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News in Febuary
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| roturn |
Posted on 16-02-2016 14:20
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Coquard crashed in training and is in hospital. Further tests are required but it looks pretty serious.
https://www.teamdi...t-energie/ |
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| deek12345 |
Posted on 16-02-2016 14:27
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TheManxMissile wrote:
I like ths talk about what might or might no happen with Contador. Meanwhile David Millar (yes him of noted doping in the early 00's) has got himself a great role with the British Cycling Academy. And neigh a word is said
Lol yeah Dave the Saint Millar ,great role model there |
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| sutty68 |
Posted on 16-02-2016 14:27
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Bad news for him, i hope he makes a good recovery. |
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 16-02-2016 14:33
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deek12345 wrote:
TheManxMissile wrote:
I like ths talk about what might or might no happen with Contador. Meanwhile David Millar (yes him of noted doping in the early 00's) has got himself a great role with the British Cycling Academy. And neigh a word is said
Lol yeah Dave the Saint Millar ,great role model there
I'd certainly have him than 99% of other convicted dopers. His openess on the subject is a great warning for young cyclists. His experiences in that area will most certainly be beneficial to young cyclists, especially when added to the rest of the surrounding culture the BCA is trying to create. And then of course there's his years of road experience on top of that.
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 16-02-2016 14:40
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TheManxMissile wrote:
deek12345 wrote:
TheManxMissile wrote:
I like ths talk about what might or might no happen with Contador. Meanwhile David Millar (yes him of noted doping in the early 00's) has got himself a great role with the British Cycling Academy. And neigh a word is said
Lol yeah Dave the Saint Millar ,great role model there
I'd certainly have him than 99% of other convicted dopers. His openess on the subject is a great warning for young cyclists. His experiences in that area will most certainly be beneficial to young cyclists, especially when added to the rest of the surrounding culture the BCA is trying to create. And then of course there's his years of road experience on top of that.
Agreed. Both he and British Cycling have said there isn't a better person to warn young riders of the dangers of doping. At least he held his hands up and admitted he had made a mistake and deserved to be punished instead of continually denying any wrong doing despite being banned for 2 years. |
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| Shonak |
Posted on 16-02-2016 15:35
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Tour de France Champion
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cunego59 wrote:
Shonak wrote:
He has also build his career on tough training, hard sacrifice, most notably unique panache and exciting racing and by being the best for a very long time. By being kind in races - helping old teammates, granting stage wins, and showing virtue within the peloton. By being a sportsman and being a fighter. There are also lessons about what to do and about what not to do, maybe this is worth a cent too from a past banned rider, not just from angelic, "pure" riders.
These are values that ought to be taught young cyclists too.
You have said numerous times that you consider cheating a widespread problem within the peloton, in fact I think you even said that you consider most of them in the pro peloton to be dirty: so how can you fault him that much for cheating when the pros do it regardless and it's needed to contest on the same field.
I think those are the most wide-spread and most repeated arguments to exculpate dopers. And while there's some theoretical merit to them, it's also a carte blanche to every young rider contemplating whether or not to do doping. On what grounds can you tell that young rider not to do it, if you acknowledge that you cannot really fault someone like Contador that much for doing it?
Fair point, however I actually do fault Contador for it as I do fault other doped riders and I like to see harsher punishments. I also like to believe that there's more to the sport than doping, seeing the bolded, highlighted part of my post.
Thus, at no point I want to hand out possible excuses for anybody. Each and every young and old rider has of course hold himself responsible in face of anti-doping laws. My later statement was made in regards to strydz' personal perspective, building upon the narrative of an entirely doped-up peloton - if one shares this view and it's true, than there's little to no chance for this infested sport anyway.
I also always considered the system-excuse a rather dull one since each rider should be held responsible for his actions and the blabla bullshit-mantra of the likes of Ullrich and Armstrong "everybody doped" does not make them any less guilty at cheating and doping. It just makes them whinier.
Again, I do hold Contador responsible for his actions and he has paid with his ban for it as should every other rider who is doping. I like doped riders like Contador, Valv etc because I like their riding style, their espirt, success, panache. I also prefer to see someone trying to build up a team rather than someone trying to dismentle the sport I love by cashing in on a book.
So, one can also love his girlfriend even if she has flaws, so I like my favourite riders despite their doping flaws, and I like to think that they can teach the youth more than to stick the needle in the right arm.
Numerous riders of the past are involved still in cycling - Vino, Rijs, Aldag are just the tip of the iceberg -- the whole sport is made up of old riders, many from the epo-era who have not faced trial, still giving their knowledge to younger ones. They know best how races and cycling work- and true, they may also have good contacts to doping doctors, practices, but in that case, Contador is just another screw in the engine of a sport that has a long-lasting doping problem, which is here to stay regardless of a spanish youth development team or not.
