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2012 DB: Stat Discussions
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| alexanderlens |
Posted on 11-03-2012 07:43
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ShortsNL wrote:
His current stat level 74 is far too low. For my Vacansoleil Carreer, I gave him 76 in MO and TT. If you want to know the reason for his 76 TT, look at stage 20 of that year's tour.
It is said many times, but here is it again:
you may not judge a rider on one stage!
and about Gesink: He's clearly the best rider ever!
But without kidding: Kreuziger didn't showed anything last year, and his stats are not low...
About De Gendt: I think 75 for the Mo would be fair.
Guess who's back? 
Lets see how many friens are still around... |
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| ShortsNL |
Posted on 11-03-2012 11:05
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alexanderlens wrote:
[It is said many times, but here is it again:
you may not judge a rider on one stage!
True, but in this case it's two consecutive stages. And not just any stage, but the last week of the TdF. You can assume that every favourite is peaking its form then and De Gendt beat half of them on both stages. As such you can rule out overall form as a factor (unlike P-N, where some favourites might just be at the start of their season).
You still call it luck or just 'feeling good' those days, but even if de Gendt had a theoretical +5 and everyone else had a -5 on two days in a row, he'd be nowhere near a top 6 in either race, if he really had 74/74 for TT/MO.
Not only did he beat half of the favourites list during the last week of the TdF, where everyone was already peaking their form, he did so twice on consecutive days, in seperate disciplines.
If you look at the riders he beat during the TDF stages and their stats, and assume that De Gendt is slightly worse than them, it would be more appropriate to give him 76/76 at least. |
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| alexanderlens |
Posted on 11-03-2012 11:16
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Got that, but if you make him as good as Velits, it seems unlogical that Velits ever came in third in the vuelta. And beside that, in the PCM 2009 stats discussion there is a discussion about Ferdigo. Nearly the same, exept the GT part. Conclussion: If you make the stats of de Gendt higher, you should change the stats of some other riders too.
p.s. Gesink is still the best
p.p.s. Post 900
Guess who's back?
Lets see how many friens are still around... |
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| Pellizotti2 |
Posted on 11-03-2012 11:22
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And you're also forgetting another important factor, ShortsNL.
De Gendt had stored lots of energy throughout the race by taking it easy after his crash on the opening stage. Because of that, he was still very fresh towards the end of the Tour, unlike the GC contenders, who day after day had to use up a lot of energy to stay in contention.
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| fcancellara |
Posted on 11-03-2012 11:28
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Yes, this is judging on one stage: Peter Sagan's Endurance should be higher because of his performance in the long stage in the Tirreno yesterday. I suggest you change it from 73 to 76 (same as Nibali), because with 73 he wouldn't win a stage like that.
Edited by fcancellara on 11-03-2012 11:29
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| Wiley |
Posted on 11-03-2012 11:44
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Domestique
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just a few wordr any future changes...
Gilbert 84hl i think is wrong, he was so dominant that i think he should be 85hl. Ever career ive ever played he is 85 by ardennes so why not start him there.
Can we stop having 70-75sp with less than 70fl, cause thats just not realistic.
Millars age if decline is too soon, he is no worse than he was in 2010 and doesnt show signs of stopping. Actually this goes for several riders eg. Voeckler, Hincapie, Grabsch to name a few.
How does Rathe have 74/74sp/acc? He hasnt won that many stages...
I keep seeing things about Valverde, how hes just as good as he was, than a comeback saying that stats are based on recent results. Then surly all banned riders stats should all be 50... No, they should be 3-4lower than when they left, as a minimum, because they havnt been racing and hence its impossible to tell how good they are.
Ferrari-BA > Psuedo Man Game
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| Roman |
Posted on 11-03-2012 13:54
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alexanderlens wrote:
But without kidding: Kreuziger didn't showed anything last year, and his stats are not low...
4th place in Liege Bastogne Liege and 6th overall in the Giro was nothing? Then he broke his arm in Tour de France.. He definetely deserves stats he has, only his TT and especially PRL should be lower. And maybe he should have a little bit higher DH attribute as well.
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| ShortsNL |
Posted on 11-03-2012 23:57
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Pellizotti2 wrote:
And you're also forgetting another important factor, ShortsNL.
De Gendt had stored lots of energy throughout the race by taking it easy after his crash on the opening stage. Because of that, he was still very fresh towards the end of the Tour, unlike the GC contenders, who day after day had to use up a lot of energy to stay in contention.
