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Sky Doping/Hate Thread
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| CLURPR |
Posted on 09-07-2012 16:55
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Domestique
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Likkivi wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Took this from another site:
Gert Leinders, Sky,s Team Dr Has an "Interesting" History.
Forums elswhere are buzzing with incredulity at whats going on and the desciption "UK Postal" is geting used and it most certainly aint a compliment. ....and then we have this little revelation : "Leinders was team doctor for Sigma, Histor, Panasonic and Lotto before becoming team doctor for Rabobank in 1996. He left Rabobank in 2009 citing 'dissatisfaction with the policies of the new management of the cycling team'.
According to Rabobank one of those new policies bought in between 2007 and July 2009 was a 'zero tolerance' attitude to doping, a policy that followed an internal investigation into the use of doping within the team during the period Leinders was the team doctor, an investigation that was triggered by Michael Rasmussen’s expulsion from the Tour de France"
There's the evidence.
I noticed this argument stands alone. It's settled.
Now it's just a question of time before it leads to a ban.
Stop being an idiot, just because a doctor with doping history is on the team doesn't mean you have evidence. Keep your mouth shut from now on about banning Team Sky unless you have a positive test for me to look at  |
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| Kirchen_75 |
Posted on 09-07-2012 16:56
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7702
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This thread is such a good laugh. I'm actually in tears  |
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| Likkivi |
Posted on 09-07-2012 16:56
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Stagiare
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gotlandrules wrote:
sutty68 wrote:
Coop wrote:
sutty68 wrote:
Coop wrote:
sutty68 wrote:
SKY = Hard work = Hard Training = Results 
Pretty sure Armstrong and Postal/Disco used that same story. What's your feelings on them?
The whole team were dopers as we already know
So you agree that Sky are probably doping then!
No not at all, when Cofidis left the TDF in 2007 due to a failed dope test, Wiggins was going to retire from the sport, but was talked into continuing in the sport he loves, so NO he will not dope.
As for the others, the Team Sky regime is totally focused on training and fitness and is finally showing signs of working. Dont forget this is the third year of all these implementations so it has not just happened overnight 
Didn't the rabobank dope-doctor join around the same time though? =)
Yes. Because his doping work was spoiled after all the attention on Rasmussen. He was in need of a new project. And he sure has stocked up this time |
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| Coop |
Posted on 09-07-2012 16:57
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Under 23
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marble wrote:
Some of Armstrong's teammates has already been caught. There is at least some evidence that makes questioning Armstrong reasonable. However we still have yet to see the same with this Sky team, so why bother speculating? I'm sure that if you take a look at watts we won't see the same extreme levels as some of the best climbers during the 90s, so it's not like they're inhuman or anything.
Yeah another recycled Armstrong defense! How old is Sky now? How long before the first Armstrong teammates were caught? Give it time! |
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| gotlandrules |
Posted on 09-07-2012 16:57
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Protected Rider
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Likkivi wrote:
gotlandrules wrote:
sutty68 wrote:
Coop wrote:
sutty68 wrote:
Coop wrote:
sutty68 wrote:
SKY = Hard work = Hard Training = Results
Pretty sure Armstrong and Postal/Disco used that same story. What's your feelings on them?
The whole team were dopers as we already know
So you agree that Sky are probably doping then!
No not at all, when Cofidis left the TDF in 2007 due to a failed dope test, Wiggins was going to retire from the sport, but was talked into continuing in the sport he loves, so NO he will not dope.
As for the others, the Team Sky regime is totally focused on training and fitness and is finally showing signs of working. Dont forget this is the third year of all these implementations so it has not just happened overnight
Didn't the rabobank dope-doctor join around the same time though? =)
Yes. Because his doping work was spoiled after all the attention on Rasmussen. He was in need of a new project. And he sure has stocked up this time
Looks like he's doing a marvelous job. |
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| valverde321 |
Posted on 09-07-2012 16:57
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World Champion
Posts: 12986
Joined: 20-05-2009
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jph27 wrote:
Maybe Sky are doping, but are you naive enough to think they are the only ones? And let's face it, they aren't stupid enough to get caught here.
This.
Also the doctors point made by Alakagom. If a Doctor only knows one way to get his riders fully prepared for a race, through use of dope, then gets suspended and comes back saying he'll never dope his riders again, but still only knowing one way to get his riders prepared, but is asked to get riders prepared again by the managers, what other way can he really get his riders prepared? Obviously he might have some knowledge being a doctor but if you are a dope doctor, you are a dope doctor imo. Or am I wrong, I dont know a whole lot about doctors, but it doesn't seem like a half bad assumption. I mean if you are a dope doctor and then you're not but your still making your riders improve their results by 100%, through the normal methods it just seems unlikely. Thats just my thoughts on the doctors with shady pasts.
