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PCM.daily Stats Discussion
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| bassiii |
Posted on 07-10-2017 19:39
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Under 23
Posts: 95
Joined: 28-03-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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Moscon 76/77 MO/HI? |
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| AiZaK |
Posted on 07-10-2017 20:20
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1187
Joined: 13-04-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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I agree with Nibali 79 in Hills and Moscon 76 in Mountain and 77 in Hills too |
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| aldrofj |
Posted on 07-10-2017 21:19
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Free Agent
Posts: 139
Joined: 14-07-2017
PCM$: 300.00
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marcoplv95 wrote:
@aldrofj: How are your stars differents from mine?
i downloaded latest db from the first post (V1.1) and Nibali has the stats i wrote.
They are constantly edited on the spreadsheet linked on the first page.
Forever the Best wrote:Spoiler
aldrofj wrote:
marcoplv95 wrote:
NIBALI
FLA 73 (+1) one point better than Porte and Urà n is enough...
HIL 79 (+1) i remember he was already 79 HIL and i don't think it would be too much. He actually deserves it (like Chaves after winning Lombardia 2016)
ACC 74/75 (+1/+2) as you can see when he's in good condition he can blow other riders. It would be still less than most of other GC contenders.
DHI 83 (+1) Back at his previous value, nothing more. When he has to force, he does. He's just the best descender after Salvoldelli.
STA 79 (+1) This is the value i always suggested for him, even after Giro 2017, i just advice it again.
PINOT
STA 77 (+1)
DHI 69/70 (+2/+3)
Insightful suggestions. Nibali has currently 71 FL and 77 HIL, 74 ACC, 82 DH and 78 STA.
I agree with 73 FL, 75 ACC and 83 DH. 79 STA seems to be too much compared to the other GT riders, who have around 75-76. With 78, he has the same level as riders like Fuglsang or Poels who are more designated for small tours or classics. Valverde has 79 STA.
79 HIL is also too much for him, he has been reduced to 77 for his Vuelta, unable to follow Froome and Chaves (78 and 79 HIL) on hilly stages, especially on Cumbre del Sol. He could have 78 VAL, but not 79.
Pinot has 76 STA and 67 DH. 76 STA is enough in my opinion, with Aru at 76, Quintana at 75 and Pozzovivo at 74. For DH, 67 is too low. Pinot is correct in this exercise, and he deserves at least 69. It has been proven many times that Nibali is awesome in 200+ km one-day races. MSR '12, LBL '12, WCRR '13, Lombardia '15, OGRR '16, Lombardia '17. He was also very good in MSR '11.
It has been proven many times. This is why Nibali has 2 or 3 points more than the best GT contenders.
79 STA → Valverde (79 MO)
78 STA → Nibali (81 MO), Fuglsang & Poels (79 MO), Thomas (78 MO)
77 STA → Chaves & Contador (80 MO), Martin & Mollema (79 MO)
76 STA → Bardet & Landa (81 MO), Aru, Pinot, Uran & Zakarin (80 MO), Henao & Izagirre (78 MO)
75 STA → Froome & Quintana (82 MO), Barguil & Pozzovivo (79 MO), Nieve (78 MO)
79 STA for Nibali is not absurd, but it seems a bit high compared to his opponents.
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 07-10-2017 21:21
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Nibali
A few tweaks have been done for "'His Nibs" but hill of 79 is too high, yes he used to have that and that was a bad stat idea from me at the time because at least Chaves this year excluding, does well on hills in GT's. Nibali is actually poorer than most top GT riders on hills in the tours. I find he prefers longer climbs, so 78 is a good compromise. I'm not sure if he should have more than 72 flat and I don't think he's any better than say Uran on flat and 72 is actually decent for a GT rider if we take Froome at 74 as being the best. Also Lombarida has been added to his fav race list so that will make him race fav each time the race is played I'm sure
Pinot
Yes he's better at DH than his stats would suggest but to simulate his poor DH like today in relation to Nibali that needs quite a wide gap to make that possible. I find in GT's long DH's that are not too technical create some realistic gaps but in shorter ones like at Lombardia less so, so no reason to give Pinot an improvement there. Also depending on his fav race list, he could have Lombardia as a fav race as he is clearly on good form for this race each year.
