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TdF'13 Stage 20 - Annecy to Annecy-Semnoz (July 20)
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 16-12-2025 02:47
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| Bikex |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:00
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Jacdk wrote:
but there is no chance in h... that Porte can ever win a GT if he is clean.
Same with Froome  |
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| Andro |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:01
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Domestique
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Jacdk wrote:
When have you ever seen a rider go from being 30-35min behind the winner to actually win a tour?
This one guy comes to mind. He just won the Tour. |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:01
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Jeremy wrote:
Of course they can. What do you think bio passports do? The only transfusion that can't be detected is one that the quantity is so small that almost no advantage is gained.
No.
Blood transfuse at will, the blood passport won't do anything since the courts got Pellizotti off the hook.
Since Pellizotti was cleared by the court, WADA's blood passport lost all its value, now they won't charge anyone important enough to have money to defend themselves because they know they'd lose.
Example: Look at the blood values from Armstrong's 2009 and 2010 Tours. It's hard to find more obviously doped values. His hemoglobin variation is very abnormal, his haematocrit is silly, his retics are essentially zero and his z-score is off the charts. Obvious doping.
Did he get charged? Of course not. The blood passport is useless since the court set that legal precedent.
Jeremy wrote:
If Sky is doping, it's something new.
Also, everyone in this forum pretty much casts doubt on every win. How can you still enjoy the sport thinking like that?
Sigh. Dude, how many times does this have to be answered?
It's not every win. It's when something is suspicious, it's when there's evidence. Costa won yesterday, where's the people saying he's doped? Riblon won the day before, where are the people saying he's doped?
It's not 'everyone', it's not even close to 1 out of every 10 people. Get a grip on yourself
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| Aquarius |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:02
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Jeremy wrote:
Kimmage wrote:
Jacdk wrote:
But another thing, some of the experts mentions that especially Rodriguez´s transformation over the rest day is very specious.
So it might not be over yet
Blood transfusions can't be detected. Don't count on anything.
Of course they can. What do you think bio passports do? The only transfusion that can't be detected is one that the quantity is so small that almost no advantage is gained.
If Sky is doping, it's something new.
Also, everyone in this forum pretty much casts doubt on every win. How can you still enjoy the sport thinking like that?
I reckon he meant a test, not evidence from an abnormal evolution of blood parameters.
There's a test for blood-transfusion, but I have no clue whether it's been performed on J-Rod nor in what circumstances it works.
And hoping the evolution of blood parameters would lead to something is putting too much faith in bio-passport analyzers.
Wiggins' in 2009 showed he had two or three refills on the way, Armstrong's was as suspicious as it could get, and it never led to anything. |
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| Ian Butler |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:03
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Trying to read through the doping comments here, not easy.
Quintana with one hell of a job. Now I'm starting to hope Froome gets stripped away from his victory, so Quintana will win this Tour
Voigt in another brilliant tour, superprix de combativité, possibly? |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:03
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Aquarius wrote:
There's a test for blood-transfusion, but I have no clue whether it's been performed on J-Rod nor in what circumstances it works.
Homologous only. Transfuse your own blood and it's undetectable.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| Jacdk |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:04
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Ste117 wrote:
When you take into account the amount of work Porte has done, also the stage he was caught out in the crosswinds, Porte has probaly done the most work of any domestique in this years Tour!
And a guy like Kreuziger hasn´t done the same work? or Valverde for Quintana
But you forget Nibali, Contador, Rodriguez, Quintana, Valverde and about 4-5 other riders and if Porte beats them , why even test him. |
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:05
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Tour de France Champion
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Ian Butler wrote:
Trying to read through the doping comments here, not easy.
Quintana with one hell of a job. Now I'm starting to hope Froome gets stripped away from his victory, so Quintana will win this Tour
Voigt in another brilliant tour, superprix de combativité, possibly?
Waht are the other candidates? Maybe Bakelants or Riblon?
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| SSJ2Luigi |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:07
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baseballlover312 wrote:
Ian Butler wrote:
Trying to read through the doping comments here, not easy.
Quintana with one hell of a job. Now I'm starting to hope Froome gets stripped away from his victory, so Quintana will win this Tour
Voigt in another brilliant tour, superprix de combativité, possibly?
Waht are the other candidates? Maybe Bakelants or Riblon?
Flecha. didn't get anywere with attacking though
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| Jeremy |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:08
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issoisso wrote:
Jeremy wrote:
Of course they can. What do you think bio passports do? The only transfusion that can't be detected is one that the quantity is so small that almost no advantage is gained.
No.
Blood transfuse at will, the blood passport won't do anything since the courts got Pellizotti off the hook.
Since Pellizotti was cleared by the court, WADA's blood passport lost all its value, now they won't charge anyone important enough to have money to defend themselves because they know they'd lose.
Example: Look at the blood values from Armstrong's 2009 and 2010 Tours. It's hard to find more obviously doped values. His hemoglobin variation is very abnormal, his haematocrit is silly, his retics are essentially zero and his z-score is off the charts. Obvious doping.
Did he get charged? Of course not. The blood passport is useless since the court set that legal precedent.
Jeremy wrote:
If Sky is doping, it's something new.
Also, everyone in this forum pretty much casts doubt on every win. How can you still enjoy the sport thinking like that?
Sigh. Dude, how many times does this have to be answered?
It's not every win. It's when something is suspicious, it's when there's evidence. Costa won yesterday, where's the people saying he's doped? Riblon won the day before, where are the people saying he's doped?
