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New Cycling Game Project
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| ziga007 |
Posted on 13-09-2014 18:06
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 388
Joined: 24-06-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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https://darkshifts...
Alberto Contador
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| ziga007 |
Posted on 13-09-2014 18:06
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 388
Joined: 24-06-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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https://darkshifts...
Alberto Contador
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| ziga007 |
Posted on 13-09-2014 18:07
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 388
Joined: 24-06-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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Alberto Contador
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| T-Photon |
Posted on 13-09-2014 18:08
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Domestique
Posts: 437
Joined: 13-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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You are a bit early on it mate  full res screens and upgraded forum and website wont launch before tomorrow.
Follow our development team:
https://darkshiftstudios.com/
https://forum.darkshiftstudios.com/
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| ziga007 |
Posted on 13-09-2014 18:10
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 388
Joined: 24-06-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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Ok
Alberto Contador
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| ziga007 |
Posted on 13-09-2014 18:12
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 388
Joined: 24-06-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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Is that from working game ?
Alberto Contador
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| Miguel98 |
Posted on 13-09-2014 18:18
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World Champion
Posts: 10497
Joined: 23-06-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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But is that the actual website Photon? |
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| T-Photon |
Posted on 13-09-2014 19:32
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Domestique
Posts: 437
Joined: 13-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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Miguel98 wrote:
But is that the actual website Photon?
Close to final website yes, forum is a different story  the final webpage + forum is being worked on. on a local PC and will be uploaded tomorrow. If you register today you will have to repeat the process tomorrow.
Screenshots are from a running prototype that got tested back in June As with everything in development current build has evolved since then. |
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| SotD |
Posted on 13-09-2014 20:16
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World Champion
Posts: 12188
Joined: 29-11-2006
PCM$: 2980.00
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I have two questions, I hope you will find some time to answer...
The first is mainly pragmatic. Why have you decided to launch a new website late sunday evening/night, where people have to go to bed for work or school the day after, rather than launching the site on a friday or saturday? Personally I want to be part of this, but the timing is incredibly bad as I usually force myself to stay off the computer for non-related stuff during weekdays. I assume there are more people like me out there.
The other one is, what is the reasoning behind giving your game the same basic stats as Pro Cycling Manager? IMO the 50-85 stat valuation have always been extremely poor, and I can't see any value in starting a stat anywhere else than 0 or 1. Besides that the stat combination of PCM is pretty low compared to a game such as Football Manager, and Imo the right way to go could be somewhere inbetween. I believe that there are a lot of stats not present that, infact, are quite relevant.
It could be something like:
Natural Fitness
- Determines a riders ability to ride several races without being negatively affected in terms of condition. A rider with a high Natural Fitness can prolong his peak period, or will be less likely to go completely out of form. A rider like Peter Sagan is a model example of such a rider who seem to be in shape for a much longer period than most other riders.
Positioning:
- Could determine the riders ability to jump from wheel to wheel in a sprint, stay out of trouble on windy days, or avoid riders crashing out infront of him. In general this stat could make for a more careful rider, while a rider with a low positioning would be careless, and could potentially be caught out by a split.
Agility: (I can't seem to figure if you have this already)
- The riders ability to avoid crashes while being in the mix. Again a rider such as Sagan could be a pretty good example, while Schleck is another good example of the opposite. Also agility could be combined with weather stats, like rainy downhills and stuff like that.
Decision/Tactic insight
- Would determine how clever/tactical the rider will be. It could potentially be combined with something like radio-communication. A rider with a low decision would be likely to take bad choices if he isn't told what to do by his sportif directeur. Races where radio communication isn't allowed would make a rider with low decision unlikely to win, unless he is quite obviously the best on the day. Any tactical move would set him back. A rider with a high tactical awareness would be smart enough to know when to attack, which riders to follow, and also know his own strenght, so he wouldn't go into the red. A rider with a low tactical knowledge could also push himself into the red more often causing time losses.
