@Alakagom
If it's useful for you, the potential lowering seems to work quite good.
A lot less guys have stat limits at 84/85 now, in my game
Edit: Though sometimes, they develop a little bit, despite their potential lowered. Still, I feel like it's better like this...
Edited by Jesleyh on 25-04-2013 20:26
Put a bit of effort into the CT teams.
My own DB input(BeNeLux riders) which I sent to Alak, and the few other guys I named in this thread, not included.
I might repeat a few guys who are named earlier in the thread, sorry for that...
Some guys that should be higher
I concentrated on the guys that should be worse, but here are a few guys that should maybe be higher.
Martinez(La Pomme)
B. Sulzberger(Drapac)
S. Campagnaro(Nippo)
Pedraza(EPM)(Just slightly)
H. Elizadeh(A&V)
L. Desriac(RLM)
J. Duval(RLM)
Haga(Optum)(Slightly)
M.Razumov(Itera-Katusha)
Acevedo(Jamis)
That's about it for now
Feel free to discuss it with me, I make mistakes as well Edited by Jesleyh on 27-04-2013 13:24
JJ Haedo top 5'd 3 TdF sprints so don't think he should be much lower. Atleast wait till AtoC cause he hasn't raced anything yet this season except of San Luis.
@TMM So you don't agree with the other ups?
Seriously, some of those guys have about AVG 62 & (about) 100 cq points.
I can put some prove for some guys you hestitate about(preferable for the ones that should be upped(or dropped) a lot(so not slightly/not that much, which is obviously the same in my books )
Proving it with results for every Cyclist above is just too much, but for guys you don't agree with me, I can prove it with CQ ranking/Cyclingarchieves results, which I both used to compile this list
Also, as said I paid more attention to the guys that should get dropped, but afterwards I decided to go through a lot of CT teams to spot guys that had a bit kf their breakthrough(sometimes their 2nd one) in 2012-2013.
@Spilak I admit, Haedo was really hard for me.
But he's getting older, and there is a reason to go to CT I think.
And with that 76 SP, he would be winning every flat CT race there is, and that seems unrealistic etc.
74/75 SP would be enough for him, I think. But it was hard for me...
admirschleck wrote:
I know we have to wait until Giro,but man,you just saw Gesink. I don't have to explain anything. Just look at todays result from Tour of Romandie.
Wait until the Giro.
Although I agree, he was awful. Basso as well though.
@TMM So you don't agree with the other ups?
Seriously, some of those guys have about AVG 62 & (about) 100 cq points.
I can put some prove for some guys you hestitate about(preferable for the ones that should be upped(or dropped) a lot(so not slightly/not that much, which is obviously the same in my books )
Proving it with results for every Cyclist above is just too much, but for guys you don't agree with me, I can prove it with CQ ranking/Cyclingarchieves results, which I both used to compile this list
Also, as said I paid more attention to the guys that should get dropped, but afterwards I decided to go through a lot of CT teams to spot guys that had a bit kf their breakthrough(sometimes their 2nd one) in 2012-2013.
I just went and checked all Up riders results.
Only 1 rider (that i can remember as i write) has 100 points, and that is Martinez, and yes he does need a bit of a TT boost
Only 2-3 riders had a win and only 1 (Duval) had consistent Top10 results (and again i would of said he needed a boost anyway)
At least it were 2, Sulzberger also. But when I said 100, I just meant a lot more than others with the same AVG. So 60 is also fine, if it's an AVG < 68 f.e.
There are a lot of guys with a very low AVG, who indeed didn't get consistent Top 10 results, but did get a few, and FOR EXAMPLE() now have about 61 AVG and definitely deserve AVG 64 with their results. 64 AVG doesn't necassarily mran that they should get a win. Neither that the rider should get a load of Top 10's.
Anyway, as said, I concentrated on the downs, and were a bit 'quicker' on the ups.
Give me some names you don't agree about, and I 'prove' that I was right
And yes, I admit, I might be wrong on some of them, I'm not really an expert on CT, only Dutch and also a bit Belgian teams/riders
Blueprint wrote:
With Andy Schleck, things are fairly simple: it's impossible to predict his stats at the moment, so anything goes for the Daily DB and people can tweak them the way they see fit. It's nothing more than guess work at the moment.
