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Updated DB and Training List 2023
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| roturn |
Posted on 30-08-2023 07:40
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Team Manager
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- Grieg training (  ) published
- Jacobsen training for Gjensidige back in place
- Polar training in
- Joao Rodrigues 2 trainings only |
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| SotD |
Posted on 30-08-2023 08:37
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World Champion
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There they are those pesky cobbles 
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 21-11-2024 14:55
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| Fabianski |
Posted on 30-08-2023 08:55
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Grand Tour Specialist
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+++ Update +++
The Top 3 training teams remain the same, but Grieg take 4th place with their two big cobbles trainings. Polar just make the Top 10 as well.
| Team | Money | | Aker - MOT | € 4’250’000 | | ELCO - ABEA | € 4’075’000 | | King Power | € 3’200’000 | | Grieg-Maersk | € 3’000’000 | | Moser - Sygic | € 2’800’000 | | Team Puma - SAP | € 2’600’000 | | Xero Racing | € 2’600’000 | | Gjensidige Pro Cycling Team | € 2’525’000 | | Assa Abloy | € 2’200’000 | | Polar | € 1’900’000 | | Los Pollos Hermanos | € 1’850’000 | | Lierse SK - Pizza Ullo PCTeam | € 1’825’000 | | Carlsberg - Danske Bank | € 1’700’000 | | EA Vesuvio | € 1’700’000 | | Cedevita | € 1’550’000 | | Binance | € 1’525’000 | | Sony - Force India | € 1’400’000 | | Tinkoff - La Datcha Team | € 1’400’000 | | Fastned | € 1’400’000 | | DuckDuckGo - Everesting | € 1’300’000 | | ISA - Hexacta | € 1’300’000 | | Indosat Ooredoo | € 1’200’000 | | DK Zalgiris | € 1’200’000 | | Tryg - Gobik | € 1’000’000 | | ZARA - Irizar | € 850’000 | | Zwift Pro Cycling | € 850’000 | | Evonik - ELKO | € 700’000 | | Lidl Cycling | € 700’000 | | Kraftwerk Man Machine | € 700’000 | | Team UBS - Tissot | € 675’000 | | cycleYorkshire | € 350’000 | | Gazelle | € 275’000 | | Team Würth MODYF | € 225’000 | | SEE Turtles | € 150’000 | | Lampre - Pinarello | € 125’000 | | MOL Cycling Team | € 100’000 |
Mountain still the favorite stat to train - even more so after the Bernal training. Cobbles training on top level in almost half the cases - actually 7/9 trainings are 79+...
Downhill and Fighter have been added to the list as well - leaving energy stats and prologue the only untrained skills.
| Stat | # Increases | # 80+ | | Mountain | 22 | 6 | | Hill | 15 | 5 | | TT | 13 | 3 | | Sprint | 10 | 3 | | Cobbles | 9 | 4 | | Downhill | 2 | 0 | | Flat | 1 | 0 | | Acceleration | 1 | 0 | | Fighter | 1 | 0 |
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| Fabianski |
Posted on 30-08-2023 13:54
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Grand Tour Specialist
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TheManxMissile wrote:
I do appreciate Gjensidige blowing the curve in a year of really low CT training overall
I wouldn't be surprised if the Coyotes still had some money lying around after the Ahlstrand deal, maybe training isn't included yet?
Otherwise, as you know from own experience, in CT it's mostly relegating teams doing training, the others rather spending the money on loans or on improving their roster... I guess Strava spent their money on Roglic and Bauhaus, not a single sale to make money. Crabbe surely suffer from the fact that they spent 1M getting rid of Carapaz instead of actually making cash with him, so likely no money left...
I guess returning CT teams would need to sell their leaders to get a significant amount of training cash, so not surprised to not see more training 
But yeah, Gjensidige may well have set a record here - their sales went amazingly well I'd say, and easily covered their renewals fine (supposing one looking at transfer DB wages). I thought my € 1,850,000 was big money last year, but they just spent 700k more
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 30-08-2023 14:19
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 16429
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Grieg out here trying to end my whole career.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 30-08-2023 14:28
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World Champion
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I thought that was Garby & Asbjorn Kragh Andersen?
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| whitejersey |
Posted on 30-08-2023 19:51
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Classics Specialist
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A lot of hills training in PCT this year, combined with a few trainings in cobbles as well will really impact our scoring this season, don't think we will relegate but we're going to miss out on a lot more points than I initially thought we would.
