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PCMdaily DB Stat Discussion
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 12-04-2015 19:14
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World Champion
Posts: 14501
Joined: 08-08-2011
PCM$: 8500.00
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Since Paul started it..
Cance:82
Boonen 81
Vanmarcke 81
Stybar 80
Van Avermaet 80
Kristoff 79 with good support stats
Degenkolb 79 with good support stats
Terpstra 79
Thomas 78 with good support stats
Vandenbergh 78
Boom 78
Sagan 78
Roelandts 77
Stannart 77
Wiggins 77
Paolini 76 with good support stats
Keukeleire 76
Leukemans 76
Rowe 76
Debusschere 76
Benoot 76
Elmiger 76
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 29-09-2024 14:27
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Bot Agent
Posts: Countless
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 12-04-2015 19:20
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Sprinter
Posts: 1961
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Ollfardh wrote:
Since Paul started it..
Cance:82
Boonen 81
Vanmarcke 81
Stybar 80
Van Avermaet 80
Kristoff 79 with good support stats
Degenkolb 79 with good support stats
Terpstra 79
Thomas 78 with good support stats
Vandenbergh 78
Boom 78
Sagan 78
Roelandts 77
Stannart 77
Wiggins 77
Paolini 76 with good support stats
Keukeleire 76
Leukemans 76
Rowe 76
Debusschere 76
Benoot 76
Elmiger 76
Good stats.
But I'd drop Boonen to 80, but if somebody wants to be realistic they would eliminate Boonen and Cancellara if they're playing these races outside of the management game, then the other riders would be near each other in stats. Terpstra is worth 80 as well but not as sharp as GVA or Stybar on hills and acc. I would put Stannard at 80 but with weaker back up stats.
I think somebody needs to put up cobble, flat, hill and stamina stats for these riders.
Edited by Tafiolmo on 12-04-2015 19:21
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| ryant |
Posted on 12-04-2015 19:21
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Small Tour Specialist
Posts: 2308
Joined: 15-08-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Elmiger deserves more after this season, Boonen, well to put it lightly, 81 is laughable... I wouldn't even put him at 80, his results in recent years (even without injuries) have not been impressive at all, 79 is a push considering Degenkolb is 79
 John St Ledger in Team Bunzl-Centrica and Team U25Red Bull Driver in RFactor
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 12-04-2015 19:22
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Sprinter
Posts: 1961
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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ryant wrote:
Elmiger deserves more after this season, Boonen, well to put it lightly, 81 is laughable... I wouldn't even put him at 80, his results in recent years (even without injuries) have not been impressive at all, 79 is a push considering Degenkolb is 79
Its very hard to put Boonen correctly because he hasn't raced, he could be anything between 81 to 78, it's a problem. |
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 12-04-2015 19:27
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15274
Joined: 21-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Thought I could post it here as well 
Jesleyh wrote:
Meanwhile, Alak and I spent hours, editing the cobbles stats of the riders. I wanted to share them with you, both to generate discussion and to hear the opinions.
Note that there are a couple more on 76, this isn't all
If there's enough demand for it, I might release this .cdb as a stat update post-Roubaix.
(Oh btw, Greg got an ITT upgrade after this screen, but that's not what you should be looking at )
Curious what you think. Obviously there'll be some arguable stats but most is about personal preference
Feyenoord(football) and Kelderman fanboy
PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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| asoutar |
Posted on 12-04-2015 19:41
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Junior Rider
Posts: 40
Joined: 23-08-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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It's hard to tell, but I would have less riders on 81 and 80 just because cancelarra seems to be the only one capable of stringing a few results together. Everyone else is on a similar level and no one's dominating this was shown today as a group came to the finish together. |
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| Omloop |
Posted on 12-04-2015 19:43
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Domestique
Posts: 433
Joined: 08-01-2014
PCM$: 200.00
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Cancellara:82
Vanmarcke:82
Greg van Avermaet:80
Boonen:80
Teptstra:80
Stybar:80
Degenkolb:80
Kristoff:79(With insane stamina and good hill)
Thomas:79
Sagan:79
Boom:79
Vandenbergh:78
Stannard:78
Wiggins:77
Roelandts:77
Oss:76
Elmiger:76
Rowe:76
Debuchere:76
Devolder:76
Paolini:75
Greipel:75
I know I've forgotten many riders, but this is my personal preferences. It is hard too say because it is all form and luck most of the time. It also difficult because Roubaix and De Ronde is two quite different races. Another important thing is that these races are not won just based on the cobble stat. |
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 12-04-2015 19:44
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15274
Joined: 21-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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We simply can't put Cancellara far above the rest if he doesn't race.
