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PCM.daily Stat Discussion
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| haasje33 |
Posted on 27-06-2018 16:31
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Sprinter
Posts: 1679
Joined: 08-08-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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Welcome to the new thread where you can discuss the stats for the PCM.daily Projects for PCM 18.
Everything written down here will be considered for the next releases of our projects.
Keep in mind that top stats are the most noticeable stats, but those are most often a matter of opinion. I advice people to change some of those stats to their own likings if you don't agree to the stats in our projects.
For us it'd be much more useful to especially discuss stats about smaller riders, those are often easier to miss.
Yes, we know stat discussions, like politics and religion discussions, often show the worst side of people. Therefore, we've decided to set some simple rules so things won't get out of hand in this thread.
1. If you comment on someone's post, comment on the contents of the post, not on the person!
2. Don't make fun of suggestions of other members. Everyone can post their suggestions. It's up to our statmakers to decide what to do with them.
3. Keep your posts strictly on-topic.
Any posts that violate these rules will be deleted immediately and without notification. Consistent violation of the rules could result in suspension or even a ban.
The Google Documents file which contains the most recent (live) PCM.daily CT stats.
The most recent database and the first update, containing our stat changes:
RSM/PCMdaily 2019DB
2019 DB Update 1
2019 DB Update 2
Edited by Croatia14 on 24-04-2019 12:37
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| Agent David |
Posted on 28-06-2018 18:26
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Free Agent
Posts: 138
Joined: 04-10-2017
PCM$: 300.00
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I don't know how far you are in the database, but I noticed some mistakes in Elkov-Author Team. Especially on Josef Cerny, because he won Czech championship in RR and TT. I would upgrade other Elkov riders, too, I think Polnicky and Kukrle. I found that in the database aren't 3 Elkov riders, J. Rajchart, M. Zahalka and J. Otruba (he won U23 Czech championship in RR and TT). I looked at other Czech riders, and maybe I would make a little upgrades on Turek and Sisr.
Sorry for my bad English. |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 28-06-2018 19:48
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Agent David wrote:
I don't know how far you are in the database, but I noticed some mistakes in Elkov-Author Team. Especially on Josef Cerny, because he won Czech championship in RR and TT. I would upgrade other Elkov riders, too, I think Polnicky and Kukrle. I found that in the database aren't 3 Elkov riders, J. Rajchart, M. Zahalka and J. Otruba (he won U23 Czech championship in RR and TT). I looked at other Czech riders, and maybe I would make a little upgrades on Turek and Sisr.
Sorry for my bad English.
Ct is being revised as I write and teams beginning with E about to be started.
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| marcoplv95 |
Posted on 02-07-2018 08:45
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Stagiare
Posts: 210
Joined: 18-05-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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I agree that Viviani isn't the best sprinter atm, but seeing him 4pts lower than original db is too much!
I'd give him 80-83. He still has low back-up stats, i'm not sure he can reach T10 in MSR or T3 in GW as he did.
And 72 HIL or 73, Pozzovivo couldn't gap him in NC ITA's Hill (https://youtu.be/qg08EmRmfHI?t=8m11s) |
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 24-11-2024 10:15
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Bot Agent
Posts: Countless
Joined: 23.11.09
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| Yellow Jersey |
Posted on 02-07-2018 13:21
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 2809
Joined: 16-04-2013
PCM$: 900.00
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Viviani.. I remember he said before the season started that he was as fast as Kittel and I ridiculized that. But so far, this season he's been the strongest no doubt (Gaviria and Gronewegen at the same level but not so many results).. Gent Wevelgem he was there at the end (very long, bit cobbled classic).. 73 hil is appropriate, he was insanely strong at NC's and has showed big improvement in hills (was there at the end in MSR, won Plouay last year)
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 02-07-2018 22:12
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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The top sprinting stats have yet to be finalized for the simple reason the Tour is coming up now. We know that this season that Kittel, Cav and Greipel have all been poor and depending on how they perform in the Tour will dictate on how the stats of other sprinters like Viviani will be finalized. Depending on how they do, that will indicate how Viviani and others should now be ranked alongside them and imo there is not much of a gap between them.
