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Pre-Renewals DB 2018 (v2)
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 19-06-2018 22:24
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 18187
Joined: 12-05-2012
PCM$: 0.00
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I've got to join the voices on sprinters... Alaphilippe (76,37) + Docker (76,17) being similar in OVL to Simon Yates (76.73), Talansky (76.77) and Ricki Nelson (76.81)? The first two are definitely overrated by comparision, Alaphilippe 77SP should be nowhere close to Nelson 81SP [yes i know Alaphilippe has 73HL but that's nothing for a 77SP]. And this was supported by rankings where an unmaxed Yates, Talansky and Nelson all handily outscored Docker.
Soupe has an OVL 75.67 which is a bit below Alaphilippe + Docker, and that makes sense but given a difference in back-ups even he feels too high.
I can only talk about my team, because trying to sort the DB by OVL makes it crash and i'm not diving that hard into these numbers. But the sprinter thing jumps out for lower tier sprinters
I don't think Cobblers with SP are overrated. Thomas at OVL 77.22 (79CB, 74SP) is a good bit above Burghardt (80CB, 65SP, OVL 76.23) but that makes sense to me. Especially looking at Thomas results where he's both acted well as a Sprinter, Leadout and Cobbles attacker. Same for Darren Matthews at a much lower level who's gone up on OVL, but it's backed up by their performances.
As always i'm hugely impressed by some members in depth work on all this. I'm not as commited as you guys and defer to better informed judgements, nice to see they match with my thoughts.
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| quadsas |
Posted on 19-06-2018 23:34
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Small Tour Specialist
Posts: 2518
Joined: 18-01-2013
PCM$: 300.00
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Aquarius97 wrote:
It's 9 Lithuanians who currently have a contract with teams. FA aren't added to this DB
I figured. Still saddened by this injustice from all the other teams! |
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| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 19-06-2018 23:55
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Team Manager
Posts: 33046
Joined: 08-03-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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Thank you to those who have commented. Here is a Version 2: https://www.dropbox.com/s/kfb4ct96rhf...2.xls?dl=0
As well as addressing some of the concerns raised in the thread, it also sees an increase to some of the riders with a stronger 'flat' ability (not exclusively related to the flat stat, but certainly a key part of that) - a change that was intended to appear in V1, but not properly implemented when transferring formulas between files.
I also have an updated version of knockout's 3rd graph also, after he kindly sent me his analysis. Shown below is the first version, and the new second version, to highlight some of the differences.
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 22-11-2024 18:53
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Bot Agent
Posts: Countless
Joined: 23.11.09
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| Croatia14 |
Posted on 20-06-2018 00:30
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Directeur Sportif
Posts: 9099
Joined: 13-03-2013
PCM$: 2100.00
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Thanks for listening to the feedback and working on this!
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| SotD |
Posted on 20-06-2018 06:50
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World Champion
Posts: 12188
Joined: 29-11-2006
PCM$: 2980.00
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This is some nice fine tuning SN. Really!
I do agree that the sprinters were up to high in general, but that the sprinters were highly underrated in the previous edition, so this is a good balance. Also the combination stat riders are looking spot on. While I obviously disagree with Roman that Bewley isn't, by far, the strongest, with Taaramäe, by far, the second strongest, I can live with the fact that he isn't rated as such.
But to pick on those numbers, Andy Schleck won last season due to a perfect season and while he had NO errors what so ever, Sam Bewley wasted 21 racedays at the Tour de France, scoring a similar amount of points as what he would have done by racing the TONE with 9. Hence the reason he didn't win wasn't because he wasn't the best, but because he wasn't planned nearly as good.
This season he won, and while Simon Spilak came close, it was due to Taaramäe crashing out of Tour de France contention. Otherwise you could remove 400 points or so from Simon Spilak and hand them to Taaramäe.
Anyway...
Looking at my team, the new OVL says:
1 Simon Spilak
2 Jerome Coppel
3 Pierre-Henri Lecuisinier
4 Bryan Coquard
5 Clement Koretzky
6 Tom David
7 Panagiotis Vlatos
8 Jakub Novak
9 Yuriy Vasyliv
10 Emerson Santos
And thruthfully this is EXACTLY how I would rate them. and when I scroll through the other PT teams I believe their top 10 looks very correct aswell, with some minor flaws, such as Smirnovs ahead of Dzamastagic, Koch, Lopez, Stoltz and Vosekalns. Kristian Sbaragli ahead of Lars Boom, Nick van der Lijke ahead of Keinath, Goos and König, Wouter Wippert ahead of Marcel Kittel and Alex Kirsch, Danny van Poppel ahead of Gianluca Brambilla and Ramon Sinkeldam, Xavier Quevedo ahead of Janez Brajkovic, Ricardo Ferreira ahead of Nelson Oliveira, Frederico Figueiredo, Rui Pedro Vinhas, aswell as Fabio Felline ahead of Francesco Bongiorno, Nikias Arndt and Dominique Nerz.
These examples are very few, however, and I wouldn't start tinkering with the OVL system to fix it, as I fear it will rather mess up the overall picture, which for me is, the most well rounded OVL update ever.
