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PCM.daily DB Stats discussion
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 28-05-2014 08:11
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World Champion
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gotlandrules wrote:
And Sagan really needs to be lowered in HI, he will be able to get realistic results with 75-76 HI and hopefully his schedule gets more realistic aswell.
He will never win the green jersey with these stats, as his hill was main advantage on Cav and Kittel. Shit calendar managment is here to blame, it seems like Sagan has his goals from 2011 hardcoded into the game and thus he goes for vuelta and adennes. 
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| Shonak |
Posted on 28-05-2014 08:33
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Tour de France Champion
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He still has a huge hill advantage over Cav and Kittel with 75 HL oO
Plus, with the high fighter stat and the solid mountain stats, he contests in many hilly stages as well as at the intermediate sprints of MT stages.
If you wonder if he goes into breakaways: Actually, it's more likely with lower Hill stat, since he won't be considered so much a favourite. (EDIT: In case you're wondering, Sagan wins the Green Jersey on a regular basis if his form is solid)
Don't think his goals are hardcoded: Sagan goes always MSR, Flanders, Tour and WC since I reduced his Hill stat. Like in Cio's career, Sagan oftentimes ended up riding the Vuelta as a wrong GC contender (not even contesting sprint stages against Cav eg).
Edited by Shonak on 28-05-2014 08:37
"It’s a little bit scary when Contador attacks." - Tommy V
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 28-05-2014 08:48
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World Champion
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It seems that we both have different game installed,are you talking about PCM13? Because in 90% in my careers, Cav or Kittel win the green even with Sagan present, even with his 78hill, so i would be really surprised to see him doing it "regulary" with 75. How many careers do you tried after lowering him to 75 so you are able to talk about regularity?
Fighter is irrelevant, as it is barely functional stat. Only secondary stat that matters is acceleration...
Edited by Avin Wargunnson on 28-05-2014 08:48
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| Shonak |
Posted on 28-05-2014 09:10
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Tour de France Champion
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The reasoning behind it makes it already clear in my eyes why that is the case: With lower Hill stat, the AI treats him more like a sprinter, thus he focuses stronger on le Tour (He has 80 SP in my DB, thus he's closer to Cav and Kittel than in the PCMDB). Of course, when a guy like Kittel is dominating every sprint, chances are, Sagan won't have a shot at Green either. But I havn't experienced such a Tour yet in my few PCM careers.
I've played a few seasons in PCM 2013 (don't own it for so long), though I admit that the same issue arose to me first in PCM 2012 - where it worked similiarly. Certainly too little careers to give you a representative sample in PCM2013 though, so scuzzi for the exaggeration. He did end up targeting the Vuelta though, and other guys said so too.
AI-stuff aside, I still think that Sagan results justify only at best a 75-76 HL stat (up to discussion). Anything above 76 is too much based upon his virtues, the hype surrounding him and too much focus on his very few, tough hill-results in my opinion.
Edited by Shonak on 28-05-2014 09:12
"It’s a little bit scary when Contador attacks." - Tommy V
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 28-05-2014 09:16
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World Champion
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Shonak wrote:
AI-stuff aside, I still think that Sagan results justify only at best a 75-76 HL stat (up to discussion). Anything above 76 is too much based upon his virtues, the hype surrounding him and too much focus on his very few, tough hill-results in my opinion.
I give up really. 
Btw why do you discuss Daily stats and talk about how it is in you game, when you dont use Daily DB, that is pointless. How i am supposed to know you have upped his sprint stat...
Edited by Avin Wargunnson on 28-05-2014 09:17
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| Shonak |
Posted on 28-05-2014 09:22
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Tour de France Champion
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I do use Daily DB so of course I discuss stat changes in here.
Nice of you to highlight my text: You should highlight the passage tough hill for yourself the most though.
Also, no hype surrounding Sagan? You don't think that everybody looks at Sagan more than at other riders, that he is causing great mania amongst fans? That he is one of the most talked about riders? That each result is vry much discussed upon? That people expect in fact way too much of such a young guy? What was Mailand San Remo, eh? And at the Ronde? People awaited his first monument win at his age already, but yeah - that's no hype. Everbody talked about Cancellara vs Sagan ahead of Flanders, but erm... yeah, okay. Yeah, sure. No hype at all. 
Edited by Shonak on 28-05-2014 09:31
"It’s a little bit scary when Contador attacks." - Tommy V
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 28-05-2014 09:30
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World Champion
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Shonak wrote:
I do use Daily DB so of course I discuss stat changes in here.
You suggested you used modified stats for some people, i hope we are discussing default Daily stats here...this discussion would be much shorter if it was made clear that he has 80 sprint after your modification, because that changes a lot compared to 78 he has in Daily default iirc.
And i higlighted the part i found ridiculous.