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| SotD |
Posted on 31-08-2023 09:14
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World Champion
Posts: 12186
Joined: 29-11-2006
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I think maybe we should consider some sort of discount for the PRL training if it combines with f.e. TT.
A lot of top TT'ers are somewhat hindered from being significantly better by the variation in TT and PRL.
IMO it would be worthwhile to consider than +1TT opened the door for adding +1PRL a half cost aswell, to make it a little bit more attractive.
Likewise I think maybe the physical stats could be calculated differently. It doesn't make sense to train a 71RES rider to 72 or 73 when the OVL is the decider. Maybe we should consider removing the OVL restriction altogether for physical stats and maybe the FIG stat aswell.
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| Mresuperstar |
Posted on 31-08-2023 13:07
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 8056
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SotD wrote:
I think maybe we should consider some sort of discount for the PRL training if it combines with f.e. TT.
A lot of top TT'ers are somewhat hindered from being significantly better by the variation in TT and PRL.
IMO it would be worthwhile to consider than +1TT opened the door for adding +1PRL a half cost aswell, to make it a little bit more attractive.
Likewise I think maybe the physical stats could be calculated differently. It doesn't make sense to train a 71RES rider to 72 or 73 when the OVL is the decider. Maybe we should consider removing the OVL restriction altogether for physical stats and maybe the FIG stat aswell.
I second both of these points.
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| jph27 |
Posted on 31-08-2023 13:19
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Team Leader
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I'd even consider going further and removing the use of the OVL as a determiner of training cost full stop - or at least for stats below a certain level (75 perhaps?) - as it is becoming quite restrictive as we add more versatile riders. Take vdP for example, where training him to 77 HIL was going to cost the same as any other one stat training, which doesn't make sense considering the relative impact.
Obviously there will be scenarios where this makes it too easy to make a rider too strong, but it shouldn't be too difficult to put restrictions in place to prevent that. In terms of overall impact it might actually lead to a reduction in the number of 80+ trainings, which would be welcome, as well as giving managers more development options as they would know they could then focus on weaknesses with training. |
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| Ezeefreak |
Posted on 31-08-2023 13:30
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Domestique
Posts: 555
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Interesting discussion here and now I have even another idea 
Instead of Traning a single stat maybe you can change it into something like buying training camps that train multiple (corresponding) stats. Similar (but obviously not identical) to the leveling up process for riders. Like said earlier it doesnt make a lot sense that you train mutliple times TT and then the rider still has like 80tt but 65 PRL. I think that goes for a lot stats that are just "connected" to each other.
Though this would be still best to link the cost to the OVL then more than to a single stat.
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| Fabianski |
Posted on 31-08-2023 13:36
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4667
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SotD wrote:
I think maybe we should consider some sort of discount for the PRL training if it combines with f.e. TT.
A lot of top TT'ers are somewhat hindered from being significantly better by the variation in TT and PRL.
IMO it would be worthwhile to consider than +1TT opened the door for adding +1PRL a half cost aswell, to make it a little bit more attractive.
Likewise I think maybe the physical stats could be calculated differently. It doesn't make sense to train a 71RES rider to 72 or 73 when the OVL is the decider. Maybe we should consider removing the OVL restriction altogether for physical stats and maybe the FIG stat aswell.
I can get the point with PRL training getting a discount when also training TT. If you get stronger over long distances, you usually improve in shorter races, too. However, this would also mean that pure prologue specialists - who don't get lots of races to compete in anyway - would lose some of their advantage, as "normal" TTers, who have significantly higher scoring potential, would get closer to or even match their level. Changing the rules for PRL training would require some more thoughtwork, e.g. you only get the discount when TT is at least as high as PRL (otherwise you could train someone to 65 TT and 80+ PRL by still having the discount).
If some discount should be introduced, maybe add this for sprinters then as well, given that this would reflect the Track-Sprint path.
On the energy stats, some cost reduction would be justified if it turns out that the energy system change with the new PCM version really has a big impact. For example, I'm currently thinking of sacrificing some of Schmid's Mo/Hi to get +2 Stamina, as if I have to train his Sta to make him competitive, it would cost me 1M per stat gain. Whereas with reduced energy stat training cost, it would pretty much be a no-brainer. So I think that some classification in "main stats" and "backup stats", having different costs each, might make sense.
