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PCM.daily DB Stats discussion
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 29-09-2024 16:26
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| admirschleck |
Posted on 23-05-2014 18:56
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75 eventually 76 TT. No more, definitely.
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| Riis123 |
Posted on 23-05-2014 18:56
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Oh well, there you see, lol |
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| gotlandrules |
Posted on 23-05-2014 18:56
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Can't go crazy with his TT-stat after 1 TT that obviously was decided purely on the 2 climbs.
edit: and of course the 2 subsequent downhills
Edited by gotlandrules on 23-05-2014 18:58
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| Riis123 |
Posted on 23-05-2014 19:01
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Nah, i probably shouldnt try to do it when i cant compare the stats to some of the other riders. But Urán certainly also gained alot of this time on the 10-15 km flat part, not purely on climbs/downhills |
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| Anderis |
Posted on 23-05-2014 20:44
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Surely Uran improved TT recently, look at his performance at Tour de Romandie, where he didn't seem to be at the top form, yet finished 4th in the ITT.
But yeah, to give him 79 is way too early.
If you are a fan of Garmin you would know almost his entire season last year was ruined by sickness and injuries. Even still he put in some good performances and the year before that his performances would merit atleast a 73 in TT, as well as his results in years before that.
He got 20th yesterday as well. He's never been exceptional, but he's been strong enough when he needs to be. There is a bit of a drop off after 73 in the Daily DB so for him to be lower than that, just wouldn't be accurate at all.
I know he had last year ruined and if you come back some pages in this thread actually you'll find me suggesting his skills should not be lowered that much on a basis of lack of success in 2013.
But I just can't see any good performances on long, flat TT by him since Giro 2012. And I checked his all results. You say he got 20th yesterday. Yeah, that 20th yesterday made me think to write about dropping his TT skill here. He disappointed me big time. He was even beaten by Rabottini (TT 65 in DB!), not to mention Cunego and some other riders. He ended up 20th because the rain stopped and GC guys had better conditions to set the fastest time as well as the fact that it was a hilly TT, a bit too hard for pure, flat TT specialists. But out of the GC guys, he was one of the worst actually.
He was also beaten by Nazaret, Beppu and McCann on Olympic Games Time Trial.
Since 2008 and respectable 12th on last TT of TdF, excluding Giro's final TT in 2012, his best position in any TT stage that was longer than 9kms in any race, including the smaller ones, was 14th. It gets even much worse if we are only to consider pure flat, long TTs in the very biggest races. |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 23-05-2014 22:45
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Riis123 wrote:
I dont play PCM, but wanted to share my rating of Urán:
79 mo
79 tt
77 hil
78-79 rec
77 sta
78 res
I dno what the stats look like in the newest DB's, so kinda hard for me, but that would be my stats 
I have Uran in my DB at:
79 mo
78 hil
73 tt
76 rec
76 sta
These were his stats before the Giro started and I haven't upped them or felt the need to, because yesterdays tt was heavily geared up for a good climber than for a tt specialist. For example I have both Majka and Ulissi at 73 and 74 in tt but as Uran has better climbing stats than both of those two, that would give him the edge in a hilly tt with those two.
To even think about putting Uran upto 78/79 tt he needs to be able to match the best tt's on flat tt courses. If I were to up him I'd consider the 74-76 ratings
Edited by Tafiolmo on 23-05-2014 22:47
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| gotlandrules |
Posted on 23-05-2014 22:47
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I think Uran could get 75ish TT |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 23-05-2014 22:48
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gotlandrules wrote:
I think Uran could get 75ish TT
I just saw this after I edited my post and yes 75 might be right to guarantee him a great result in a hilly tt |
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 24-05-2014 00:17
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I have Uran at 78mo78hi75tt74sta77rec
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| atlanta |
Posted on 24-05-2014 01:21
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Kelderman 77/76(mnt/hill), Ullissi 76/79, Uran 77ITT, Contador 82/79. Nibali 80/79. |
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 24-05-2014 01:26
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atlanta wrote:
Kelderman 77/76(mnt/hill), Ullissi 76/79, Uran 77ITT, Contador 82/79. Nibali 80/79.
First of all Kelderman will wait till the end of the Giro, but it looks about that way, yes.
Ulissi 78 hill at most, otherwise he will be getting top 5s in all the Ardennes first year. Not realistic.
Once again we already know I disagree on Contador's mountain, but that hill puts him the the Ardennes hunt. 77 would probably be better but most stat makers don't think in terms of that when making GC guys' hill stats.
Nibali gets demoted? For what? He hasn't had a goal yet, no way he should get downgraded. 78 hill also IMO.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| valverde321 |
Posted on 24-05-2014 01:38
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baseballlover312 wrote:
atlanta wrote:
Kelderman 77/76(mnt/hill), Ullissi 76/79, Uran 77ITT, Contador 82/79. Nibali 80/79.
First of all Kelderman will wait till the end of the Giro, but it looks about that way, yes.
Ulissi 78 hill at most, otherwise he will be getting top 5s in all the Ardennes first year. Not realistic.
Once again we already know I disagree on Contador's mountain, but that hill puts him the the Ardennes hunt. 77 would probably be better but most stat makers don't think in terms of that when making GC guys' hill stats.