In general the top mtn riders and the top sprinters are the stats that need to be finalized and that won't be possible until the end of the Tour because this is the race that most will be looking to peak for.
Also I've made a note for Viviani's hill so that doesn't get forgotten, not an easy one though because those decent hill performances can be countered with not so good ones at the Giro.
Edited by Tafiolmo on 02-07-2018 22:18
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| Thatguyeveryonehates |
Posted on 02-07-2018 22:29
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Domestique
Posts: 447
Joined: 01-05-2014
PCM$: 200.00
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if im not wrong there was only one hill at the italian nationals and it was 1/4 mile long so its basically the length of a sprint
most hills he wouldnt do so well |
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| cio93 |
Posted on 02-07-2018 22:32
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World Champion
Posts: 10845
Joined: 29-10-2007
PCM$: 500.00
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Thatguyeveryonehates wrote:
if im not wrong there was only one hill at the italian nationals and it was 1/4 mile long so its basically the length of a sprint
most hills he wouldnt do so well
Incidentally, that's exactly what the hill stat in PCM is for.
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| Yellow Jersey |
Posted on 02-07-2018 22:36
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 2809
Joined: 16-04-2013
PCM$: 900.00
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Not saying he's a punchy sprinter, but you're wrong there. They did that circuit 8 times, that wall and a 2Km climb, in a 6-hour race.. plus he wasn't hiding in the bunch, he was on the attack beforehand, very shattered race if you saw it.
I admit that I was surprised, massively surprised as I never seen him doing something like that, but a strong hil and backups are on the table, other than (before mentioned) very strong sprint. Let's see the Tour so we can compare him better in relation to others
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| Croatia14 |
Posted on 02-07-2018 22:50
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Directeur Sportif
Posts: 9099
Joined: 13-03-2013
PCM$: 2100.00
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cio93 wrote:
Thatguyeveryonehates wrote:
if im not wrong there was only one hill at the italian nationals and it was 1/4 mile long so its basically the length of a sprint
most hills he wouldnt do so well
Incidentally, that's exactly what the hill stat in PCM is for.
Not true.
We are talking about the intensity of an uphill effort depending on the gradient more than on the length of a climb. The hill stat should cover the close-to-maximum intensities. Of course, you most often reach them on a short climb/a spare part of a mountain however.
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To the Viviani discussion. Haven't taken a look at the Italian NCs so far aside from the result. Besides that he has been great in Sprints, but also benefits from having the best team. Greipel has been dealing with a lot of sickness, Cavendish is on poor health and Kittel constantly screwed over by his supporting cast. We don't know about their state of the art really.
Aside from that, in my opinion Dylan Groenewegen has proven to be best of the rest, an edge ahead of Gaviria and Viviani and then guys like Sagan, Ewan,...
Thinking about the hill stat we must not forget the Giro. On the hillier stages Sam Bennett and others were clearly stronger than Viviani in comparison to the flat stages. Hence we can't give him a high hill stat really in my opinion, and I'd admit a +4/+5 day in the Italian NCs talking in PCM language. Taking a look at back-ups like Sta or Res in line with his track past could provide a solution however, that would boost him for a big time energy race as the Italian NCs but not influence him on the more classic hilly sprint stages such as at the Giro.
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| marcoplv95 |
Posted on 03-07-2018 14:09
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Stagiare
Posts: 210
Joined: 18-05-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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@Croatia14: You' can't compete with Viviani +5 against Pozzovivo
@Thatguyeveryonehates: Whaat!  It was 4300metres uphill! And Muro di Via Cornaleto has been done eight times. (https://www.direttaciclismo.it/percors...zt00NIzZhE) |
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| LoiC2541 |
Posted on 04-07-2018 09:57
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Amateur
Posts: 13
Joined: 08-02-2014
PCM$: 200.00
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Isn't Wout Van aert his sprint stat fairly low? 69? |
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| jensi251 |
Posted on 06-07-2018 11:35
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Under 23
Posts: 65
Joined: 19-10-2016
PCM$: 200.00
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would be nice if Moschetti was in the DB.
maybe something like:
FL 68
MO 60
DH 64
CB 63
TT 62
PR 69
SP 70
ACC 69
STA ?