Unless a doctor makes some sort of breakthrough like gluten free diet etc.
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| Rin |
Posted on 09-07-2012 16:58
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Small Tour Specialist
Posts: 2748
Joined: 14-04-2008
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- Were at the beginning in a team that had a diffrent thinking wise about doping
Schumacher Team Telekom
Froome Barloworld
- Are at a team with suspicious people -> riders or staff
Schumacher Telekom and Gerolsteiner he wasn't the only one that doped (Leipheimer, Kohl..) and people like Henn as a DS
Froome Barloworld people like Pfannberger, Duenas etc. also Corti and now Sky and team doctor Leinders
 Team Bianchi - 2012 Man-Game ProContinental Tour Champions
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 24-11-2024 22:11
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 09-07-2012 16:59
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Tour de France Champion
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It's funny because when the Armstrong allegations happened., the Americans flaired (including me) and were critisized. It's the exact same thing witht he Brits. guys, can't you see it?
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| Likkivi |
Posted on 09-07-2012 16:59
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Stagiare
Posts: 201
Joined: 30-09-2007
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CLURPR wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Took this from another site:
Gert Leinders, Sky,s Team Dr Has an "Interesting" History.
Forums elswhere are buzzing with incredulity at whats going on and the desciption "UK Postal" is geting used and it most certainly aint a compliment. ....and then we have this little revelation : "Leinders was team doctor for Sigma, Histor, Panasonic and Lotto before becoming team doctor for Rabobank in 1996. He left Rabobank in 2009 citing 'dissatisfaction with the policies of the new management of the cycling team'.
According to Rabobank one of those new policies bought in between 2007 and July 2009 was a 'zero tolerance' attitude to doping, a policy that followed an internal investigation into the use of doping within the team during the period Leinders was the team doctor, an investigation that was triggered by Michael Rasmussen’s expulsion from the Tour de France"
There's the evidence.
I noticed this argument stands alone. It's settled.
Now it's just a question of time before it leads to a ban.
Stop being an idiot, just because a doctor with doping history is on the team doesn't mean you have evidence. Keep your mouth shut from now on about banning Team Sky unless you have a positive test for me to look at
I see you have no counter argument so you get angry instead. Don't worry. That's normal.
But it doesn't change the fact of this time line.
Geert Leinders at Rabobank = Rasmussen kicked out of Tour
Geert Leinders stops at Rabobank = All Rabobank riders start declining
Geert Leinders at Sky: Froome out of nothing dominates Vuelta and Tour |
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| valverde321 |
Posted on 09-07-2012 17:01
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World Champion
Posts: 12986
Joined: 20-05-2009
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baseballlover312 wrote:
It's funny because when the Armstrong allegations happened., the Americans flaired (including me) and were critisized. It's the exact same thing witht he Brits. guys, can't you see it?
Its different
There was substantial evidence on Armstrong. This is only suspicion since everything around the team is, and the results definitely raise eyebrows.
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 09-07-2012 17:02
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 18187
Joined: 12-05-2012
PCM$: 0.00
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Likkivi wrote:
CLURPR wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Took this from another site:
Gert Leinders, Sky,s Team Dr Has an "Interesting" History.
Forums elswhere are buzzing with incredulity at whats going on and the desciption "UK Postal" is geting used and it most certainly aint a compliment. ....and then we have this little revelation : "Leinders was team doctor for Sigma, Histor, Panasonic and Lotto before becoming team doctor for Rabobank in 1996. He left Rabobank in 2009 citing 'dissatisfaction with the policies of the new management of the cycling team'.
According to Rabobank one of those new policies bought in between 2007 and July 2009 was a 'zero tolerance' attitude to doping, a policy that followed an internal investigation into the use of doping within the team during the period Leinders was the team doctor, an investigation that was triggered by Michael Rasmussen’s expulsion from the Tour de France"
There's the evidence.
I noticed this argument stands alone. It's settled.
Now it's just a question of time before it leads to a ban.
Stop being an idiot, just because a doctor with doping history is on the team doesn't mean you have evidence. Keep your mouth shut from now on about banning Team Sky unless you have a positive test for me to look at
I see you have no counter argument so you get angry instead. Don't worry. That's normal.
But it doesn't change the fact of this time line.
Geert Leinders at Rabobank = Rasmussen kicked out of Tour
Geert Leinders stops at Rabobank = All Rabobank riders start declining
Geert Leinders at Sky: Froome out of nothing dominates Vuelta and Tour
Rasmussen missed a test, did not have a positive test
All Rabo rider decline what?
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| Coop |
Posted on 09-07-2012 17:02
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Under 23
Posts: 77
Joined: 06-02-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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sutty68 wrote:
Coop wrote:
sutty68 wrote:
Coop wrote:
sutty68 wrote:
SKY = Hard work = Hard Training = Results
Pretty sure Armstrong and Postal/Disco used that same story. What's your feelings on them?