Nibali gets demoted? For what? He hasn't had a goal yet, no way he should get downgraded. 78 hill also IMO.
Ulissi:
Plus a couple good stages at last years Vuelta, and generally good hill results pretty much everywhere, except the Ardennes.
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 24-05-2014 01:44
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Exactly, good hill results everywhere in the PCT classics and some hilly stage races. Not saying he is bad, but the Ardennes is where it counts. I'd say 78, which despite what people think is actually very good. He's still pretty young.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| atlanta |
Posted on 24-05-2014 01:46
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baseballlover312 wrote:
atlanta wrote:
Kelderman 77/76(mnt/hill), Ullissi 76/79, Uran 77ITT, Contador 82/79. Nibali 80/79.
First of all Kelderman will wait till the end of the Giro, but it looks about that way, yes.
Ulissi 78 hill at most, otherwise he will be getting top 5s in all the Ardennes first year. Not realistic.
Once again we already know I disagree on Contador's mountain, but that hill puts him the the Ardennes hunt. 77 would probably be better but most stat makers don't think in terms of that when making GC guys' hill stats.
Nibali gets demoted? For what? He hasn't had a goal yet, no way he should get downgraded. 78 hill also IMO.
I have Contador on 81/78 but i think he should be higher. Well i suppose Contaodor and Froome's maingoals were the early 1 week stage races? , Fact is they have performed Nibali has not looked good this year. |
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| baseballlover312 |
Posted on 24-05-2014 01:52
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atlanta wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
atlanta wrote:
Kelderman 77/76(mnt/hill), Ullissi 76/79, Uran 77ITT, Contador 82/79. Nibali 80/79.
First of all Kelderman will wait till the end of the Giro, but it looks about that way, yes.
Ulissi 78 hill at most, otherwise he will be getting top 5s in all the Ardennes first year. Not realistic.
Once again we already know I disagree on Contador's mountain, but that hill puts him the the Ardennes hunt. 77 would probably be better but most stat makers don't think in terms of that when making GC guys' hill stats.
Nibali gets demoted? For what? He hasn't had a goal yet, no way he should get downgraded. 78 hill also IMO.
I have Contador on 81/78 but i think he should be higher. Well i suppose Contaodor and Froome's maingoals were the early 1 week stage races?, Fact is they have performed Nibali has not looked good this year.
Froomebot is always on form because he is robotic, Contador has been a carnivorous beast this year, and Nibali hasn't even gotten started yet.
I have a thing where I don't judge a rider until I have actually seent hem in their season goals. But that's just me.
RIP Exxon Duke, David Veilleux, Double Feature, and Monster Energy |
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| admirschleck |
Posted on 24-05-2014 01:58
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Let this Giro finish firstly, guys...
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| atlanta |
Posted on 24-05-2014 01:59
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I no but i doubt Nibali was peaking for Tirreno last year yet he still won it, this year Nibali has not done well. I think 81/78 would be ok but i think he is 79 on hills i think if he put his mind to it he can win classics he lacks a good kick but he would do well imo he as a good engine. Also i got a feeing Quintana will be down to 81 after the Giro but he is ill so who know's. |
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| valverde321 |
Posted on 24-05-2014 02:14
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baseballlover312 wrote:
Exactly, good hill results everywhere in the PCT classics and some hilly stage races. Not saying he is bad, but the Ardennes is where it counts. I'd say 78, which despite what people think is actually very good. He's still pretty young.
Well he did get 2nd, 1st and 3rd on hilly stages at a PT event known as the Tour Down Under, beating guys like Gerrans, Gesink, Porte, Evans, Hermans.
And Milano Torino is his specialty I think. 2nd in 2012 and 1st in 2013. Beating some really big names, Valv, Purito, Conta, Moreno, Pozzo, even Dan Martin...
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| Aleakez |
Posted on 24-05-2014 02:20
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I love Nibali but he is no higher then 78 in Hill, for his Mountain stats i would keep them as 81 until he prove himself in the Tour, he is far from his best shape and haven't gotten the opportunity to prove himself yet.
`How come Kwiat have better Hill stats than Gerrans? and with 4 in potential, how much is it possible for Kwiat to grow in Hill stats?`
and a question i have been curious about is does the Mountain stats have any advantage on riders with only Hill stats, for the Ardennes or other Classics??
" Trust me, you can dance - Vodka "
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| Alakagom |
Posted on 24-05-2014 02:22
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valverde321 wrote:
baseballlover312 wrote:
Exactly, good hill results everywhere in the PCT classics and some hilly stage races. Not saying he is bad, but the Ardennes is where it counts. I'd say 78, which despite what people think is actually very good. He's still pretty young.
Well he did get 2nd, 1st and 3rd on hilly stages at a PT event known as the Tour Down Under, beating guys like Gerrans, Gesink, Porte, Evans, Hermans.
Not so sure Down Under is real indicator of anything. Anyway all these are lower than 78 bar Gerrans who obviously won the TDU. 78 is fair for Ullissi.
About the late Italian classics, well he never did great at Lomarbdia, the only one that counts for the top guys.
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