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PCM.daily DB Stats discussion
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| Kristoffer |
Posted on 20-07-2013 18:59
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Under 23
Posts: 82
Joined: 23-04-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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carmelobymelo wrote:
Kristoffer wrote:
carmelobymelo wrote:
Froome
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Quintana, Purito
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Nibali, Valverde, Porte
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Contador, Kreuziger, Uran, VDB
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Betancur, Wiggins, Fuglsang, Mollema, Ten Dam, Scarponi, Nieve, Hesjedal, Evans, Majka, Moreno
Betancur is way above Ten Dam, probably above Mollema, Fuglsang, Nieve and Hesjedal as well. Def above Evans and also above Scarponi as well. A bit over Moreno, and maybe +1 on Majka, even thought ending up pretty close in the Giro.
Wiggins hasn't showed anything this year, will not show up at the Giro and is probably finished as a GT-rider if you ask me.
Rest looks fine to me, just dont give Quintana to high ACC, as I dont think hes very impressive there.
Did not show it at the Giro, maybe in third week but still finished after Evans.
Yes he did. Beating him on every hard mountainstage (at least with uphill finish). Lost 13 sec to Evans on the TTT and 4.40 on the first ITT (total of 4.53). Finished 1.36 behind in the GC, and would probably have overtaken him if the snow hadent cancelled stage 19th. You do the math. |
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| SweatyViking |
Posted on 20-07-2013 19:09
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1040
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Froome should have a lower REC than Quintana and Purito. He has underperformed in the Alps. |
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| valverde321 |
Posted on 20-07-2013 19:36
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World Champion
Posts: 12986
Joined: 20-05-2009
PCM$: 530.00
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baseballlover312 wrote:
valverde321 wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
ruben wrote:
I disagree giving Mollema low rec just because he became ill.
In the Vuelta 2011 he was still very strong at the end (Pena Cabarga).
You'd better give him low RES instead.
Resistance has no effect.
Am I missing something? I thought it had an effect in the game or else it would be useless to include as a stat....
According to tests it has no effect. Check out the attributes thread.
Edit: At least not in 3D.
It effects AI though, doesn't it?
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| jph27 |
Posted on 20-07-2013 19:38
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Team Leader
Posts: 7314
Joined: 20-03-2010
PCM$: 900.00
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What MO would you give Bardet? I'd say 77, considering that without the crosswinds and TTs he would have finished around about Mollema and Fuglsang. |
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 20-07-2013 19:39
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 16362
Joined: 27-07-2011
PCM$: 10038.70
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valverde321 wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
valverde321 wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
ruben wrote:
I disagree giving Mollema low rec just because he became ill.
In the Vuelta 2011 he was still very strong at the end (Pena Cabarga).
You'd better give him low RES instead.
Resistance has no effect.
Am I missing something? I thought it had an effect in the game or else it would be useless to include as a stat....
According to tests it has no effect. Check out the attributes thread.
Edit: At least not in 3D.
It effects AI though, doesn't it?
IDK
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 20-07-2013 19:39
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 16362
Joined: 27-07-2011
PCM$: 10038.70
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jph27 wrote:
What MO would you give Bardet? I'd say 77, considering that without the crosswinds and TTs he would have finished around about Mollema and Fuglsang.
I'd say 76 for Bardet
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 29-09-2024 02:25
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| admirschleck |
Posted on 20-07-2013 19:47
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Team Leader
Posts: 6690
Joined: 11-10-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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valverde321 wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
valverde321 wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
ruben wrote:
I disagree giving Mollema low rec just because he became ill.
In the Vuelta 2011 he was still very strong at the end (Pena Cabarga).
You'd better give him low RES instead.
Resistance has no effect.
Am I missing something? I thought it had an effect in the game or else it would be useless to include as a stat....
According to tests it has no effect. Check out the attributes thread.
Edit: At least not in 3D.
It effects AI though, doesn't it?
Yep.
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 20-07-2013 19:48
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 16362
Joined: 27-07-2011
PCM$: 10038.70
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admirschleck wrote:
valverde321 wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
valverde321 wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
ruben wrote:
I disagree giving Mollema low rec just because he became ill.