We only know from previous years that he is above the rest, but imo we can't justify him still being way over the rest.
Especially since last year, Vanmarcke was quite close to him, if you ask me.
The races have been open indeed, that's why quite some riders are on 79-81. Given that the ''subtop'' in most other disciplines are also 79-81 rated, we thought it was fair to put the strong cobblers there as well, and not on 77-79.
Feyenoord(football) and Kelderman fanboy
PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 12-04-2015 19:44
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Sprinter
Posts: 1961
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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How important is hill stat in cobble races like E3 and Flanders? |
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 12-04-2015 19:47
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World Champion
Posts: 14501
Joined: 08-08-2011
PCM$: 8500.00
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Overall some nice work by you two, as usual!
Still.. 
- Degenkolb is too high imo. Yes he won Roubaix, but he wasn't that good in the other cobbled classics and he wasn't that impressive on the cobbles. Drop him to 79-80 and up his Flat and Stamina to 80.
- Vanmarcke is definitely better on the cobbles then Van Avermaet. This year he wasn't always that good, but taking the last few years into account, I'd give him 81 as well. He still gave me the best impression on the cobbles this year, although his punctures ruined it.
- Thomas seems a bit too high as well, again not that good on the cobbles
- Lampaert might be a tad high on 77, I don't think he's that good (yet!)
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| Kentaurus |
Posted on 12-04-2015 19:55
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3999
Joined: 26-07-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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I personally agree that the overalls need to be upped for cobbles, we have the elite climbers at 83, why shouldn't the elite cobbles also be the same?
83 : Cancellara
82 : Vanmarke
81 : Stybar, Terpstra, Van Avermaet
80 : Boonen, Degenkolb, Kristoff, Sagan, Thomas, Vandenburgh
rest can follow from there.
AZTECA - NBCSN  |
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 12-04-2015 19:59
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15274
Joined: 21-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Mhm.
I would say Degenkolb was in fact impressive on the cobbles. Remember he solo'd to Van Avermaet & Lampaert.
And as I said earlier, flat part in Roubaix = both FL and COB.
So even if you are (only?) strong on the flat in cobbled races, you need some good cobble stat. Sad that Thomas crashed, was curious how wrong he could've proven you
Vanmarcke's backup stats are very strong, in Roubaix I think he might be of the same level as GvA in-game.
Lampaert is difficult to stat. He was very impressive today, though.
And don't forget to look at the backup stats, Lampaert's backup stats aren't too impressive. You might be able to get a Top 10 with him, but it won't be easy.
@Tafiolmo
Can't really put a number on it, but it definitely has some influence.
@Kentaurus
Well, Cancellara is already the 3rd best rider in game, looking at overalls. Plus COB only being used a few races per year, I don't want to go too high.
Feyenoord(football) and Kelderman fanboy
PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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| TankNL |
Posted on 12-04-2015 20:09
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Domestique
Posts: 440
Joined: 19-03-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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here are my thoughts on the stats after Paris-Roubaix;
https://pcmdaily.com/forum/viewthread....st_1049431 |
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| fidjim2013 |
Posted on 12-04-2015 20:11
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 348
Joined: 20-11-2013
PCM$: 300.00
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Ollfardh wrote:
Since Paul started it..
Cance:82
Boonen 81
Vanmarcke 81
Stybar 80
Van Avermaet 80
Kristoff 79 with good support stats
Degenkolb 79 with good support stats
Terpstra 79
Your stats are too low for some riders
Thomas 78 with good support stats
Vandenbergh 78
Boom 78
Sagan 78
Roelandts 77
Stannart 77
Wiggins 77
Paolini 76 with good support stats
Keukeleire 76
Leukemans 76
Rowe 76
Debusschere 76
Benoot 76
Elmiger 76
Your stats seems too low
Edited by fidjim2013 on 12-04-2015 20:16
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| jandal7 |
Posted on 12-04-2015 20:23
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World Champion
Posts: 11356
Joined: 17-12-2014
PCM$: 1020.00
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Jesleyh wrote:
Thought I could post it here as well
Jesleyh wrote:
Meanwhile, Alak and I spent hours, editing the cobbles stats of the riders. I wanted to share them with you, both to generate discussion and to hear the opinions.
Note that there are a couple more on 76, this isn't all
If there's enough demand for it, I might release this .cdb as a stat update post-Roubaix.
