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TOTC 2: TOTC3 starts December 1st
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| brewers90 |
Posted on 11-11-2013 00:00
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Classics Specialist
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Only the highest and lowest have to average 70. The other seven don't matter  . |
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 11-11-2013 00:17
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World Champion
Posts: 14591
Joined: 08-08-2011
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Really? Pfff, should've drafted otherwise then, no need to get my lowest guy in round 2 :/
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| 547984 |
Posted on 11-11-2013 02:21
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 5008
Joined: 29-01-2013
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AHHH! Forgot about the Round 2 draft, you can rand generate riders from here on out.
baseballlover312, 06-03-14 : "Nuke Moscow...Don't worry Russia, we've got plenty of love to go around your cities"
Sarah Palin, 08-03-14 (CPAC, on Russian aggression) : "The only thing that stops a bad guy with a nuke is a good guy with a nuke"
Big thanks to jdog for making this AMAZING userbar! |
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| welker3257 |
Posted on 11-11-2013 02:27
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Small Tour Specialist
Posts: 2336
Joined: 29-05-2013
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Yay, I didn't understand the rules, got accidentally got 5 good riders so it works out
Gig 'em Aggies
Fast N' Loud Cycling Project - ICL
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| Cycleman123 |
Posted on 11-11-2013 04:22
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4478
Joined: 30-07-2012
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DAMMIT! Now I have a shit team thinking that the average of everyone had to be max 70
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 11-11-2013 06:03
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15274
Joined: 21-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Me too...
Damn, draft round 5 was a bit of a waste for me then...
Feyenoord(football) and Kelderman fanboy
PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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| The Hobbit |
Posted on 11-11-2013 06:57
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Small Tour Specialist
Posts: 2730
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What now then, is there another draft? |
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| Atlantius |
Posted on 11-11-2013 09:18
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Team Leader
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brewers90 wrote:
Only the highest and lowest have to average 70. The other seven don't matter .
I think we need The Rider to confirm (or the opposite) this...
Edited by Atlantius on 11-11-2013 09:19
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 11-11-2013 09:48
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 18187
Joined: 12-05-2012
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Either way someone is about to lose out...
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 11-11-2013 10:17
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World Champion
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CRITERIA FOR ELIGIBLE RIDERS:
-Born before 01/01/1980
- Range of AVG riders must be 70 or below
I doesn't say it only applies for 1 pair of riders. Unless it got changed in a later post somewhere..
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 22-12-2024 18:39
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 11-11-2013 10:27
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Tour de France Champion
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Ollfardh wrote:
CRITERIA FOR ELIGIBLE RIDERS:
-Born before 01/01/1980
- Range of AVG riders must be 70 or below
I doesn't say it only applies for 1 pair of riders. Unless it got changed in a later post somewhere..
Age is easy 
Range is just highest to lowest. Hence the 80 must have 60, 79 with 61. But the rest of the wording gives the impression that the overall AVG must be 70 or below. And looking back i'm even more confused now... Some answers to questions suggested range, and some overall average... And apparently i'm not the only one
Edited by TheManxMissile on 11-11-2013 10:29
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| Atlantius |
Posted on 11-11-2013 10:46
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Team Leader
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TheManxMissile wrote:
Ollfardh wrote:
CRITERIA FOR ELIGIBLE RIDERS:
-Born before 01/01/1980
- Range of AVG riders must be 70 or below
I doesn't say it only applies for 1 pair of riders. Unless it got changed in a later post somewhere..
Age is easy
Range is just highest to lowest. Hence the 80 must have 60, 79 with 61. But the rest of the wording gives the impression that the overall AVG must be 70 or below. And looking back i'm even more confused now... Some answers to questions suggested range, and some overall average... And apparently i'm not the only one
I had a longer exchange with the Rider in this thread to determine that and if those posts have been read there should be absolutely no doubt that each single rider over 70 needs to have a corresponding rider bringing the AVG of those two to max. 70.
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 11-11-2013 10:52
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Tour de France Champion
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Atlantius wrote:
I had a longer exchange with the Rider in this thread to determine that and if those posts have been read there should be absolutely no doubt that each single rider over 70 needs to have a corresponding rider bringing the AVG of those two to max. 70.
Each single rider over 70 needs to have a corresponding rider bringing the AVG of those two to max. 70.
That is not Range, that is Average. If it was the highest and lowest rider only, that is Range.
If it is every rider, then it is Average.
So is it Range of 70??? whatever that means (Range is gap between highest and lowest, so 70 would not be possible in PCM or mean any combination ever)...