In the Vuelta 2011 he was still very strong at the end (Pena Cabarga).
You'd better give him low RES instead.
Resistance has no effect.
Am I missing something? I thought it had an effect in the game or else it would be useless to include as a stat....
According to tests it has no effect. Check out the attributes thread.
Edit: At least not in 3D.
It effects AI though, doesn't it?
Yep.
OK
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| mat4404 |
Posted on 20-07-2013 20:52
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Under 23
Posts: 81
Joined: 05-04-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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Mollema's REC should, IMO, be ~75. It's decent and he shouldn;t be penalised for being ill. He was decent back end of Vuelta '11. Furthermore, I don't think the stats should be purely based on most recent performances. Ten Dam for me would be 77 Mou and 69 REC as he has no excuse or previous form to ecplain away his poor final week.
Contador should be lower than he has been previously, but not below 80. He rode a poor 3rd week though so his fabled fabulous third week shouldn't be attributed too much weight. I'd give him REC of ~78.
I would really guard against overrating riders based on the final week of the Tour. For example, Talansky is a great talent, but the first 2 weeks he was dropping off the back with 20 odd riders still in the peloton. He was much better today and yesterday so should have high REC though. I would rate he and Kwiatkowski at the same MOU with a decent difference in REC. After all, Kwiatek was outperforming Talansky in week 1 & 2. For example:
Talansky 76 MOU REC 78
Kwiatkowski 76 Mou REC 71
I would rate the "top" Tour riders in MOU & REC as follows:
Froome 83/79
Quintana 82/80
Rodriguez 81/80
Contador 80/78
Porte 80/79
Valverde 80/77
Kreuziger 79/76
Mollema 79/75
Fuglsang 78/77
Nieve 77/78
Ten Dam 77/69
Talansky 76/78
Kwiatowski 76/71
Bardet 75/75
Navarro 75/74
Monfort 75/77
Edited by mat4404 on 20-07-2013 20:54
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 20-07-2013 20:54
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 16362
Joined: 27-07-2011
PCM$: 10038.70
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Once again I feel recovery is underestimated. Ten Dam shouldn't even have 70 recovery. He had worse recovery than most guys in the Tour mid 60s for me.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| AiZaK |
Posted on 20-07-2013 21:05
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1190
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In my opinion:
Froome 83
Quintana 82
Purito 81
Nibali 81
Porte 80/81
Valverde 80
Contador 80
Kreuziger 79
V.d.Broek 79
Wiggins 78
Dani Moreno 78
Mikel Nieve 78
Mollema 78/79
Ten Dam 77
Gesink 76/77
Samuel Sanchez 78
Talansky 78
Anton 77
Pinot 77
Hesjedal 77
Dani Navarro 77
Van Garderen 77
Evans 78
Rui Costa 77
De Clerq 76/77
Andy Schleck 76
Jeannesson 75
Riblon 75/76
Bakelants (Fighter 80, Flat 73, Mountain 74)
Ruben Plaza (Flat 71/72, Mountain 73)
Kittel 82 (Sprint)
Edited by AiZaK on 20-07-2013 21:08
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| AiZaK |
Posted on 20-07-2013 21:07
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1190
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Upsss I forgot Kwiatkowski 76/77 (Mountain)
Edited by AiZaK on 20-07-2013 21:07
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| Kaimelar |
Posted on 20-07-2013 21:15
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Under 23
Posts: 93
Joined: 20-06-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Lower the sprint stat of climbers/stage-racers, since it doesn't effect mountain top finishes anyway, so we won't see them in top 10-20 during bunch sprints(in my career nibali got 3rd and quintana 5th giro last stage bunch finish ), of course I didn't mean valverde/kwiatkowski etc. |
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| ruben |
Posted on 20-07-2013 21:17
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7721
Joined: 23-10-2006
PCM$: 200.00
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baseballlover312 wrote:
Once again I feel recovery is underestimated. Ten Dam shouldn't even have 70 recovery. He had worse recovery than most guys in the Tour mid 60s for me.