RES ?
REC ?
HI 64
FTR 61 |
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| Naskela |
Posted on 06-07-2018 12:09
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Stagiare
Posts: 204
Joined: 31-05-2014
PCM$: 200.00
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marcoplv95 wrote:
I agree that Viviani isn't the best sprinter atm, but seeing him 4pts lower than original db is too much!
I'd give him 80-83. He still has low back-up stats, i'm not sure he can reach T10 in MSR or T3 in GW as he did.
And 72 HIL or 73, Pozzovivo couldn't gap him in NC ITA's Hill (https://youtu.be/qg08EmRmfHI?t=8m11s)
Definitely agree on him being 80. He is among the best sprinters on flat stages as well. But what about Nacer Bouhanni he certainly got a downgrade by the default db and for this db he should not get much higher than 78SP/77AC?
AG2R La Mondiale / Issy Paris Hand / Le Havre AC
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 06-07-2018 12:21
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World Champion
Posts: 14563
Joined: 08-08-2011
PCM$: 9100.00
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I actually have to disagree on Viviani. He should get better backup stats based on his track results and his classic results this year (Italian NC, De Panne, Wevelgem, Hageland). But in pure speed, I'm not convinced. He got his ass kicked by Sam Bennett too many times in the Giro.
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 06-07-2018 21:18
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Personally I think Viviani is being very overrated which has been supported by his crazy high sprint stats in the official DB.
He's had a very consistent season and that is supported by his ability in classics but we need to take a number of the below points into consideration.
1. He has beaten a lot of higher ranked sprinters BUT also his rivals have also done the same (Ewan, Groenewegen and Gaviria for example) which really show that we either have a changing of the guard at the top of the very best sprinters like Kittel etc or are they just going through a bad patch?
2. On head to heads Groenewegen has been more impressive than Viviani.
3. Viviani being a Quickstep rider will have the best leadout train in the game along with DD
4. The Giro really showed that he wasn't that much better than Bennett (in fact I'd say Bennett was just as good) who had not only a weaker leadout train but had also lost his principal leadout in Selig.
Furthermore by raising Viviani will also probably require the raising of riders like Sagan who I don't really see as being that much inferior to Bennett in a sprint.
I actually for the Lite DB thought about chaninging some of these sprinting stats and indeed did so but soon changed them back as they didn't feel right and I go with my previous opinion that it will be best to analyse the sprint stats when the Tour is on and then we can compare Vivian's sprint stats into a better light even though he is not riding
Naxela- I'm sure that Bouhanni will get a further downgrade after the Tour and it will be a case of seeing how his teammate Laporte does in the Tour.
Anyway not long to wait with the Tour starting tomorrow and a whole load of probable sprint stages in the opening few days-
Edited by Tafiolmo on 06-07-2018 21:32
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| haasje33 |
Posted on 07-07-2018 09:40
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Sprinter
Posts: 1679
Joined: 08-08-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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Lite Pack V2 available for download now!
PCM.daily's Database Team is very pleased to present the pre-Tour de France Update of the Lite Pack. You will have new races, real additional sponsors, some graphics enhancements and most importantly the PCM.daily stats have been implemented.
Download the Lite Pack V2 here!
Inactive due to personal reasons.
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| haasje33 |
Posted on 07-07-2018 11:28
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Sprinter
Posts: 1679
Joined: 08-08-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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There have been some problems uploading to Steam Workshop, but these problems have now been solved. You can subscribe to V2 using the link below:
Inactive due to personal reasons.
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| emre99 |
Posted on 07-07-2018 11:36
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3332
Joined: 19-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Woah bouhanni with 79 it is a disgrace, Vivani should be same with Bennett.
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| O-D-Marseille |
Posted on 07-07-2018 11:39
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Under 23
Posts: 66
Joined: 25-08-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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emre99 wrote:
Woah bouhanni with 79 it is a disgrace, Vivani should be same with Bennett.
Disgrace?  |
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