On the other hand, I like the current training rules because of them being pretty simple and easy to understand. Whereas I totally get the idea behind these suggestions - and I agree with them - I'm not necessarily in favor of making rules more complicated. If it's just a two-category system, with each category having its separate cost scale, I could live with it, though.
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| SotD |
Posted on 31-08-2023 14:09
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World Champion
Posts: 12186
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Maybe we should consider making a team of 4-5 relatively experienced managers getting together and compiling a new rule set regarding training, where the fixed objective is - don't make it more complex.
Eg., despite hurting me a lot I think it's a stat gain thing to make sure a rider like Giannoutsos doesn't end up with sub-70 ACC. If you want the GT package, it shouldn't be cheap and easy to also get him to 74ACC, as it would if we dropped the OVL exemption altogether. Same basically goes for FL. It's pretty expensive to make a good rider 70+FL as the OVL makes sure it is expensive. Coquard f.e. would have been 75-76FL if it wasn't the OVL that was the decider, which would have made him a much better rider. But paying a 80 stat fee to move him from 73 to 74 makes no sense - And this is something that defends his competitors - Exactly as it should.
But a lot of secondary stats or stats that have very limited uses could do with an enhancement imo.
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 31-08-2023 14:23
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 16429
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In the past I've agreed with the sentiment that TT and PRL should be connected for training, but is that really necessary at this point? TT is clearly getting trained plenty anyway, as this list shows. The calendar and OVL formula make TT valuable enough to overcome that hiccup these days. And keeping them separate defends the prologue specialists from extinction when they are already cheated out of results by weird AI a lot of the time.
However, to the extent that planning for needing both TT/PRL forces a lot of managers to pick the Stage Race dev paths instead of one of the climbers, I can see a change being necessary. As I've said before though, I think that's more because Stage Race is currently an OP training path that takes an exhorbinant number of riders, especially those of lower potential, who would be cooler but overall weaker going with one of the climbers, TT, or fighter under the current system. But since Stage Race is the only path that consistently boosts 3 main stats, it's kind of the default. I think it could use a nerf (after Skjelmose develops ), but I guess that's for another discussion.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| Blasing |
Posted on 31-08-2023 14:51
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 278
Joined: 27-06-2011
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A couple of questions for this:
1. can we still train our riders for the upcoming season?
2. what else can money that is left after transfers be used for, if not training? Is there a mid-season trade/transfer window?
3. Can we take money that is left over to next season?
Manager of JEWA TIROL Cycling Team
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 31-08-2023 14:58
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 16429
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Blasing wrote:
A couple of questions for this:
1. can we still train our riders for the upcoming season?
2. what else can money that is left after transfers be used for, if not training? Is there a mid-season trade/transfer window?
3. Can we take money that is left over to next season?
1.) Up to the admins, as this is technically supposed to be done by the time you submit your transfer sheet, but since there isn't a new DB yet, it may still be possible.
2.) Money can only be used on rider purchases during the transfer season, wildcard packages, or training. There is no mid-season trade window, only at the end of each season.
3.) A certain percentage of your leftover budget from one year is carried over to the next transfer season, but not the entire amount. Only the admins know the exact percentage.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| Blasing |
Posted on 31-08-2023 15:22
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 278
Joined: 27-06-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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Oh okay, so it would be smart to use training now (if possible), as otherwise only a part of my money left will be caried over?
Not that it is a big sum as a new CT team, but still
Manager of JEWA TIROL Cycling Team
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| Fabianski |
Posted on 31-08-2023 15:28
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4667
Joined: 29-09-2018
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Minimum training cost is € 100,000, so if you have more than this left, it could be spent on training. Or, as bbl said, you could take part of it to the next transfer window, potentially allowing you to spend more money on new riders, or on some more significant training (those 100k are for training one stat to 65 at most).
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| knockout |
Posted on 31-08-2023 15:43
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Grand Tour Champion
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Blasing wrote:
Oh okay, so it would be smart to use training now (if possible), as otherwise only a part of my money left will be caried over?
Not that it is a big sum as a new CT team, but still
Not necessarily. Depending on your riders and your goals for this season, carrying the cash over to next season could help your team more long-term than spending it now. Training is rarely the best use of money in CT (but most other options are not available at this point).
A Big Thank You To All MG Reporters! |
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| Blasing |
Posted on 31-08-2023 15:59
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 278
Joined: 27-06-2011
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Thanks for the help guys!
Manager of JEWA TIROL Cycling Team
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