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Armstrong stops fighting doping charges - USADA wants him banned and stripped for titles
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| jseadog1 |
Posted on 04-09-2012 02:28
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Cordelier wrote:
Bookie wrote:
That's eloquently worded, but it basically means 'you can cheat'.
I don't agree. Cheating is wrong, making millions with cheating is criminal, continuously lying about it while playing the wronged hero is pathetic.
I'm sorry, I just don't see it as black-and-white as you do. Is cheating wrong? Sure it is... but only if you get caught. The risk of getting caught is just one of a thousand risks riders take, but without risk there is no reward.
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| CountArach |
Posted on 04-09-2012 05:12
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Cordelier wrote:
Bookie wrote:
That's eloquently worded, but it basically means 'you can cheat'.
I don't agree. Cheating is wrong, making millions with cheating is criminal, continuously lying about it while playing the wronged hero is pathetic.
I'm sorry, I just don't see it as black-and-white as you do. Is cheating wrong? Sure it is... but only if you get caught. The risk of getting caught is just one of a thousand risks riders take, but without risk there is no reward.
Cheating is cheating even if you don't get caught. Otherwise we would call it something different. I'm not even sure how to reply to your statement. It just makes no sense in any conventional system of logic.
Edited by CountArach on 04-09-2012 05:13
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| GreenEDGEFan |
Posted on 04-09-2012 05:14
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CountArach wrote:
cio93 wrote:
GreenEDGEFan wrote:
There is an absolute legend who is responding to all the fanboys on Lance's facebook account on his wall posts, take a look now.
May you help me out here? The only name I recognize is Michael Pye from one of the quadrillion "Your riders" stories.
Legend is Australian slang for really good person. So it won't be someone you recognise, just a random person who is replying.
Sorry about that 
Still it is interesting how people are denying it. The evidence has been built up over the last couple of weeks and it'll only be a short while, in my opinion, until Armstrong admits it. By short while some time in the next five years.
GreenEDGE 100%
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 04-09-2012 05:58
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I doubt he will ever admit, i just hope USADA will release the majority of evidence, to point the thruth to some people who still dont believe it, but who are not so stupid to deny against such an evidence. Then only the last group will remain denying it and these people cant be helped, they are lost in their blindness.
And saying doping is only bad when revealed? C'mon man, you cant be serious, the bad things happen and should be condemned even when you are not watching. 
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| Aquarius |
Posted on 04-09-2012 06:30
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Cordelier wrote:
The way I see it, doping is modifying the rider... just the same way a bike gets modified to take advantage of new technologies. Some modifications are legal, some are not. Some give an unfair advantage. Do we penalize a rider years down the road because he used an illegal chainstay? No - it either gets caught on the road, or the results stand.
You know doping tests are one step (if not much more) behind doping products, don't you ?
It took 10 years between the moment when EPO started being massively used in cycling and the first test. And that test was far from efficient when you compare it to nowadays tests (hence Armstrong's recent load of EPO positives, read the previous pages). |
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| solano |
Posted on 04-09-2012 08:33
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Cheating is wrong, however it is done, in any sport.
Is it OK to cheat on your wife, as long as you don't get caught? What about stealing? Is it only wrong if you get caught? |
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| Schleck96 |
Posted on 04-09-2012 13:42
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This thing that I saw from Cordelier made me do such a facepalm.... |
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| sutty68 |
Posted on 04-09-2012 13:46
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https://www.dailym...ds-newsxml
Wow, taking E.P.O whilst riding the Tour  |
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| lluuiiggii |
Posted on 04-09-2012 17:44
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'To Lance's way of thinking, doping is a fact of life, like oxygen or gravity,' Hamilton said of Armstrong, who last week dropped his challenge to doping allegations, losing his seven Tour de France titles.
This, exactly. When you have a guy that can't even compete in a triathlon event without doping, it's a guy who can't conceive the sport(s) without doping.
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 25-11-2024 22:47
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| sutty68 |
Posted on 04-09-2012 18:06
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lluuiiggii, That is so true, but the sad thing is, is that there are a lot more dopers out there who haven't been caught yet and are still getting away with it  |
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| cactus-jack |
Posted on 04-09-2012 18:09
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sutty68 wrote:
lluuiiggii, That is so true, but the sad thing is, is that there are a lot more dopers out there who haven't been caught yet and are still getting away with it
Which is the exact reason why I think it's incredibly important to get people like Armstrong, even though they've retired a long time ago. Even though we might not be able to catch everyone while they are competitve, they should have to live woth the fear that one day they might be caught and everything will be exposed.