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| Ton1Mart1n |
Posted on 28-05-2014 10:50
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Domestique
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Avin Wargunnson wrote:
It seems that we both have different game installed,are you talking about PCM13? Because in 90% in my careers, Cav or Kittel win the green even with Sagan present, even with his 78hill, so i would be really surprised to see him doing it "regulary" with 75. How many careers do you tried after lowering him to 75 so you are able to talk about regularity?
Fighter is irrelevant, as it is barely functional stat. Only secondary stat that matters is acceleration...
Not only acc, also rest!
“When it’s hurting you, that’s when you can make a difference”
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| Jorge14 |
Posted on 29-05-2014 16:59
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Sagan with 76Hill is nice for him. |
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| Ton1Mart1n |
Posted on 29-05-2014 17:03
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Domestique
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Uran mountain stat? 80 ?
“When it’s hurting you, that’s when you can make a difference”
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| Alakagom |
Posted on 29-05-2014 17:05
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Why? For keeping up with Pozzovivo, Hesjedal Majka, Aru, Rolland and Co.?
And if you mention Quintana in all this, no point for him attacking now he has this massive lead.
Edited by Alakagom on 29-05-2014 17:05
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| gotlandrules |
Posted on 29-05-2014 17:43
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Alakagom, give us your thoughts about Sagan please btw, Aru looks like the strongest climber after Nairo so far, a few big stages left though so we'll see |
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| Aleakez |
Posted on 29-05-2014 17:51
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I don't think Rolland is even in his best form so i see him along with Uran as the best climbers behind Quintana.
" Trust me, you can dance - Vodka "
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| nacho63 |
Posted on 29-05-2014 18:34
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Sprinter
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I think Uran should stay at 78 (just) but raise his TT to 75.
Sagan it's hard to say, I think he has the ability but he doesn't turn up to the big ardennes so I'd give him 77. 2/3 short of the likes of Kwiatek, Gerrans etc.. |
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| Ton1Mart1n |
Posted on 29-05-2014 22:14
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Domestique
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But still Uran finished second last year.
I'll say 79 with possibility to grow to 81 
Sagan hill stat: 78. But Sagan is always unpredictable
“When it’s hurting you, that’s when you can make a difference”
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 29-05-2014 22:18
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Tour de France Champion
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No way. he is always so high in Ardennes and even some mountain stage because of his crazy secondary stats. Any higher than 76 and he will still do that. it's about realistic gameplay not "potential performances."
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 29-05-2014 23:48
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I can't believe that some people are considering Sagan for a 78 hill stat, that would put him as a potential winner for the LBL or GDL. 75 is about right for him which enables him to still compete well in hilly stage races, as his other stats of sprinter, recovery and endurance still make him a huge threat, especially if his form is good on some hilly races.
Back in the 80's and 90's he probably would've challenged more for hilly stages, but since the 00's cycling is more specialized than ever and Sagan has chosen the flatter and cobbled classics as his priority, along with the green jersey in the TDF.
I also can't believe that some people are talking Uran at 80/81 that's the level/almost the level of riders like Nibali. Contador, Rodriguez, Quintana and Froome. Uran at very best would be 79 (which keeps him just above the rest of the pack of riders on 78) his TT at 75 makes him still a good rider and capable of challenging for a podium position in a big tour which is about his level, but he's still not upto winning a big tour.
Edited by Tafiolmo on 29-05-2014 23:50
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| Arberg27 |
Posted on 30-05-2014 07:11
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Aleakez wrote:
I don't think Rolland is even in his best form so i see him along with Uran as the best climbers behind Quintana.
Virtual mountain classification: (I have put the time difference together, on the real mountain stages, Stelvio stage is not counted)
1 Aru
2 Rolland +11 sec
3 Quiatana +21 sec
4 Majka +67 sec
5 Uranium +68 sec
6 Hesjedal +71 sec
7 Pozzovivo +79 sec
Evans +190 sec
Aru is the best climber in the race right now, unless someone does not comply with the rules and attack on a neutralized descent. |
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| Schleck96 |
Posted on 30-05-2014 09:43
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Arberg27 wrote:
Aleakez wrote:
I don't think Rolland is even in his best form so i see him along with Uran as the best climbers behind Quintana.
Virtual mountain classification: (I have put the time difference together, on the real mountain stages, Stelvio stage is not counted)
1 Aru
2 Rolland +11 sec
3 Quiatana +21 sec
4 Majka +67 sec
5 Uranium +68 sec
6 Hesjedal +71 sec
7 Pozzovivo +79 sec
Evans +190 sec
Aru is the best climber in the race right now, unless someone does not comply with the rules and attack on a neutralized descent.
^Include the time differences of Val-Martello  |
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| jph27 |
Posted on 30-05-2014 10:31
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Team Leader
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Taking 2 minutes off the gaps at the end of the Stelvio stage
1 Quintana
2 Hesjedal +58
3 Rolland +1'03
4 Aru +1'19
5 Majka +2'26
6 Uran +2'27
7 Pozzovivo +2'38
8 Evans +4'37
Will try to work out where Kelderman would be. |
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