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[PT/PCT/CT] Calendar, Goals and Race Profiles 2019
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| Scorchio |
Posted on 05-09-2019 13:05
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Small Tour Specialist
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@ Fabianski: Although there are potentially small differences year-to-year, this is last seasons race selection thread that lays out exactly how it worked then - https://pcmdaily.com/forum/viewthread...d_id=50680. Would be surprised if not similar with some small tweaks.
@Roturn: Would it be possible to clarify the PCT teams in C2 races rider restrictions earlier this season so that it can be factored into race selection, thanks!
Speaking personally, I think the maximum OVR of 74.49 worked pretty well last season, but still want to lobby that the COB stat max gets lifted to 77 to match TT restriction; I can't see why it is justified that they are different. In combo with the OVR stat limit, this would still mean that plenty of 2018 CT riders were significantly stronger cobblers that anything CT could send.
Manager of ISA - Hexacta in the MG |
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| Scorchio |
Posted on 05-09-2019 13:19
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Small Tour Specialist
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roturn wrote:
Explanation
For those that don`t have PCM18 some hints how to read the symbols.
Flat, Hill, Mountain should be obvious. Hill mostly means 0.0 H/M ratio on hilly races, mountain 1.0 H/M ratio. If the hill race is something in between in stage races mainly, it can vary between 0-0.3 if the climbs are longer.
In extreme cases (Hallstatt) I added both symbols as the H/M is 0.5. Similar for classics such as Lombardia (so you can see, long climbs usually mean mixed H/M) with the symbol always being the higher percentage! So hill symbol can never be above 50%.
In two cases (San Luis and Beijing) the climbs might look longer but I added that all stages are 100% hill rated!
Other than that the cobbled symbol in dark red means it`s harder than in orange/yellow.
And the TT symbol is important. A white clock is an ITT, a dark clock is a TTT.
Thanks for this, most welcome. I think I have my head round this, but just for further clarification; on flat stages/races is there also an ability to prescribe a 'hilly %', or are they all just prescribed as 'flat'? I'm just wondering how 'flat' races with difficult parcours like f.e. Milan San Remo end up being described.
Manager of ISA - Hexacta in the MG |
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| beagle |
Posted on 05-09-2019 16:46
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4200
Joined: 06-10-2007
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PCT teams have a total of 175 race days, including their 61/62 HC and 40 PTHC race days.
So PCT have 74/75 C1 and C2 races.
PCT teams will be required to sign up to at least 6 C2 race days.
Is it the same for 2019?
Manager of Polar in Man-Game
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| roturn |
Posted on 05-09-2019 16:56
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Team Manager
Posts: 22246
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Basically yes.
Total Race Days didn`t change in any division.
Only rd impacted change is that C2HC only has 70 instead of 72 rd in total. So 2 more rd to use for C1/C2/HC for CT teams. |
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| beagle |
Posted on 05-09-2019 17:34
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Grand Tour Specialist
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Ok, thanks.
Manager of Polar in Man-Game
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| Tamijo |
Posted on 05-09-2019 19:19
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Team Leader
Posts: 7406
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Scorchio wrote:
roturn wrote:
Explanation
For those that don`t have PCM18 some hints how to read the symbols.
Flat, Hill, Mountain should be obvious. Hill mostly means 0.0 H/M ratio on hilly races, mountain 1.0 H/M ratio. If the hill race is something in between in stage races mainly, it can vary between 0-0.3 if the climbs are longer.
In extreme cases (Hallstatt) I added both symbols as the H/M is 0.5. Similar for classics such as Lombardia (so you can see, long climbs usually mean mixed H/M) with the symbol always being the higher percentage! So hill symbol can never be above 50%.
In two cases (San Luis and Beijing) the climbs might look longer but I added that all stages are 100% hill rated!
Other than that the cobbled symbol in dark red means it`s harder than in orange/yellow.
And the TT symbol is important. A white clock is an ITT, a dark clock is a TTT.
Thanks for this, most welcome. I think I have my head round this, but just for further clarification; on flat stages/races is there also an ability to prescribe a 'hilly %', or are they all just prescribed as 'flat'? I'm just wondering how 'flat' races with difficult parcours like f.e. Milan San Remo end up being described.
Checked a stage (not milan) but one with a very hard 1.st half followed by an almost flat 1/2 half, this result in a 100% hilly H/M ratio, so would expect it to be always the case with a FLAT icon.
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 05-09-2019 19:48
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World Champion
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So how do riders like Van Asbroeck with decent Hill but very poor MO do in Pcm18? Do they get in trouble in hilly races more often?
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| jandal7 |
Posted on 05-09-2019 20:04
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World Champion
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Ollfardh wrote:
So how do riders like Van Asbroeck with decent Hill but very poor MO do in Pcm18? Do they get in trouble in hilly races more often?
In my experience testing the MG DB, no. In fact he won a FL-HI stage (rated FL but quite hard and selective) once when I was testing and when I tested three days (two FL but hard and one HI, two days selective and one with guys like Bennett and CJJ attcking) like that (think 2018 Ronde Van Nederland for a similar MG profile) in a PCT field a sprinter with below 60 MO won the GC. I wouldn’t be surprised if it hurt them a bit in properly hard hilly stages but in terms of stages he’d normally survive I think he’s ok so long as he’s the leader. Someone with more experience than me with 18 can maybe offer a different view.
24/02/21 - kandesbunzler said “I don't drink famous people."
15/08/22 - SotD said "Your [jandal's] humour is overrated"
11/06/24 - knockout said "Winning is fine I guess. Truth be told this felt completely unimportant."