Shonak wrote:
The implication that Contador would urge young riders to dope is based surely upon experience of older riders like Vino or Rijs who have done well to undermine and discredit the image of the "cyclist turned manager", however I consider neither Wiggins nor Contador to be of such a nature that they put the needle to their young riders figuritavely speaking. Either way, young riders are responsible for their actions just as Contador is for his. Again, I do not support his past doping however he has been banned for that and stripped of his wins and faced the just penalty and possibly learned his lesson, and that's that. Young riders can learn from that too.
There's nothing to say against him passing on his experiences, good and bad, to young cyclists. I'm sure he has a lot of positive virtues to pass on. It's a whole different thing to give him such a prominent and official position in the professional cycling organisation, though. Once again, it's a terrible sign to young riders imo. And of course he has done his time with his bans, and he has a chance to redeem himself, but not in that high of a position, if it were up to me. That would be a lesson for everyone else to learn as well, by the way.
But when you have a team it comes at a price. Investing and financing a cycling team isn't so expensive as a football team but it's far from being cheap.
I've said before: given the current economic situation in Spain, there's little financial backing for spanish cycling teams. Thus a big name like Contador's is needed to secure a long-term interest and investment. Every young rider is free to say No to Contador's team and instead choose another path, another team, another sport. It's only natural that if Contador secures financing, he is the man behind the team, he has an official meaningful position. I reckon the investor/company would be upset if it wasn't the case.
So I guess it's for some the same as to sleep with the devil but seeing the magnitute and importance of Contador in the sport, I'd be disappointed if he wouldn't want to give something back to cycling, improve things for spanish youngster too.
I also don't know if being your own boss at a rather small development team is really a high position. It were something different if spanish cycling foundation recruited him in a high official position tho, then we could talk about the moral standground but this is purely private interest and so far I don't see the implicated social costs outweighing the necessity of a broader infrastructure for spanish talents.
Edited by Shonak on 16-02-2016 16:14
"It’s a little bit scary when Contador attacks." - Tommy V
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| Spilak23 |
Posted on 16-02-2016 16:10
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Team Leader
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TheManxMissile wrote:
deek12345 wrote:
TheManxMissile wrote:
I like ths talk about what might or might no happen with Contador. Meanwhile David Millar (yes him of noted doping in the early 00's) has got himself a great role with the British Cycling Academy. And neigh a word is said
Lol yeah Dave the Saint Millar ,great role model there
I'd certainly have him than 99% of other convicted dopers. His openess on the subject is a great warning for young cyclists. His experiences in that area will most certainly be beneficial to young cyclists, especially when added to the rest of the surrounding culture the BCA is trying to create. And then of course there's his years of road experience on top of that.
His 'openess' is complete bullshit. A PR creation. Nothing but an act
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| Forever the Best |
Posted on 16-02-2016 16:12
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Classics Specialist
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ringo182 wrote:
TheManxMissile wrote:
deek12345 wrote:
TheManxMissile wrote:
I like ths talk about what might or might no happen with Contador. Meanwhile David Millar (yes him of noted doping in the early 00's) has got himself a great role with the British Cycling Academy. And neigh a word is said
Lol yeah Dave the Saint Millar ,great role model there
I'd certainly have him than 99% of other convicted dopers. His openess on the subject is a great warning for young cyclists. His experiences in that area will most certainly be beneficial to young cyclists, especially when added to the rest of the surrounding culture the BCA is trying to create. And then of course there's his years of road experience on top of that.
Agreed. Both he and British Cycling have said there isn't a better person to warn young riders of the dangers of doping. At least he held his hands up and admitted he had made a mistake and deserved to be punished instead of continually denying any wrong doing despite being banned for 2 years.
Millar denied for months before all the evidence came and had no choice but to confess.Before it he denied everything.
Bernard Kohl has done more for anti-doping than Millar.
Millar is an upholder of omerta.
What has Millar actually done to help anti-doping?
I am using a few bits of a post of a user named Libertine Seguros on cyclingnews forum
''David Millar got given a place on the UCI's panel to talk about how to combat doping in the sport due to his knowledge from the inside.This meant that he profited from his doping where clean cyclists could not.
David Millar has never stopped profiting from his doping.''
Millar is still continuing to do profit from his doping.
Edited by Forever the Best on 16-02-2016 17:13
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| Shonak |
Posted on 16-02-2016 16:45
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Tour de France Champion
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https://velonews.c...eam_395485
45 days is the time frame, end of march. Apparently Conta really doesn't want this thing to become an Alonso neverending joke story.
“If we form a team, it’s to go to the Tour de France with guarantees of success. I wouldn’t want it to be an experiment,” Contador said. “There are about 50 percent possibilities that we can create a team. If it doesn’t work out, we will continue with the ‘Fundación,’ because I want to give back everything that cycling has given to me.”