There's a fine line between "psychotherapist" and "psycho the rapist"
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| Ian Butler |
Posted on 04-09-2012 18:14
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First I thought that the UCI had to make races less exhausting and long in order to stop doping (let's be serious, who the hell can ride 21days of climbing and dying with only 2 rest days?), but then I thought they'd just keep on doping and the avg m/h would just be extremely high |
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| ianrussell |
Posted on 05-09-2012 00:14
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Found this an interesting reflection on the USADA case (not calling it the Armstrong case as more importantly it relates to those more involved in cycling today) https://www.sportsscientists.com/2012/...s-and.html
Having said that does anyone have a good link to read up on what makes someone a screwed up, control freak, power crazed, bully? Dysfunctional family only explains so much and while the first few comments after the linked article are illuminating I don't even know much about that...
Edited by ianrussell on 05-09-2012 00:21
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| ianrussell |
Posted on 05-09-2012 00:50
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jack888 wrote:
Not sure if it's been posted yet. But this was written by Lance's former assistant.
https://www.outsid...=167790055
I was Lance’s personal assistant for two years, during the height of his racing career. Do I think he cheated? Yep. But my real problem is something that diehard fans seem unable to grasp: the vengeful tactics he uses against people who tell the truth about him, on and off the bike.
Thanks for that, interesting read  |
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| Bosskardo |
Posted on 05-09-2012 07:12
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My opinions on this are (you don't have to like them but don't go crazy if you don't agree):
Did Lance dope? yes
Did everyone else? not everyone but I guess about half in Tour but in different amounts
Should Lance be banned? don't care but he should be punished somehow, most dopers who won sth also got some type of suspension
Should he lose his wins? Not really. But he should get some sort of punishment.
Is Lance an awful person? It depends if good and evil cancel itself out. His charity and stuff is really important and necessery. Same time, he's a vengeful man, he ruined a lot of lives only because he didn't want to come clean.
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| ianrussell |
Posted on 05-09-2012 09:35
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Don't claim to know him personally but imho some form of repentance and a change of ways is a bit of a missing ingredient for redemption. Each to their own but for me no amount of good deeds gives anyone the right to (allegedly) act despicably throughout the rest of their life |
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| CountArach |
Posted on 05-09-2012 13:42
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I went to see the comedian Bill Bailey tonight. He was amazing. Anyway he opened with this (roughly):
"I actually had a sporting success of my own recently. I won the Tour de France from a few year ago. I was on a joy ride in France and I was the person in the country on a bike with the least drugs in my system. I swear the riders in those days were just pumped full of drugs. Their bikes were just made of cocaine and they rode them around licking them. They used blowdarts to shoot panda blood into their thighs."
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| sutty68 |
Posted on 05-09-2012 14:15
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CountArach wrote:
I went to see the comedian Bill Bailey tonight. He was amazing. Anyway he opened with this (roughly):
"I actually had a sporting success of my own recently. I won the Tour de France from a few year ago. I was on a joy ride in France and I was the person in the country on a bike with the least drugs in my system. I swear the riders in those days were just pumped full of drugs. Their bikes were just made of cocaine and they rode them around licking them. They used blowdarts to shoot panda blood into their thighs."
Ha ha very good  |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 05-09-2012 19:55
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CountArach wrote:
I went to see the comedian Bill Bailey tonight. He was amazing. Anyway he opened with this (roughly):
"I actually had a sporting success of my own recently. I won the Tour de France from a few year ago. I was on a joy ride in France and I was the person in the country on a bike with the least drugs in my system. I swear the riders in those days were just pumped full of drugs. Their bikes were just made of cocaine and they rode them around licking them. They used blowdarts to shoot panda blood into their thighs."
The bikes made of cocaine have actually happened. That's how some colombian pros smuggled coke into europe in the early 80s.
(EDIT: To make it clearer, the FRAME was made of moulded cocaine plaster)
Then again, knowing what Bill Bailey's like he probably is fully aware of that and had fun working it into the bit
Edited by issoisso on 05-09-2012 19:56
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| Bookie |
Posted on 06-09-2012 10:49
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Museeuw now confesses to having used doping, saying it was common practice and every rider knew every other rider did the same. He calls on colleagues to come clean as well. |
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