Gesink should just have 78 on climbing and he'll be fine.
My personal top stats on MO:
82 Contador, Froome
81 Nibali, Rodriguez
80 Wiggins, Van den Broeck, Valverde
79 Hesjedal, Quintana, A. Schleck(?)
78 Gesink, Pinot, S. Sanchez, Porte, Henao etc...
I think Purito deserve same MO stat like AC and Froome.
I think Nibali can't drop Valverde in a mountain.Nor Quintana.
Henao is a better climber than Gesink,Samu and Porte and at the same level as VDB.
Also Hesjedal,Pinot are at the same level with VDB.
I think the more correct stats are:
Contador,Purito,Froome 82
Nibali,Valverde 81
Quintana(with 8 potential),Wiggins,Hesjedal,VDB,Henao,Pinot 80 with Wiggo,VDB and Hesjedal with higher secondary stats.
Gesink,Evans,Samy,Scarponi,Porte at the same level.
In Hill I think Gilbert,Sagan,Purito,Valverde should have 81.Riders like Martin,Henao,Betancur with 1 point lower.In the last 2 years the Ardenees classics was very unpredictible.
You tend to overrate the Colombians here.
Henao shouldn't get 80 Mountain at all, not even 79, and Betancur and Henao shouldn't get 80 hill, both 78 IMO.
Nobody needs 81 hill, 80 hill is enough for guys like Rodriguez, Gilbert, since as you say, the Ardennes were very open.
Quintana would be enough at 78/79 MO. Never ever 8 potential! He would end up with 85 MO/84 HI/81 TT or something like that
Jesleyh wrote:
You tend to overrate the Colombians here.
Henao shouldn't get 80 Mountain at all, not even 79, and Betancur and Henao shouldn't get 80 hill, both 78 IMO.
Nobody needs 81 hill, 80 hill is enough for guys like Rodriguez, Gilbert, since as you say, the Ardennes were very open. Quintana would be enough at 78/79 MO. Never ever 8 potential! He would end up with 85 MO/84 HI/81 TT or something like that
I know is a risky bet but I think Quintana in 2 years will beat Froome in TdF.
Henao will be like Froome in last yeard TdF.Will be better in mountains than Wiggins.Everyone will suffer in his wheel.
I think in hills the stats should be:
Gilbert,Purito,Valverde,Sagan equal
A couple of riders like Martin,Betancur,Henao,Moreno,Gerrans,Nibali,Gasparotto 1 point lower.
@Jesl
Firstly never ever work of AVG! For example look at Kwiatkowski in my story (cheap plug as always ) or any TT'er. Again AVG is never representative at CT level, where the races are smaller, shorter and not as hard (mostly). Here riders don't need high support stats and thus AVG is decreased.
Jesleyh wrote: Some guys that should be higher
I concentrated on the guys that should be worse, but here are a few guys that should maybe be higher.
Martinez(La Pomme)
B. Sulzberger(Drapac)
S. Campagnaro(Nippo)
Pedraza(EPM)(Just slightly)
H. Elizadeh(A&V)
L. Desriac(RLM)
J. Duval(RLM)
Haga(Optum)(Slightly)
M.Razumov(Itera-Katusha)
Acevedo(Jamis)
Feel free to discuss it with me, I make mistakes as well
Yannick Martinez i agree does need a TT boost, but this won't make big differences to AVG (see point above)
Sulzberger maybe needs an FL boost, but he's about right (its those around him that are too high, see my UK recommendations)
Campagnaro has 2 results (CQ rank currently down for some reason, so having to use Archives), neither of which stand out
Pedraza could take an MO boost of 1-2... maybe
Elizadeh, no idea who you meant at all there as apparently no-one with that name exists in cycling
Desriac, small TT boost i guess, but give him good potential (6-7)
Duval does need a boost in SP, ACC, FL
Haga pretty much perfect i think
Razumov is fine
Acevedo equally is fine
Jesleyh wrote:
You tend to overrate the Colombians here.