Or is it Average of 70? Where the overall average of the squad is 70.
Or is it Median value of 70? Where the mid point of the highest and lowest riders is 70
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 11-11-2013 10:55
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World Champion
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I understood it as that for example your team had to look like:
79-61
75-65
72-68
71-69
70
With the lower value allowed to be lower of course.
But we'll have to see what The Rider says I guess
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| Atlantius |
Posted on 11-11-2013 11:02
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Team Leader
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TheManxMissile wrote:
Atlantius wrote:
I had a longer exchange with the Rider in this thread to determine that and if those posts have been read there should be absolutely no doubt that each single rider over 70 needs to have a corresponding rider bringing the AVG of those two to max. 70.
Each single rider over 70 needs to have a corresponding rider bringing the AVG of those two to max. 70.
That is not Range, that is Average. If it was the highest and lowest rider only, that is Range.
If it is every rider, then it is Average.
So is it Range of 70??? whatever that means (Range is gap between highest and lowest, so 70 would not be possible in PCM or mean any combination ever)...
Or is it Average of 70? Where the overall average of the squad is 70.
Or is it Median value of 70? Where the mid point of the highest and lowest riders is 70
Pairwise average. For the highest ranked rider you have to have 1 rider who can make the AVG of those two riders to a max of 70.
Pretty sure Ollfardh is right.
Ollfardh wrote:
I understood it as that for example your team had to look like:
79-61
75-65
72-68
71-69
70
With the lower value allowed to be lower of course.
But we'll have to see what The Rider says I guess
It might now have been made completely clear in the rules-post, but to me it was made perfectly clear in the thread before the draft started.
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 11-11-2013 11:04
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Tour de France Champion
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Well that system is neither Range, Average nor Median...
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| Atlantius |
Posted on 11-11-2013 11:09
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Team Leader
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TMM: Doesn't really matter: It's the rules and has been explained by The Rider
The Rider wrote:
Atlantius The range is between exactly 2 riders (the single highest and the single lowest).
That only leaves it open if the rule is for all riders or just the highest level.
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 11-11-2013 11:19
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Tour de France Champion
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Atlantius wrote:
TMM: Doesn't really matter: It's the rules and has been explained by The Rider
The Rider wrote:
Atlantius The range is between exactly 2 riders (the single highest and the single lowest).
That only leaves it open if the rule is for all riders or just the highest level.
Explanation that is not clear is no explanation at all.
The constant reference to Range, but also to overall Average, is confusing. If it is ONLY the highest and lowest riders, then that is Range and range only. But if so it was very poorly explained in the Rules post, and then not really cleared up by the detailed explanation in the post.
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| Atlantius |
Posted on 11-11-2013 11:33
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Team Leader
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TMM: If it's not clear to you then perhaps you should have asked sooner? I was in as much a doubt as you are now so I asked several times to make it perfectly clear until his answer to me was clear.
You can't expect everyone to have a good overview of statistical terms. I think you have made it clear that you don't think "range" is the correct term. Now it's time to move a step ahead and actually try to understand what he's explaining. You of any should understand that people doesn't always understand things the right way so it's necessary to ask questions of you find the explanation unclear.
The debate ending in the post I quoted (and linked to) made it perfectly clear for me that the limit is an AVG value, but only calculated on two riders at a time and not on the entire roster.
In my book it's way too late to start bitching over unclear rules now. We do need to know before the final round if it's only for the best AVG rider or for the entire team (as sketched by Ollfardh)
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 11-11-2013 11:59
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Tour de France Champion
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Makes little difference to me either way, but i guess some others are also annoyed. I did ask about the AVG thing, and i thought i understood it (as average of all riders being 70 or below). Apparently my understanding was wrong.
I know not everyone will get mathematical terms, especially when second languages are involved, hence why the rules have to be especially clear. The use of the word Range will guide anyone to think of the normal mathematical meaning (gap between highest and lowest value). If The Rider did not mean this, then he should not use Range (capital R). Then he started mixing the ideas of Range and Average, because it seems he meant neither in their mathematical ways. Instead this other system which has a mix of the two.
And frankly i still can't tell if it's meant to be an overall average of 70 or whether the middle value between certain riders has to be 70 or below.
I'd also say that post doesn't end the debate, as you yourself say you are unclear whether it applies to all riders, or just the highest and lowest AVG riders.
That only leaves it open if the rule is for all riders or just the highest level.
I'd also say that perhaps that explanation should have been put in the Rules post on page 1. Especially as that post has been updated a few times with other clarifications following debate/misunderstanding.
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![imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg](https://imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg)