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| alexkr00 |
Posted on 20-06-2018 09:22
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World Champion
Posts: 13915
Joined: 05-08-2008
PCM$: 300.00
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Yes, this one looks better. Thanks for the update 
As for the sprinters problem, I agree with SotD that they were underrated in previous years but I think this is true only with the very top sprinters and that's why the previous DB looked... weird. While it somehow balanced things at the top the other sprinters were very overrated since 79 and 80 sprinters aren't able to get very often results of their own in the PT.
Since it's hard to find a balance to compute the OVL to reflect the reality between all sprinters, I think the new version is rather good.
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| DubbelDekker |
Posted on 20-06-2018 19:04
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Small Tour Specialist
Posts: 2633
Joined: 20-04-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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Very cool visualization knockout! Looks like it helped refine the algorithm even further. 
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| knockout |
Posted on 20-06-2018 22:29
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7735
Joined: 21-12-2010
PCM$: 400.00
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SportingNonsense wrote:
We will be announcing some of the key details for the 2018 season shortly, ahead of the beginning of renewals. Please could you reply if there are any details/rules/etc that you would like to be aware of, before conducting renewals.
It may be that we already plan to address this in the Renewals information thread, but if not, we will look to add it in.
yep, it's me again 
I'd like to know the followings:
- loan rules, particularly concerning any possible level 1->3 rules
- min transfer fee
- sacking fees
- min amount of riders & do stagiares still count towards the minimum
And basically everything that could be seen as surprising by managers.
Ideally I'd also want to see new free agents & stuff like RDs but i understand that that might still be in work and stuff like that is not absolutely crucial although helpful to make a plan for the entire offseason incl renewals & transfers.
A Big Thank You To All MG Reporters! |
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| SotD |
Posted on 21-06-2018 07:04
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World Champion
Posts: 12188
Joined: 29-11-2006
PCM$: 2980.00
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Racedays would definately be useful, as the amount of racedays for leaders is quite important for planning. Most of the PT races are obvious choices for leaders, but some need a lot of fiddling to maximize points.
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| roturn |
Posted on 22-06-2018 10:52
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Team Manager
Posts: 22246
Joined: 24-11-2007
PCM$: 3900.00
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As I don`t want to make a new thread or something, I post it here, guessing it might be the most looked thread. 
As the active off-season is starting soon, it`s time to clean up your shared dropbox, so that we can find and identify files easier.
For new managers, if not already done so, please PM me your dropbox email, so that I can create a shared folder as said in the other New Manager related thread. |
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| DubbelDekker |
Posted on 22-06-2018 12:59
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Small Tour Specialist
Posts: 2633
Joined: 20-04-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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It's starting
Dropbox cleaned
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| SotD |
Posted on 22-06-2018 13:06
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World Champion
Posts: 12188
Joined: 29-11-2006
PCM$: 2980.00
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X2
Boy do I hope things are not intensified by week 29-30 as those are my only vacation weeks, and probably aren't around much.
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| Scorchio |
Posted on 22-06-2018 13:19
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Small Tour Specialist
Posts: 2073
Joined: 14-09-2013
PCM$: 4500.00
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Done (DropBox). And excited!
Anyone else having technical issues with the DB? Think is at my side, as files (v1+2) worked fine for first day or two. Now when open (I use Excel 2007) not showing properly. Tried re-downloading and the same problem. Maybe there has benn some sort of Office update? In the meantime, anyone able to suggest a (free) program that will enable me to not just look at DB (can do in dropbox), but 'sort' it.
Manager of ISA - Hexacta in the MG |
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| SotD |
Posted on 22-06-2018 13:37
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World Champion
Posts: 12188
Joined: 29-11-2006
PCM$: 2980.00
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Scorchio wrote:
Done (DropBox). And excited!
Anyone else having technical issues with the DB? Think is at my side, as files (v1+2) worked fine for first day or two. Now when open (I use Excel 2007) not showing properly. Tried re-downloading and the same problem. Maybe there has benn some sort of Office update? In the meantime, anyone able to suggest a (free) program that will enable me to not just look at DB (can do in dropbox), but 'sort' it.
OpenOffice might do it.
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| DubbelDekker |
Posted on 22-06-2018 14:21
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Small Tour Specialist
Posts: 2633
Joined: 20-04-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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SotD wrote:
X2
Boy do I hope things are not intensified by week 29-30 as those are my only vacation weeks, and probably aren't around much.
I'm hoping the same for week 31 and 32. Fingers crossed.
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| hillis91 |
Posted on 22-06-2018 15:01
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Team Leader
Posts: 5897
Joined: 30-11-2006
PCM$: 1500.00
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Dropbox cleaned and changed name to "Equinor" =)
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| Tamijo |
Posted on 22-06-2018 15:25
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Team Leader
Posts: 7406
Joined: 14-07-2015
PCM$: 599.00
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Dropbox cleaned
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| ryant |
Posted on 22-06-2018 15:33
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Small Tour Specialist
Posts: 2322
Joined: 15-08-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Same here, dropbox cleaned up a little
 John St Ledger in Team Bunzl-Centrica and Team U25Red Bull Driver in RFactor
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| roturn |
Posted on 22-06-2018 15:37
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Team Manager
Posts: 22246
Joined: 24-11-2007
PCM$: 3900.00
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No need to post it here for all managers. 
I will see once files are shared. |
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| Tamijo |
Posted on 22-06-2018 15:52
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Team Leader
Posts: 7406
Joined: 14-07-2015
PCM$: 599.00
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we just like spamming
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![imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg](https://imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg)