Moscon
Some of the climbing stats being suggested for him are crazy! I certainly wouldn't make him better than Kwiat in that aspect. Also this is a powerful flat and res rider he will go much better than his stats suggest, increasing him too much will be risky. I'd say for anymore big changes for him better to wait until next season
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| Forever the Best |
Posted on 07-10-2017 21:23
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3785
Joined: 27-06-2014
PCM$: 400.00
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aldrofj wrote:
marcoplv95 wrote:
@aldrofj: How are your stars differents from mine?
i downloaded latest db from the first post (V1.1) and Nibali has the stats i wrote.
They are constantly edited on the spreadsheet linked on the first page.
Forever the Best wrote:Spoiler
aldrofj wrote:
marcoplv95 wrote:
NIBALI
FLA 73 (+1) one point better than Porte and Urà n is enough...
HIL 79 (+1) i remember he was already 79 HIL and i don't think it would be too much. He actually deserves it (like Chaves after winning Lombardia 2016)
ACC 74/75 (+1/+2) as you can see when he's in good condition he can blow other riders. It would be still less than most of other GC contenders.
DHI 83 (+1) Back at his previous value, nothing more. When he has to force, he does. He's just the best descender after Salvoldelli.
STA 79 (+1) This is the value i always suggested for him, even after Giro 2017, i just advice it again.
PINOT
STA 77 (+1)
DHI 69/70 (+2/+3)
Insightful suggestions. Nibali has currently 71 FL and 77 HIL, 74 ACC, 82 DH and 78 STA.
I agree with 73 FL, 75 ACC and 83 DH. 79 STA seems to be too much compared to the other GT riders, who have around 75-76. With 78, he has the same level as riders like Fuglsang or Poels who are more designated for small tours or classics. Valverde has 79 STA.
79 HIL is also too much for him, he has been reduced to 77 for his Vuelta, unable to follow Froome and Chaves (78 and 79 HIL) on hilly stages, especially on Cumbre del Sol. He could have 78 VAL, but not 79.
Pinot has 76 STA and 67 DH. 76 STA is enough in my opinion, with Aru at 76, Quintana at 75 and Pozzovivo at 74. For DH, 67 is too low. Pinot is correct in this exercise, and he deserves at least 69. It has been proven many times that Nibali is awesome in 200+ km one-day races. MSR '12, LBL '12, WCRR '13, Lombardia '15, OGRR '16, Lombardia '17. He was also very good in MSR '11.
It has been proven many times. This is why Nibali has 2 or 3 points more than the best GT contenders.
79 STA → Valverde (79 MO)
78 STA → Nibali (81 MO), Fuglsang & Poels (79 MO), Thomas (78 MO)
77 STA → Chaves & Contador (80 MO), Martin & Mollema (79 MO)
76 STA → Bardet & Landa (81 MO), Aru, Pinot, Uran & Zakarin (80 MO), Henao & Izagirre (78 MO)
75 STA → Froome & Quintana (82 MO), Barguil & Pozzovivo (79 MO), Nieve (78 MO)
79 STA for Nibali is not absurd, but it seems a bit high compared to his opponents. Ah fine. Didn't know the stats of the other riders. I also think that decreasing Thomas's STA by 2 or 3 would be appropriate. His best result in monuments is a 7th place from 2014 P-R and it is not like he has done great in a 200+ km GT mountain stage.
The user formerly known as 'The Schleck Fan'
Gracias Alberto.
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 07-10-2017 21:45
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Now the seasons more or less finished the stats team will do a large exercise in dropping a number of riders in stats where they haven't performed that well this season. In general it's often easier to raise stats than drop them so now would be a good time for some riders to be dropped
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| AiZaK |
Posted on 07-10-2017 22:25
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1187
Joined: 13-04-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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Ok, Finally Gianni Moscon which stats he will be in the Final Expansion Pack??? |
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| bah |
Posted on 07-10-2017 23:54
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Under 23
Posts: 70
Joined: 16-07-2017
PCM$: 200.00
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AiZaK wrote:
Ok, Finally Gianni Moscon which stats he will be in the Final Expansion Pack???
You mean when it's released? He'll be retired. |
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| franki28 |
Posted on 08-10-2017 03:02
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Stagiare
Posts: 216
Joined: 27-02-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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bah wrote:
AiZaK wrote:
Ok, Finally Gianni Moscon which stats he will be in the Final Expansion Pack???