/And once again you shouldn't base recovery on the Tour for Ten Dam. He fell hard in the time trial and injured his back. This is his reason for sucking the final 3 days
In the Vuelta 2012 he was strong in the 3rd week. |
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 20-07-2013 21:28
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 16362
Joined: 27-07-2011
PCM$: 10038.70
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ruben wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
Once again I feel recovery is underestimated. Ten Dam shouldn't even have 70 recovery. He had worse recovery than most guys in the Tour mid 60s for me.
/And once again you shouldn't base recovery on the Tour for Ten Dam. He fell hard in the time trial and injured his back. This is his reason for sucking the final 3 days
In the Vuelta 2012 he was strong in the 3rd week.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| valverde321 |
Posted on 20-07-2013 21:41
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World Champion
Posts: 12986
Joined: 20-05-2009
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AiZaK wrote:
In my opinion:
Froome 83
Quintana 82
Purito 81
Nibali 81
Porte 80 (He will probably develop into a GT winner in PCM anyway, but having him 80 means he's more likely to help Froome for the 1st season)
Valverde 80
Contador 79 - We all want him to be as good as before, but lets face it, Kreuziger looked better than him on most climbs
Kreuziger 79
V.d.Broek 79
Wiggins 77 - Not many results to go off, but apparently he's lost all motivation to train in the mountains so I doubt he'll ever be as good as last season, maybe not even this high
Dani Moreno 78
Mikel Nieve 78
Mollema 78/79
Ten Dam 77
Gesink 76/77
Samuel Sanchez 77/76 - He's not as good as before
Talansky 77 - Terrible 1st week better 3rd week but still not at the level of Moreno or Nieve
Anton 75/76 He;s not as good as that. Alright on the hills though.
Pinot 77
Hesjedal 77
Dani Navarro 77
Van Garderen 76
Evans 77
Rui Costa 77
De Clerq 74/75 - At best
Andy Schleck 74/75
Jeannesson 74/75
Riblon 74
Bakelants (Fighter 80, Flat 73, Mountain 74)
Ruben Plaza (Flat 71/72, Mountain 73)
Kittel 82 (Sprint)
Kwiatkowski 76 - At best
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| ruben |
Posted on 20-07-2013 21:46
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7721
Joined: 23-10-2006
PCM$: 200.00
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baseballlover312 wrote:
ruben wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
Once again I feel recovery is underestimated. Ten Dam shouldn't even have 70 recovery. He had worse recovery than most guys in the Tour mid 60s for me.
/And once again you shouldn't base recovery on the Tour for Ten Dam. He fell hard in the time trial and injured his back. This is his reason for sucking the final 3 days
In the Vuelta 2012 he was strong in the 3rd week.
Do I need to post the video's of the interviews with Ten Dam here? |
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 20-07-2013 21:54
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 16362
Joined: 27-07-2011
PCM$: 10038.70
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If Talansky has 77 his recovery should be 80.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| Le Kaydale |
Posted on 20-07-2013 22:03
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Amateur
Posts: 15
Joined: 17-07-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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I agree Talansky having about 79-80 recovery... at Tour he shows up in 3rd week. At Vuelta '12 he was the only one who actually tried to attack the "Big 4" on one of the later mountain stages, after being quiet in earlier stages and the time trial. |
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| mat4404 |
Posted on 20-07-2013 23:53
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Under 23
Posts: 81
Joined: 05-04-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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baseballlover312 wrote:
If Talansky has 77 his recovery should be 80.
Maybe so. His best performances always appear to be at the back end of a race. Vuelta '12, Dauphine '13, Tour '13 - The final mountain stage was his best performance in each race. I just don't see why the last weeks worth of racing should count so favourably.
In relation to the long list posted above, Dani Navarro not a 78 in the mountains. He is an average climber at best. I'd give him 75 with solid recovery also. Ironically, if he'd been a better climber he'd be further down the final GC as the peloton would never have let him go on stage 19 if he were within 15 mins of the lead. |
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