The whole team were dopers as we already know
So you agree that Sky are probably doping then!
No not at all, when Cofidis left the TDF in 2007 due to a failed dope test, Wiggins was going to retire from the sport, but was talked into continuing in the sport he loves, so NO he will not dope.
As for the others, the Team Sky regime is totally focused on training and fitness and is finally showing signs of working. Dont forget this is the third year of all these implementations so it has not just happened overnight
Wow, be sure to pull your head out of the sand before you take your next breathe. You do realize that you're using all the same excuses that Postal/Diso used right? They were better because they trained harder and longer than the other teams. So suddenly Sky is the only team to use modern science to train. By God, somebody on that squad deserves some sort of Nobel prize! |
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| CLURPR |
Posted on 09-07-2012 17:02
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Domestique
Posts: 452
Joined: 19-01-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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Likkivi wrote:
CLURPR wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Took this from another site:
Gert Leinders, Sky,s Team Dr Has an "Interesting" History.
Forums elswhere are buzzing with incredulity at whats going on and the desciption "UK Postal" is geting used and it most certainly aint a compliment. ....and then we have this little revelation : "Leinders was team doctor for Sigma, Histor, Panasonic and Lotto before becoming team doctor for Rabobank in 1996. He left Rabobank in 2009 citing 'dissatisfaction with the policies of the new management of the cycling team'.
According to Rabobank one of those new policies bought in between 2007 and July 2009 was a 'zero tolerance' attitude to doping, a policy that followed an internal investigation into the use of doping within the team during the period Leinders was the team doctor, an investigation that was triggered by Michael Rasmussen’s expulsion from the Tour de France"
There's the evidence.
I noticed this argument stands alone. It's settled.
Now it's just a question of time before it leads to a ban.
Stop being an idiot, just because a doctor with doping history is on the team doesn't mean you have evidence. Keep your mouth shut from now on about banning Team Sky unless you have a positive test for me to look at
I see you have no counter argument so you get angry instead. Don't worry. That's normal.
But it doesn't change the fact of this time line.
Geert Leinders at Rabobank = Rasmussen kicked out of Tour
Geert Leinders stops at Rabobank = All Rabobank riders start declining
Geert Leinders at Sky: Froome out of nothing dominates Vuelta and Tour
Froome didn't work with Leinders before the Vuelta, he worked exclusively with Bobby Julich
EDIT: And since when did Rabobank riders begin declining?
Edited by CLURPR on 09-07-2012 17:04
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 09-07-2012 17:03
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 16429
Joined: 27-07-2011
PCM$: 10438.70
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valverde321 wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
It's funny because when the Armstrong allegations happened., the Americans flaired (including me) and were critisized. It's the exact same thing witht he Brits. guys, can't you see it?
Its different
There was substantial evidence on Armstrong. This is only suspicion since everything around the team is, and the results definitely raise eyebrows.
But what I'm saying is that the defenses are almost exactly the same.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| Likkivi |
Posted on 09-07-2012 17:05
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Stagiare
Posts: 201
Joined: 30-09-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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CLURPR wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
CLURPR wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Took this from another site:
Gert Leinders, Sky,s Team Dr Has an "Interesting" History.
Forums elswhere are buzzing with incredulity at whats going on and the desciption "UK Postal" is geting used and it most certainly aint a compliment. ....and then we have this little revelation : "Leinders was team doctor for Sigma, Histor, Panasonic and Lotto before becoming team doctor for Rabobank in 1996. He left Rabobank in 2009 citing 'dissatisfaction with the policies of the new management of the cycling team'.
According to Rabobank one of those new policies bought in between 2007 and July 2009 was a 'zero tolerance' attitude to doping, a policy that followed an internal investigation into the use of doping within the team during the period Leinders was the team doctor, an investigation that was triggered by Michael Rasmussen’s expulsion from the Tour de France"
There's the evidence.
I noticed this argument stands alone. It's settled.
Now it's just a question of time before it leads to a ban.
Stop being an idiot, just because a doctor with doping history is on the team doesn't mean you have evidence. Keep your mouth shut from now on about banning Team Sky unless you have a positive test for me to look at
I see you have no counter argument so you get angry instead. Don't worry. That's normal.
But it doesn't change the fact of this time line.
Geert Leinders at Rabobank = Rasmussen kicked out of Tour
Geert Leinders stops at Rabobank = All Rabobank riders start declining
Geert Leinders at Sky: Froome out of nothing dominates Vuelta and Tour
Froome didn't work with Leinders before the Vuelta, he worked exclusively with Bobby Julich
In the knowledge of the public, sure. They at least make an attempt to hide it.