Concentration/responsiveness
- Could make the rider respond very fast when an opponent attacks, while a rider with low concentration would possibly react to late, or atleast lose more energy due to the fact that he isn't able to grab the wheel of his competitor straight away.
Aggression
- Determines a riders willingness to move opponents in order to get ahead himself. Some riders tend to stay out of any fights, and sometimes lose ground do to this, while others fancy a touch on other riders shoulders to get quickly ahead. A high aggression could potentially be combined with the agility or likeability to crash. A very aggressive rider with a low agility could be extremely dangerous.
Bravery
- A high bravery could make a GC rider jump from way out, despite being in a pretty good position already. A rider that is willing to put everything on one board to win, instead of playing it safe for 3rd, while a rider with a low bravery would always chose the safe way, and stay with his main rivals, untill he is sure that he will not lose any ground on the riders chasing his own spot. Would be interesting for GC battles, where a rider such as Cadel Evans (From his wheelsucker days), would NEVER move away from his main competitors wheel, while a rider like Pierre Rolland often would go on the move despite being able to secure a potentially better GC spot by staying where he is.
Determination
- A stat that could be combined with Talent. A rider with a high talent, but a low determination would be like throwing a dice. No one could be sure that he would ever become very good, while a rider with a high talent and a high determination would probably become a world class rider... A rider with a lower talent, but a high determination could sometime overtake the bigger talent.
Imo I don't really care if the stats go from 1-20 or 1-50, or somewhere inbetween (1-35 like PCM actually is!), but the more stats, the better chance of making a game that can actually provide realistic gameplay. The problem with PCM is that the low amounts of stats make the game predictable, even with form and randomizations. The more stats the more characterized the riders can become, making the gamer know/recognize the riders from how they react. Also with more distinguished riders the building of a team would be much more interesting, as it does not guarantee results to have the best riders, you would need to make a selection of riders that match up, and compliment eachouther. A VERY strong captain, with a low tactical knowledge or positioning would need helpers that make up for his "problems", while a less strong captain with strong abilities in these, would need strong helpers that can keep him out of the situations where he needs to work hard.
First when you, as a manager, need to pick a team that suits the leader, and make your own interpretations of the statcombinations will you have a fully functioning managergame. Otherwise you will get an arcade game, that can be fun for a limited amount of time. Or that is the way I interpret games.
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| T-Photon |
Posted on 13-09-2014 21:55
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Domestique
Posts: 437
Joined: 13-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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@SoTD
I am not sure i have time to answer everything right now but here is the first part of my answer 
why sunday?
We have to fit this project in between family, university and work and this was the day where we could meet and invest a total of 30 man hours into it and finish off by launching the website
Why 40-90 or 50-85 compared to 0-50?
It mainly comes down to programming and creating algorithms its easier to work with and the number difference seems less extreme in that scale than say 1 versus 50. Third reason is that the scale is being used by most games i know from PCM to NHL and people are used to that.
Will answer your stat suggestions later.
Follow our development team:
https://darkshiftstudios.com/
https://forum.darkshiftstudios.com/
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 13-09-2014 22:24
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 16429
Joined: 27-07-2011
PCM$: 10438.70
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I also would rather see a different scale. At least all the American sports games I know use 0-99 or 50-99 stats matrix's. That might be hard, but 50-99 would be just as good.
I always questions why PCM used that one.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 24-11-2024 18:33
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Bot Agent
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| 547984 |
Posted on 14-09-2014 00:16
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 5008
Joined: 29-01-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Great stuff!
baseballlover312, 06-03-14 : "Nuke Moscow...Don't worry Russia, we've got plenty of love to go around your cities"
Sarah Palin, 08-03-14 (CPAC, on Russian aggression) : "The only thing that stops a bad guy with a nuke is a good guy with a nuke"
Big thanks to jdog for making this AMAZING userbar! |
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| Wild Dog |
Posted on 14-09-2014 08:02
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Domestique
Posts: 425
Joined: 17-07-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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I don't really care if the stat scale goes from 1-50 or 50-90. The important thing is which different stats there are. I think SotD hit some good suggestions in his post.