(Oh btw, Greg got an ITT upgrade after this screen, but that's not what you should be looking at )
Curious what you think. Obviously there'll be some arguable stats but most is about personal preference
I'd download a stats update, tbh I'm kinda sick of editing them myself, and that's a very good base
But no seriously I do my own stats (not all), but especially for people that don't that's a fairly accurate base and I'm sure many will download. Especially with no daily 2015 db
Edited by jandal7 on 12-04-2015 20:26
24/02/21 - kandesbunzler said “I don't drink famous people."
15/08/22 - SotD said "Your [jandal's] humour is overrated"
11/06/24 - knockout said "Winning is fine I guess. Truth be told this felt completely unimportant."
[ICL] Santos-Euskadi | [PT]  Xero Racing
5x  x5
2x  x2
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 12-04-2015 20:24
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15274
Joined: 21-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Well this would obviously be for an update of the JesgdV1.75.
I might release a post-Roubaix statupdate for that, if there's enough demand.
Feyenoord(football) and Kelderman fanboy
PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 12-04-2015 20:25
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World Champion
Posts: 14501
Joined: 08-08-2011
PCM$: 8500.00
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fidjim2013 wrote:
Ollfardh wrote:
Since Paul started it..
Cance:82
Boonen 81
Vanmarcke 81
Stybar 80
Van Avermaet 80
Kristoff 79 with good support stats
Degenkolb 79 with good support stats
Terpstra 79
Your stats are too low for some riders
Thomas 78 with good support stats
Vandenbergh 78
Boom 78
Sagan 78
Roelandts 77
Stannart 77
Wiggins 77
Paolini 76 with good support stats
Keukeleire 76
Leukemans 76
Rowe 76
Debusschere 76
Benoot 76
Elmiger 76
Your stats seems too low
That's kinda vague  Do you mean in general or which riders?
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| ryant |
Posted on 12-04-2015 20:27
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Small Tour Specialist
Posts: 2308
Joined: 15-08-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Jesleyh wrote:
Mhm.
I would say Degenkolb was in fact impressive on the cobbles. Remember he solo'd to Van Avermaet & Lampaert.
And as I said earlier, flat part in Roubaix = both FL and COB.
So even if you are (only?) strong on the flat in cobbled races, you need some good cobble stat. Sad that Thomas crashed, was curious how wrong he could've proven you
Vanmarcke's backup stats are very strong, in Roubaix I think he might be of the same level as GvA in-game.
Lampaert is difficult to stat. He was very impressive today, though.
And don't forget to look at the backup stats, Lampaert's backup stats aren't too impressive. You might be able to get a Top 10 with him, but it won't be easy.
@Tafiolmo
Can't really put a number on it, but it definitely has some influence.
@Kentaurus
Well, Cancellara is already the 3rd best rider in game, looking at overalls. Plus COB only being used a few races per year, I don't want to go too high.
I feel that having Degenkolb at 81 COB makes me very uncomfortable, note we only saw this Degenkolb at Roubaix, at all the other classics he was very much on the defensive and struggled a lot at the Ronde, I could argue in that case Stannard would deserve 80 COB because of Omloop, but we know that isn't the case
Edited by ryant on 12-04-2015 20:28
John St Ledger in Team Bunzl-Centrica and Team U25
Red Bull Driver in RFactor
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| cio93 |
Posted on 12-04-2015 20:34
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World Champion
Posts: 10845
Joined: 29-10-2007
PCM$: 500.00
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ryant wrote:
I feel that having Degenkolb at 81 COB makes me very uncomfortable, note we only saw this Degenkolb at Roubaix, at all the other classics he was very much on the defensive and struggled a lot at the Ronde, I could argue in that case Stannard would deserve 80 COB because of Omloop, but we know that isn't the case
He kept up just fine with Stybar and Thomas on the Paterberg, and they are...lemme look...81 and 80 with +2 and +-0 hill.
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 12-04-2015 20:36
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15274
Joined: 21-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Well, that solo obviously wasn't the only reason, he was just generally very strong today.
Also, 7th in RvV is not that bad, I wouldn't say he struggled too much, he followed them fine on the cobbles. By the way, the only one who got a Top 5 in both races is GvA, if we're looking at the results only
Degenkolb was in fact really strong on the cobbles today, and it's not solely because of his sprint that he won it.
Degenkolb also has last year's Roubaix going for him, of course, but if you ask me he has stepped up even more this year.
Also, comparing Roubaix to Omloop is obviously a no-go. It's just not possible to base a COB stat at tons of races, since there are only a couple of big cobbled races.
Feyenoord(football) and Kelderman fanboy
PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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