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Hill stat is not working at all right now
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| tellico |
Posted on 27-06-2017 20:57
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 263
Joined: 13-09-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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Sounds pretty reasonably. |
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| Masterblaster01 |
Posted on 27-06-2017 23:48
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 362
Joined: 07-03-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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That sounds good to me 
I think this system shows lots of potential, it's about tweaking it just right and that will take some time i guess.
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| cio93 |
Posted on 28-06-2017 03:22
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World Champion
Posts: 10845
Joined: 29-10-2007
PCM$: 500.00
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Cyanide assumes that you get the opportunity to empty a full yellow bar at the end of a race and that the only reason for 70% efforts is because you don't understand the race situation.
Can anyone give me insight on how this works in reality on extreme difficulty? Are the bars that much more forgiving now?
I've only seen extensive gameplay on normal so far, and that already looked like a big struggle.
Oh, and the first two "fixes" are only for the AI, right?
Personally, I couldn't care less if Gilbert or Alaphilippe wins all Ardennes classics when I'm not playing with Quickstep, that has never been relevant to me in this discussion.
It's about me playing with them, not against them.
I'm not frustrated if AI Gilbert finishes 104th in AGR.
So that means that below 85% effort, nothing will change for the player at all.
Edited by cio93 on 28-06-2017 03:45
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| jasperdeman |
Posted on 29-06-2017 11:51
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Amateur
Posts: 5
Joined: 05-07-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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I feel like they should maybe just adjust the system to match to contemporary scientific beliefs around energy systems in athletes. Combine that with weight and wind resistance simulations and you can have a pretty realistic simulation I think.
Although there is some scientific debate around the Power-Duration model of Andrew Coggan, it could provide a very good basis for simulation purposes.
Give riders a:
Pmax: maximum power they can achieve for a few seconds during a sprint in Watts
FTP: maximum average power they can achieve for a long time (~60minutes) in Watts
Functional Reserve Capacity (FRC): the total amount of work you can do during continuous exercise above your FTP before fatigue occurs. Units are kJ or J/kg.
This combined with weights and "specialisations" (like TT is more than just power it is also positioning on the bike - or sprinting is also about being able to position) and fatique parameters could provide a solid basis for simulation.
Then putting a rider on 100% puts them on their FTP.
And then (depending on the rider) they can hold 115% for (for example) 5 minutes, a short hill climb.
And here is where the differences can be made:
Two riders of equal weight, one climber and punchier hill specialist.
On a hill:
The climber has a higher FTP (400W) but smaller FRC, so can hold 110% for 5 minutes (440W).
The puncheur has a lower FTP (380W) but can hold 120% for 5 minutes (456W).
Puncheur "wins"
On a climb:
The climber has a higher FTP (400W) but smaller FRC, so can hold 103% for 30 minutes (412W).
The puncheur has a lower FTP (380W) but can hold 104% for 30 minutes (395W).
Climber "wins"
It might be complicated at first, but having mathematical scientific models as the basis for a Cycling Simulation game makes more sense to me then having arbitrary Stats on a scale from 55 to 85 and creating difficult balancing models on these stats to represent reality.
As cycling fanatics many of us know about power nowadays and we see more and more of it during races, why PCM still uses Heartrate is weird. |
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| LuckyLukas |
Posted on 03-07-2017 22:25
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Under 23
Posts: 62
Joined: 29-06-2016
PCM$: 200.00
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I know that Cyanide is currently working on the hill stat but if i understood alright the hill stat begins with effort 85 and effort 100 uses 100 % hill stat. I recently played TDU with Bora and tried to do well with Sagan in the GC. I finally managed to beat Porte and other climbers on Willunga Hill (on extreme) and became 2 overall.
It just doesn't make sense to me because you can climb that hill with an average effort of 90. That would mean 66% mountain stat, 33% hill stat. With this ratio Porte should crush riders like Sagan on a 4 k climb. I know that other stats like acceleration also matter but on a climb like this it should be almost impossible to beat climbers like Porte with Puncheurs.
Edited by LuckyLukas on 03-07-2017 23:12
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| cunego59 |
Posted on 04-07-2017 21:02
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Team Manager
Posts: 6508
Joined: 14-09-2008
PCM$: 1090.00
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New patch is out, and the hill issue is among the changes:
The HIL stat has been tweaked to improve performance of Punchers who are bad Climbers, like Gilbert, for example.
- The yellow energy bar has been tweaked to decrease more slowly.
- The MO stat is now 100% used on a slope of 7% incline.
- The Effort where the HIL stat acts at 100% is now set at 96%, previously was 100%.
- In a uphill sprint, Punchers will now increase their effort to better use their HIL stat.
- Punchers that are bad Climbers are better evaluated on hilly classics
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| Paul23 |
Posted on 04-07-2017 21:05
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4411
Joined: 10-08-2011
PCM$: 400.00
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"- The MO stat is now 100% used on a slope of 7% incline."
rip Cauberg
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| Thatguyeveryonehates |
Posted on 04-07-2017 21:11
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Domestique
Posts: 447
Joined: 01-05-2014
PCM$: 200.00
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they finally fixed the small groups sprints |
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| trekbmc |
Posted on 28-02-2018 08:43
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Team Leader
Posts: 7366
Joined: 11-07-2014
PCM$: 700.00
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Like, if an 8 man group comes to a flat finish the best sprinters will win rather than the best positioned riders? If that's so that's actually amazing.  
"What done is, is one." - Benji Naesen
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| bah |
Posted on 28-02-2018 09:26
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Under 23
Posts: 70
Joined: 16-07-2017
PCM$: 200.00
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Why are you answering posts from July? |
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 24-11-2024 02:38
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Bot Agent
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Joined: 23.11.09
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| trekbmc |
Posted on 28-02-2018 09:37
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Team Leader
Posts: 7366
Joined: 11-07-2014
PCM$: 700.00
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Oh, lol a spambot must've bumped the thread or something.
Damn, I got excited there. 
"What done is, is one." - Benji Naesen
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