Also, interesting regarding Algarve and his shape:
Contador, meanwhile, looked trimmer than ever, barely filling out his business suit as he met reporters Monday ahead of his season debut at the Volta ao Algarve on Wednesday.
“I starved myself over the winter to get thin,” Contador said. “The big goal of the season is the Tour de France. I am very motivated for this season.”
"It’s a little bit scary when Contador attacks." - Tommy V
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| Forever the Best |
Posted on 16-02-2016 16:57
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Shonak wrote:
I also don't know if being your own boss at a rather small development team is really a high position. It were something different if spanish cycling foundation recruited him in a high official position tho, then we could talk about the moral standground but this is purely private interest and so far I don't see the implicated social costs outweighing the necessity of a broader infrastructure for spanish talents. Agreed. |
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 24-11-2024 23:34
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 16-02-2016 17:10
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I knew Millar would split opinion, he always does. At least some of the heat got taken away from C*ntadope 
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| Stromeon |
Posted on 16-02-2016 17:37
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How about we fuse the two conversations together with this great Millar quote?
"Does anybody out there seriously doubt that Contador was riding clean in the Giro d'Italia that has just finished [2011]? You don't win the biggest races in the world with such clockwork regularity and comparative ease, and in such style, by not being the supreme talent and clean. In my experience the profile of a doper is always much more erratic and unpredictable.”
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| Smowz |
Posted on 16-02-2016 18:58
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I think everyone here is forgetting that Shonak is Contador fan boy, much like Avin is Sagan lover and Jesley had the hots for Keldermann.
Me I'll just keep taking it from Gee all night long, that guy can do no wrong in my book.
Anyway Conta keeping some of the Tinkoff guys on after Oleg frigs off into the sunset (good riddance imo) is probably good news. Well at least Hernandez gets to keep his family fed.
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| Shonak |
Posted on 16-02-2016 19:29
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Tour de France Champion
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This isn't so much about Contador himself as it is about the sentiment of former (convicted) doped riders being involved in cycling teams, and whether or not their involvement causes danger of corruption to the new generation or is warranted in order to help build new cycling structures in certain regions.
"It’s a little bit scary when Contador attacks." - Tommy V
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| Forever the Best |
Posted on 16-02-2016 19:59
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Classics Specialist
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Shonak wrote:
This isn't so much about Contador himself as it is about the sentiment of former (convicted) doped riders being involved in cycling teams, and whether or not their involvement causes danger of corruption to the new generation or is warranted in order to help build new cycling structures in certain regions. Riders like Contador cause danger of corruption(even though I am such a big fan of Contador) however I think riders like Thomas Frey,Bernhard Kohl can be good for youth.
But Millar?No.He causes a vey huge danger of corruption.
Plus doping will only finish when the testers get ahead and the corruption inside the UCI is gone.
Corruption inside the UCI is a much much bigger problem than Contador being involved in cycling teams.
@Stromeon Great post
Edited by Forever the Best on 16-02-2016 20:24
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| Riis123 |
Posted on 16-02-2016 20:52
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Shonak wrote:
https://velonews.c...eam_395485
45 days is the time frame, end of march. Apparently Conta really doesn't want this thing to become an Alonso neverending joke story.
“If we form a team, it’s to go to the Tour de France with guarantees of success. I wouldn’t want it to be an experiment,” Contador said. “There are about 50 percent possibilities that we can create a team. If it doesn’t work out, we will continue with the ‘Fundación,’ because I want to give back everything that cycling has given to me.”
Also, interesting regarding Algarve and his shape:
Contador, meanwhile, looked trimmer than ever, barely filling out his business suit as he met reporters Monday ahead of his season debut at the Volta ao Algarve on Wednesday.
“I starved myself over the winter to get thin,” Contador said. “The big goal of the season is the Tour de France. I am very motivated for this season.”
I've seen pictures of him, he looks 3-5 kg lighter than the Giro last year. He seems extremely motivated which is kinda scary! |
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 17-02-2016 07:24
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Smowz wrote:
I think everyone here is forgetting that Shonak is Contador fan boy, much like Avin is Sagan lover and Jesley had the hots for Keldermann.
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| Shonak |
Posted on 17-02-2016 10:58
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15615
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Illness making its round in SKY camp. Landa and Intxausti out of Ruta del Sol, Kwiatek out of Algarve.
"It’s a little bit scary when Contador attacks." - Tommy V
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 17-02-2016 11:00
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Ahh, good old SKY early season ilness spree. I would be shocked not to see something like that. 
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| Kirchen_75 |
Posted on 17-02-2016 11:23
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Grand Tour Champion
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The Marginal Gains take time to get used to it seems. |
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![imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg](https://imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg)