Also curious to know what TA and AG means in the stat screen?
Vincenzo Nibali - Rui Costa - Nairo Quintana - Alberto Contador - Peter Sagan
WDshirts
The Last of the Real
- Story about Dries Deckers - racing against Merckx, de Vlaeminck etc. |
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| sutty68 |
Posted on 14-09-2014 10:46
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 34654
Joined: 22-08-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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Possibly TA=Tactics and AG=Aggression |
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| T-Photon |
Posted on 14-09-2014 11:18
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Domestique
Posts: 437
Joined: 13-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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Close TA = Tactics and AG = Agility
Scale is actually 40-90 to give exactly 50 points of difference and to avoid 3 digits that 50-100 would give.
Time to answer the suggestions though
Natural Fitness
Training methods, coach etc will determine how long a rider can peak and stay in shape it will vary from rider to rider and season to season. Peaks are not a fixed number.
Positioning:
It should depend on the player and AI in my opinion not numbers.
Agility:
Already included, the stat called AG.
Decision/Tactic insight
Already included, the stat called TA
Concentration/responsiveness
That insecurity you are getting at here is related to the stat above in my opinion.
Aggression
I think this one varies from race to race, if a rider has just crashed he will be more affraid in sprints etc. Wont put a number on that.
Bravery
Comes down to some hidden mental stats that did not fit the 40-90 scale like determination, stuff like this is included but not visisble on the screenshot.
Determination
Works as a mental stat in my game, not shown on the screen because that table showcases the stats that infuence the 3D experience. Is included though.
Follow our development team:
https://darkshiftstudios.com/
https://forum.darkshiftstudios.com/
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| thestorm93 |
Posted on 14-09-2014 11:20
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Junior Rider
Posts: 40
Joined: 03-04-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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I am so ready for your website to launch! - Really looking forward to see it and participate ind the debate on darkshift studios forum  |
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 14-09-2014 16:33
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15274
Joined: 21-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Awesome project.
Won't post a huge list of suggestions, but here are 2 small things:
If you ask me, it might be a good idea to rename some stats, because it looks a bit too much alike to PCM now.
What about
1. FLat -> Power,
2. mountain -> climbing
3. sprint -> speed?
And also maybe in a different sequence, because you've got the PCM sequence of the stats right there. Just shouldn't look too much alike PCM if you ask me. I mean, obviously it can't differ too much, but this should be an easy thing to customize, just switch the sequences.
I'd also prefer something a bit closer to a Fifa matrix. Just make the top a bit higher(up to 99 with the best current riders on 95 or something) and you're practically there.
Also, I'm not sure about all the abbreviations: Is there a technique stat? Because it might not be thát hard to implement one. Just let it influence the speed they have in the turns and maybe also the frequency of crashes of the riders.
Or is that what Agilty does?
Good luck with the rest of the project!
Edited by Jesleyh on 14-09-2014 16:35
Feyenoord(football) and Kelderman fanboy
PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 14-09-2014 16:39
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 16429
Joined: 27-07-2011
PCM$: 10438.70
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Question: Are we going to get realistic mountain AI or PCM like AI?
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| T-Photon |
Posted on 14-09-2014 17:23
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Domestique
Posts: 437
Joined: 13-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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baseballlover312 wrote:
Question: Are we going to get realistic mountain AI or PCM like AI?
Well we are not close to beginning on 3D yet but what i can say is:
1) i dont have access to Cyanides code so everything will be made from scratch and work differently.
2) I want a varied and challenging experience in the mountains so thats how i will approach that AI
@Jesley: thanks for the feedback man! I will look into it |
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| T-Photon |
Posted on 14-09-2014 20:44
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Domestique
Posts: 437
Joined: 13-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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Hey guys, Website and Forums are complete we just ran into some server issues with our host while trying to upgrade the content
Website will be live at midnight as promised but i will have to keep this thread posted untill forum is up and running. Stay tuned.
Follow our development team:
https://darkshiftstudios.com/
https://forum.darkshiftstudios.com/
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