana is a GT winner in the future though.
Yep, he certainly looks that way, he just need to improve his TT and his race on the flat. |
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| valverde321 |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:21
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Wilier wrote:
Spilak23 wrote:
Mollema might have been only a minute behind Froome had they conserved their energy by not attacking someone who had a flat tire.
A Saxo-Belkin combo would have put Froome multiple minutes behind.
That would've been really convenient had they known that beforehand.
And they weren't really attacking since they were already riding before that. They only stopped a short while during the feeding zone.
Theres a difference from having 1 or 2 guys on the front, and putting the whole team on the front though.
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| Spilak23 |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:23
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It wasn't even a puncture btw, somebody hit his wheel
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| Jacdk |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:23
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valverde321 wrote:
Which is probably pretty fucking hypocritical.
The part Im most upset about is that Valverde was 20 seconds down at one point. But then Belkin hit the front and now Valverde's Tour is completely ruined. Just once I wanted him to make the podium. Now thats probably never going to happen. This was his best chance, and thanks to a puncture at literally the worst time, and you can say it was unsporting by Belkin, but I guess its just something to expect in cycling these days.
The peloton probably wont even let him get in a break now, so he's basically fucked. I hope Movistar just put the hammer down later in the race and even if the yellow jersey falls they just keep riding, because thats apparently how this thing is played.
Did you completly forget Moviestars favor to Mollema and Belkin during 2011´s Tour de Suisse? yes its a smaller race, but when Moviestar back then attacked/went in front when Mollema had a defect, its clear that today might be payback for back then.
But its to bad for Valverde and i do feel sad for his tour, its pretty much over now and all he can go for is stage win, but at least we wont see a Moviestar driving like crazy like they did for Froome the other day. |
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| alexkr00 |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:24
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Spilak23 wrote:
It wasn't even a puncture btw, somebody hit his wheel
Plot-twist: It was a Belkin that hit his wheel 
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| Wilier |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:25
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valverde321 wrote:
Wilier wrote:
Spilak23 wrote:
Mollema might have been only a minute behind Froome had they conserved their energy by not attacking someone who had a flat tire.
A Saxo-Belkin combo would have put Froome multiple minutes behind.
That would've been really convenient had they known that beforehand.
And they weren't really attacking since they were already riding before that. They only stopped a short while during the feeding zone.
Theres a difference from having 1 or 2 guys on the front, and putting the whole team on the front though.
They probably got some motivation from hearing the news. I understand your reaction as you're a Valverde fan and I've been in the same situation. I think Valverde had it coming, because Belkin has never showed any sign of unsportmanship (besides the doping use, but everybody did that) before and I don't believe they would be that low.
Edited by Wilier on 12-07-2013 17:26
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| Jacdk |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:26
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Miguel98 wrote:
I'm laughing at this right now.
And your point being?
But laugh away i still say that if Porte wins a GT he is more doped than Contador, Froome and Armstrong put together. |
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| valverde321 |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:26
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Jacdk wrote:
valverde321 wrote:
Which is probably pretty fucking hypocritical.
The part Im most upset about is that Valverde was 20 seconds down at one point. But then Belkin hit the front and now Valverde's Tour is completely ruined. Just once I wanted him to make the podium. Now thats probably never going to happen. This was his best chance, and thanks to a puncture at literally the worst time, and you can say it was unsporting by Belkin, but I guess its just something to expect in cycling these days.
The peloton probably wont even let him get in a break now, so he's basically fucked. I hope Movistar just put the hammer down later in the race and even if the yellow jersey falls they just keep riding, because thats apparently how this thing is played.
Did you completly forget Moviestars favor to Mollema and Belkin during 2011´s Tour de Suisse? yes its a smaller race, but when Moviestar back then attacked/went in front when Mollema had a defect, its clear that today might be payback for back then.
But its to bad for Valverde and i do feel sad for his tour, its pretty much over now and all he can go for is stage win, but at least we wont see a Moviestar driving like crazy like they did for Froome the other day.
Mollema specified that Valverde shouldn't complain in his interview, according to the post above. Valverde wasn't riding in 2011.
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| Wilier |
Posted on 12-07-2013 17:29
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Is Valverde already interviewed by someone? I'd like to hear his thoughts on this. |
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