Henao shouldn't get 80 Mountain at all, not even 79, and Betancur and Henao shouldn't get 80 hill, both 78 IMO.
Nobody needs 81 hill, 80 hill is enough for guys like Rodriguez, Gilbert, since as you say, the Ardennes were very open. Quintana would be enough at 78/79 MO. Never ever 8 potential! He would end up with 85 MO/84 HI/81 TT or something like that
I know is a risky bet but I think Quintana in 2 years will beat Froome in TdF.
Henao will be like Froome in last yeard TdF.Will be better in mountains than Wiggins.Everyone will suffer in his wheel.
I think in hills the stats should be:
Gilbert,Purito,Valverde,Sagan equal
A couple of riders like Martin,Betancur,Henao,Moreno,Gerrans,Nibali,Gasparotto 1 point lower.
I wouldn't give Sagan the same high hill stat as Rodriquez or Gilbert, that would imply he would destroy everyone when attacking on a hill, which I don't think he has done, like Purrito.
I think the reason he gets such high results in hilly races (pcm wise) is due to much higher Flat, Stamina, Possibly Resistance, Sprint (when flat finish) stats compared to the opposition, meaning he has much more left in the tank when approaching the final.
Alizadeh indeed, typo...
Won Quinhai Lake, should at least get a hill boost.
Campagnaro
If you look at those 2 results, and look at the field that was there, he needs a boost, he's quite useless now in PCM.
And don't forget to look at 2012 results too(although in this case, they weren't thát great)
Sulzberger
Impressive amount of CQ points, but I agree, I compared him with his team mates as well, if they all should be lower, then you're right on him.
Razumov
GP of Sochi results(2nd in GC and took multiple wins), and the ZLM Tour 2012 results, quite a big U23 race, prove that he should get higher.
I agree, it aren't a lot of results, but Razumov has 61 AVG! And the guys he beat every time are about 67 AVG(some bit lower, and f.e. Janorschke & Buts 69-70 AVG.
I can't see that you don't rate him as f.e. a 65 SP guy(instead of his current 60)
Acevedo
Deserves a small boost, climbed with the best in San Luis, and was good at Vuelta Colombia as well(although I can see if the latter one doesn't really impress you)
Haga
Only a few hill points would sufficise.
He's better in hills than climbing anyway, so switching those 2 skills(67 & 64) would do fine too
Edit: Come on TMM, respond! Edited by Jesleyh on 28-04-2013 18:14
I dont know if TT (70) for Thibaut Pinot is to high or TT for Carlos Alberto Betancur (65) is too low. In the only TT whereat Tour de Romandie and Vuelta Ciclista al Pais Vasco but I think we should only compare them in Romandie since Pinot wasnt in form in Vuelta Ciclista al Pais Vasco.
Tour de Romandie Stage 5 (ITT): Genève › Genève 18.6 km
Comparing only 2 guys can be unreliable sometimes. Especially if only 1/2 TTs. Problem is that form, main targets etc vary sometimes.
I think you can't lower Pinot's TT.
I think I read somewhere that climbers with a lower TT than 70 won't go for the GC, but for stage wins or KoM jerseys. That's why Schleck's TT is 70 as well, I think.
Not sure if this applies for PCM 12 though, others will know better
But yeah, Betancur should maybe get a small TT boost...
Edited by Jesleyh on 28-04-2013 14:35
Jesleyh wrote:
Comparing only 2 guys can be unreliable sometimes. Especially if only 1/2 TTs. Problem is that form, main targets etc vary sometimes.
I think you can't lower Pinot's TT.
I read somewhere that climbers with a lower TT than 70 won't go for the GC, but for stage wins or KoM jerseys. That's why Schleck's TT is 70 as well, I think.
But yeah, Betancur maybe get a small TT boost...
Then J-Rods in trouble.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy
![imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg](https://imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg)
) now have about 61 AVG and definitely deserve AVG 64 with their results. 64 AVG doesn't necassarily mran that they should get a win. Neither that the rider should get a load of Top 10's.