This is a very good point you are making. It sounds like something that should be solved through Recuperation. |
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 12-03-2012 12:01
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alexanderlens wrote:
But without kidding: Kreuziger didn't showed anything last year, and his stats are not low...
You gave me a very good laugh, he was 6th (and white jersey) at the brutal Giro, 4th at L-B-L before broking his hand at Tour first-week, which pretty ended his season soon. He is top stage racer, just had unlucky injury, now he is starting to prove it again in Italy. So it would be nonsense to lower his stats meanwhile
Edit: Just saw Roman's post, it looks like we have similar oppinion
Edited by Avin Wargunnson on 12-03-2012 12:03
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 26-11-2024 05:20
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| kissaha |
Posted on 01-04-2012 20:42
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Any suggestions for preliminary cobble-stat changes? |
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| sam1196 |
Posted on 01-04-2012 20:54
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Just make Boonen equal to Fabian,
Pozzato up, Vanmarcke up and Sagan up.
Gilbert down, Hagen up.
Just to name a few.
VINO VINO VINO VINO VINO VINO VINO VINO VINO
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| kissaha |
Posted on 01-04-2012 20:58
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What about Amador(44th) and Kristoff(15th)? Both finished 38 seconds behind Boonen. And Vincent Jerome, who tried a late breakaway? |
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| Wiley |
Posted on 01-04-2012 21:01
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Domestique
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Personally i would say boonen more cb than fabian, based on results. Fabian is strong, unlucky, but producing the results. I would also up Pozzato's HL 1-2 as he looked very strong on those final climbs
Ferrari-BA > Psuedo Man Game
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| Pellizotti2 |
Posted on 01-04-2012 21:13
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Jérôme surely deserves a bit higher. He's been strong in all the cobbled classics so far.
Also, 50-something seems a bit unfair to Gatto.
Lastly, I'd up Terpstra one or two points.
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| kissaha |
Posted on 01-04-2012 21:14
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Amador has 50. And what does Voeckler deserve, 73-74? |
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| lluuiiggii |
Posted on 01-04-2012 21:17
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Wiley wrote:
Personally i would say boonen more cb than fabian, based on results. Fabian is strong, unlucky, but producing the results. I would also up Pozzato's HL 1-2 as he looked very strong on those final climbs
What results? Both GW and E3 finished in mass sprints, and Cancellara crashed out of today's race.
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| Alakagom |
Posted on 01-04-2012 21:19
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After Paris Roubiax we'll have the first stats 'selection' so keep those suggestions coming
Mind that Ronde was a hilly/cobble race while Paris Roubaix will show us the true cobblers. With E3 and Gent finishing in sprints in Roubaix that will decide most of the stats. Although few won't do it such as Sagan but I have their stats ready. Sagan's cobble will be either 76/77. I am swaying towards 77
Edited by Alakagom on 01-04-2012 21:20
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| sam1196 |
Posted on 01-04-2012 21:23
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Gallopin showed really big things, COB 74?
And OPQS should all go up with a point, Trentin even COB 71/72?
VINO VINO VINO VINO VINO VINO VINO VINO VINO
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| kissaha |
Posted on 01-04-2012 21:33
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Alakagom wrote:
After Paris Roubiax we'll have the first stats 'selection' so keep those suggestions coming
Mind that Ronde was a hilly/cobble race while Paris Roubaix will show us the true cobblers. With E3 and Gent finishing in sprints in Roubaix that will decide most of the stats. Although few won't do it such as Sagan but I have their stats ready. Sagan's cobble will be either 76/77. I am swaying towards 77
My experience in PCM is that the hill stat almost doesn't matter in RvV, as long as it isn't in the low 60s. You have to base the stats as to how it plays out in PCM, not what directly reflects real-life. So you have to balance the, so that the ones who do well in RvV, but not in P-R, gets medium good cobble stats. And I think that the cobble stats should generally be higher, as the time gaps are much lower IRL, than what you see in PCM, at least in RvV. |
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| lluuiiggii |
Posted on 01-04-2012 21:35
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kissaha wrote:
And I think that the cobble stats should generally be higher, as the time gaps are much lower IRL, than what you see in PCM, at least in RvV.
The game has a 1:10 scale, time gaps can't be perfect.
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