It's not 'everyone', it's not even close to 1 out of every 10 people. Get a grip on yourself
I won't bother to post quotes but browsing this forum for a bit you can find people questioning Riblon, Costa, Porte, Froome, Rodriguez, etc etc. I don't think that every rider is clean, but you people talk 10 times more about doping than tactics or skill in cycling. |
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| Aquarius |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:08
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issoisso wrote:
Aquarius wrote:
There's a test for blood-transfusion, but I have no clue whether it's been performed on J-Rod nor in what circumstances it works.
Homologous only. Transfuse your own blood and it's undetectable.
Nah, I read just before le Tour or during the first week that they had come up with a test for it. But I'm not sure they're running it on anyone yet, let alone TDF riders.
Edited by Aquarius on 20-07-2013 17:11
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| ruben |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:09
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Ste117 wrote:
Cadel Evans finishing over a 1 hour done overall, I have never seen him finish over an hour down, I think it may be time to retire, but I think the fact that he done the Giro maybe a reason why, maybe the Giro had taken alot of him than we expected.
If half the mt stages in the Giro weren't cancelled or half-cancelled. Cadel Evans would not have finished in the top 10 of the Giro even |
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| Nin1388 |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:09
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Jacdk wrote:
But another thing, some of the experts mentions that especially Rodriguez´s transformation over the rest day is very suspicious.
So it might not be over yet
If you see at M. Ventoux he finished 4th, day before rest day. He showed awesome turn of speed in last 2 kms. Jumped from Contador group and gained like 30s.
He lost 3 min in 1st mountain stage and 3 min in 1st TT, on second mountain stage he managed to stay. He was not at his best in first week. Then slowly he came back and did not lose time to Froome, in fact, overall he gained last week. |
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| Nin1388 |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:11
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Aquarius wrote:
issoisso wrote:
Aquarius wrote:
There's a test for blood-transfusion, but I have no clue whether it's been performed on J-Rod nor in what circumstances it works.
Homologous only. Transfuse your own blood and it's undetectable.
Nah, I read just before le Tour or during the first week that they had come with a test for it. But I'm not sure they're running it on anyone yet, let alone TDF riders.
They can detect amount of old and new RBCs and know if homologous transfusion is done. |
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| BritPCMFan |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:11
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Stagiare
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SSJ2Luigi wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
Ian Butler wrote:
Trying to read through the doping comments here, not easy.
Quintana with one hell of a job. Now I'm starting to hope Froome gets stripped away from his victory, so Quintana will win this Tour
Voigt in another brilliant tour, superprix de combativité, possibly?
Waht are the other candidates? Maybe Bakelants or Riblon?
Flecha. didn't get anywere with attacking though
I wouldn't be totally suprised if they end up giving it to Rolland.
Cos you know. That sprint today was pretty combative.
And I still think Froome should get aggressive rider today for knocking that fan for 6 XD |
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| Malkael |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:12
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Jacdk wrote:
When have you ever seen a rider go from being 30-35min behind the winner to actually win a tour?
I guess if Porte wants to prove that he is taking something else then tap water, he cna win, but there is no chance in h... that Porte can ever win a GT if he is clean.
Not quite 30 minutes down, but in the 2002 Giro d'Italia Cadel Evans did an impressive bonk and ended up finishing the race 14th 16'25". Not to mention the time gaps in this Tour de France to the winner are frankly extreme, with Mikel Nieve in 12th a large 20'44" down on Froome-dawg. |
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| Daggen |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:14
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SSJ2Luigi wrote:
Nin1388 wrote:
ruben wrote:
Interesting thought. Quintana vs Nibali. Hard to say who's better. Nibali is more complete, but Quintana is such an awesome climber... hmm
Next year TdF will be awesome. Froome, Quintana and Nibali.
Remember Nibali is only guy too beat Froome this year in any GC in Tirreno–Adriatico, Though in downhill on penultimate stage.
next years TdF is for Porte 
Obviously I wasn't the only one who thought this  |
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| Jacdk |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:17
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Nin1388 wrote:
If you see at M. Ventoux he finished 4th, day before rest day. He showed awesome turn of speed in last 2 kms. Jumped from Contador group and gained like 30s.
He lost 3 min in 1st mountain stage and 3 min in 1st TT, on second mountain stage he managed to stay. He was not at his best in first week. Then slowly he came back and did not lose time to Froome, in fact, overall he gained last week.
There is a huge difference on getting better and going from zero to hero after a restday. |
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| atlanta |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:21
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Nin1388 wrote:
CountArach wrote:
He could win GT like Vuelta some year, not TdF due to long climbs. Nevertheless great performance. Despite leading most of the way up the mountain still managed to beat Froome.
Also Quintana proved to be better that Froome. If not for 1st week were Quintana was used in stupid strategy by Movistar would have been closer.
Yeah course he was, lol you serious?. No matter if Quintana did not attack silly in first week he would not have won, he would not have took 4 mins back from the ITT's. The final week he as been stronger but I think CF was fine today, Alpe d'Huez he bonked that's only stage Quintana took time. No way he stays with CF on AX-3 imo, and Ventoux yes he attacked silly but CF did not even go all out. The gap would have still been about 3-4 minutes imo. |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 20-07-2013 17:22
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Malkael wrote:
Jacdk wrote:
When have you ever seen a rider go from being 30-35min behind the winner to actually win a tour?
I guess if Porte wants to prove that he is taking something else then tap water, he cna win, but there is no chance in h... that Porte can ever win a GT if he is clean.
Not quite 30 minutes down, but in the 2002 Giro d'Italia Cadel Evans did an impressive bonk and ended up finishing the race 14th 16'25". Not to mention the time gaps in this Tour de France to the winner are frankly extreme, with Mikel Nieve in 12th a large 20'44" down on Froome-dawg.
Funnily enough, it wasn't even 1 whole sage. He bonked halfway up the last mountain of the Giro. He was in pink at the time.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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