This is Deja vú from Vinokourov/Kascheckin |
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| kirtley9 |
Posted on 09-07-2012 17:05
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Junior Rider
Posts: 49
Joined: 14-07-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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baseballlover312 wrote:
It's funny because when the Armstrong allegations happened., the Americans flaired (including me) and were critisized. It's the exact same thing witht he Brits. guys, can't you see it?
The "Brits" aren't saying they are 100% clean becasue noone apart from the riders themselves can tell you that just like you can't say they are definitely doping without having proper evidence.
Edited by kirtley9 on 09-07-2012 17:06
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| marble |
Posted on 09-07-2012 17:07
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 389
Joined: 28-07-2007
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Likkivi wrote:
Geert Leinders at Rabobank = Rasmussen kicked out of Tour
Geert Leinders stops at Rabobank = All Rabobank riders start declining
Rasmussen was kicked out by Rabobank though, so that doesn't really prove anything. Rabobank are still getting good results with Gesink and Mollema, and Kruijswijk, Slagter and Kelderman isn't looking bad either. Rabobank still has a good team, how exactly did all Rabobank riders start declining? |
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| Alakagom |
Posted on 09-07-2012 17:07
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World Champion
Posts: 10891
Joined: 19-11-2010
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Likkivi wrote:
CLURPR wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
CLURPR wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Likkivi wrote:
Took this from another site:
Gert Leinders, Sky,s Team Dr Has an "Interesting" History.
Forums elswhere are buzzing with incredulity at whats going on and the desciption "UK Postal" is geting used and it most certainly aint a compliment. ....and then we have this little revelation : "Leinders was team doctor for Sigma, Histor, Panasonic and Lotto before becoming team doctor for Rabobank in 1996. He left Rabobank in 2009 citing 'dissatisfaction with the policies of the new management of the cycling team'.
According to Rabobank one of those new policies bought in between 2007 and July 2009 was a 'zero tolerance' attitude to doping, a policy that followed an internal investigation into the use of doping within the team during the period Leinders was the team doctor, an investigation that was triggered by Michael Rasmussen’s expulsion from the Tour de France"
There's the evidence.
I noticed this argument stands alone. It's settled.
Now it's just a question of time before it leads to a ban.
Stop being an idiot, just because a doctor with doping history is on the team doesn't mean you have evidence. Keep your mouth shut from now on about banning Team Sky unless you have a positive test for me to look at
I see you have no counter argument so you get angry instead. Don't worry. That's normal.
But it doesn't change the fact of this time line.
Geert Leinders at Rabobank = Rasmussen kicked out of Tour
Geert Leinders stops at Rabobank = All Rabobank riders start declining
Geert Leinders at Sky: Froome out of nothing dominates Vuelta and Tour
Froome didn't work with Leinders before the Vuelta, he worked exclusively with Bobby Julich
In the knowledge of the public, sure. They at least make an attempt to hide it.
How do you know this shit man ?  You don't work at Sky and you don't know if Froome ''worked'' with Leinders or not.
Anyway, Julich is a coach. Leinders is a doctor. Helps with injures etc. He had to help with everyone if he was at Sky in 2011 in my view. I've no idea.
Edited by Alakagom on 09-07-2012 17:08
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 09-07-2012 17:07
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 18187
Joined: 12-05-2012
PCM$: 0.00
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kirtley9 wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
It's funny because when the Armstrong allegations happened., the Americans flaired (including me) and were critisized. It's the exact same thing witht he Brits. guys, can't you see it?
The "Brits" aren't saying they are 100% clean becasue noone apart from the riders themselves can tell you that just like you can't say they are defintly doping without having proper evidence.
The 'Brits' are asking for people to wait until Sky turns up a failed or missed test.
If Sky fail then fine SKy are doped
If Sky dont fail, then you can suspect but dont just accuse them
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| Aquarius |
Posted on 09-07-2012 17:11
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 5220
Joined: 29-11-2006
PCM$: 200.00
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TheManxMissile wrote:
kirtley9 wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
It's funny because when the Armstrong allegations happened., the Americans flaired (including me) and were critisized. It's the exact same thing witht he Brits. guys, can't you see it?
The "Brits" aren't saying they are 100% clean becasue noone apart from the riders themselves can tell you that just like you can't say they are defintly doping without having proper evidence.
The 'Brits' are asking for people to wait until Sky turns up a failed or missed test.
If Sky fail then fine SKy are doped
If Sky dont fail, then you can suspect but dont just accuse them
What's the difference when you're not a court or a legal representative of UCI or something official ?
As for your "no positive test" argument : how often did Riis, Ullrich, Virenque, etc. test positive ? Never. So they were unfairly condemned when they were in fact innocents ? Or is it slightly more complicated than that ? |
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