[ICL] Santos-Euskadi | [PT]  Xero Racing
5x  x5
2x  x2
2x  x2 |
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| roturn |
Posted on 05-09-2019 20:10
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Let`s make it short.
In my own experience (which might not be as accurate or as much quantity as others) the difference between PCM15 and PCM18 rider wise is small. Same riders still do well.
It`s the AI that has improved though. |
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| MacC |
Posted on 05-09-2019 21:55
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Sprinter
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Why do all races have at least 2 race days in the calendar file? |
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| Kentaurus |
Posted on 05-09-2019 21:56
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Classics Specialist
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So to help out, as others have, based on the testing I did back when 18 came out (and it is similar to 19 in that regard). The MO/HI ratio of stages doesn't affect how the riders performance is on the stage, it will however affect the pre-race strategy of teams and how the AI functions for that day.
In general for how MO and HI work, the more total KMs climbed in the race the more MO will have effect, even it if is just many short climbs (L-B-L will trend towards puncheurs with a good MO or even climbers with solid HI). For races that are more flat, with one sharp uphill at or near the finish, HI will be the predominant stat (along with SP if the hill comes before the finish).
AZTECA - NBCSN  |
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 24-11-2024 17:33
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| Kentaurus |
Posted on 05-09-2019 21:57
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Classics Specialist
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MacC wrote:
Why do all races have at least 2 race days in the calendar file?
A one day race, still takes up two race days in the MG. Stage races take up days equal to the number of stages.
AZTECA - NBCSN |
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| jandal7 |
Posted on 05-09-2019 21:58
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MacC wrote:
Why do all races have at least 2 race days in the calendar file?
That’s just how it is. Classics cost 2RDs to offset the points per race day advantage they have on multi day stage races a little 
Zabel’d  Haven’t had that happen for a while on here!
24/02/21 - kandesbunzler said “I don't drink famous people."
15/08/22 - SotD said "Your [jandal's] humour is overrated"
11/06/24 - knockout said "Winning is fine I guess. Truth be told this felt completely unimportant."
[ICL] Santos-Euskadi | [PT] Xero Racing
5x x5
2x x2
2x x2 |
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| Kentaurus |
Posted on 05-09-2019 22:30
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3999
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Also not able to see the race profiles for a couple of races (img link broken?)
[C2HC] Tour de Langkawi
[C2HC] Tour of Vancouver
[C2] USA Pro Cycling Challenge
AZTECA - NBCSN |
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| jandal7 |
Posted on 05-09-2019 22:48
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World Champion
Posts: 11395
Joined: 17-12-2014
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Kentaurus wrote:
Also not able to see the race profiles for a couple of races (img link broken?)
[C2HC] Tour de Langkawi
[C2HC] Tour of Vancouver
[C2] USA Pro Cycling Challenge
Just not there yet But roturn said in opening post that it should be similar to 2018 profiles for all of them
24/02/21 - kandesbunzler said “I don't drink famous people."
15/08/22 - SotD said "Your [jandal's] humour is overrated"
11/06/24 - knockout said "Winning is fine I guess. Truth be told this felt completely unimportant."
[ICL] Santos-Euskadi | [PT] Xero Racing
5x x5
2x x2
2x x2 |
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| Aquarius97 |
Posted on 05-09-2019 23:19
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Grand Tour Specialist
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Btw, i'm obviously going to wait to send Goals until a Post-Renewals DB is released
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| jandal7 |
Posted on 05-09-2019 23:31
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World Champion
Posts: 11395
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Aquarius97 wrote:
Btw, i'm obviously going to wait to send Goals until a Post-Renewals DB is released
We established in Skype I think that it's not guaranteed to happen in that order as some guys wait to do their renewals until they have their budget which comes from goals
24/02/21 - kandesbunzler said “I don't drink famous people."
15/08/22 - SotD said "Your [jandal's] humour is overrated"
11/06/24 - knockout said "Winning is fine I guess. Truth be told this felt completely unimportant."
[ICL] Santos-Euskadi | [PT] Xero Racing
5x x5
2x x2
2x x2 |
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| Booker |
Posted on 06-09-2019 00:18
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Breakaway Specialist
Posts: 875
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Budget comes from performance on last year’s goals, no?
You shouldn’t need to complete your current year goals (which impact the following year’s budget) to know your budget for 2019.
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| jandal7 |
Posted on 06-09-2019 00:20
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World Champion
Posts: 11395
Joined: 17-12-2014
PCM$: 1020.00
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Booker wrote:
Budget comes from performance on last year’s goals, no?
You shouldn’t need to complete your current year goals (which impact the following year’s budget) to know your budget for 2019.
It's both. Higher the total cost higher the budget
24/02/21 - kandesbunzler said “I don't drink famous people."
15/08/22 - SotD said "Your [jandal's] humour is overrated"
11/06/24 - knockout said "Winning is fine I guess. Truth be told this felt completely unimportant."
[ICL] Santos-Euskadi | [PT] Xero Racing
5x x5
2x x2
2x x2 |
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| Luis Leon Sanchez |
Posted on 06-09-2019 00:33
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Team Leader
Posts: 5533
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jandal7 wrote:
Aquarius97 wrote:
Btw, i'm obviously going to wait to send Goals until a Post-Renewals DB is released
We established in Skype I think that it's not guaranteed to happen in that order as some guys wait to do their renewals until they have their budget which comes from goals
I feel like it's more important to have the DB before setting goals, so teams actually know who is available for everyone, than it is to have budget before renewals?
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