You mean when it's released? He'll be retired.
daily reminder that you can provide help for its completion  |
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| Naxela |
Posted on 08-10-2017 03:41
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Stagiare
Posts: 169
Joined: 25-02-2015
PCM$: 200.00
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I don't feel this years Lombardia was the hardest one, not many guys who bothered to stay in shape after the WC and the competition was lower than usual but he definitly deserves a big upgrade for what he have done in the second half of the season.
I feel Moscon deserves some kind of Vuillermoz stats. High Mountain but even higher HIL (77 or 76?/78) also he can ride cobbles so his back up stats on flat and STA should be fairly high. Also a decent high boost in TT (the vuelta stage he saved energy).
New York Knicks - Bardiani CFS - AG2R - Millwall FC - Le Havre AC
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| bah |
Posted on 08-10-2017 08:27
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Under 23
Posts: 70
Joined: 16-07-2017
PCM$: 200.00
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franki28 wrote:
bah wrote:
AiZaK wrote:
Ok, Finally Gianni Moscon which stats he will be in the Final Expansion Pack???
You mean when it's released? He'll be retired.
daily reminder that you can provide help for its completion
No I can't. I'm useless. |
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 05-12-2025 20:07
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Bot Agent
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| AiZaK |
Posted on 11-10-2017 12:42
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1187
Joined: 13-04-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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Matteo Trentin which stats he will be???
Hills 74? Sprint 77? |
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| timpiej |
Posted on 11-10-2017 12:53
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Domestique
Posts: 598
Joined: 08-12-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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franki28 wrote:
bah wrote:
AiZaK wrote:
Ok, Finally Gianni Moscon which stats he will be in the Final Expansion Pack???
You mean when it's released? He'll be retired.
daily reminder that you can provide help for its completion
Then maybe some communication from the DB Team so we know what needs help, so people who are interested can offer their help... I agree there's no deadline, I agree there is personal life and I totally agree that since it's made to bring joy while the makers ask nothing in return. But like a roadmap (even just a global one, no specifics) like mentioned in the bugs thread, or just a little heads up in the (weekly?) news is not a big time waster, is it? |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 11-10-2017 21:32
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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AiZak
Trentin will be 78 flat 77 sprint and 74 hill
Timpiej
Stats are the easiest to do for the DB as long as they are done on a regular basis but the delays are always caused by the more technical stuff like graphics, stages and making sure everything gels together etc and this requires a hell of a lot more time to achive for those that do it. and as always it will arrive when it arrives
If it's any consolation to you, I also have no idea when the DB will be released and I'm part of the team!
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| trekbmc |
Posted on 11-10-2017 21:42
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Team Leader
Posts: 7336
Joined: 11-07-2014
PCM$: 700.00
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bah wrote:
franki28 wrote:
bah wrote:
AiZaK wrote:
Ok, Finally Gianni Moscon which stats he will be in the Final Expansion Pack???
You mean when it's released? He'll be retired.
daily reminder that you can provide help for its completion
No I can't. I'm useless.
Well, a good part of making stages is sitting in front of your computer complaining about how long it takes for something to happen (in this case being the stage editor loading). So perhaps you'd be pretty good at it. 
"What done is, is one." - Benji Naesen
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 11-10-2017 21:55
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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trekbmc wrote:
bah wrote:
franki28 wrote:
bah wrote:
AiZaK wrote:
Ok, Finally Gianni Moscon which stats he will be in the Final Expansion Pack???
You mean when it's released? He'll be retired.
daily reminder that you can provide help for its completion
No I can't. I'm useless.
Well, a good part of making stages is sitting in front of your computer complaining about how long it takes for something to happen (in this case being the stage editor loading). So perhaps you'd be pretty good at it.
Many years ago I actually tried to create a race and did my homework, made notes and watched a whole load of You Tube videos as well and after a lot of time I actually started to create my first race Kuurne Brussels Kuurne but in the end what finished me doing stages was that ******* stage editor loading slowly, crashing and freezing randomly!
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| Paul23 |
Posted on 11-10-2017 22:03
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4394
Joined: 10-08-2011
PCM$: 400.00
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Tafiolmo wrote:
trekbmc wrote:
bah wrote:
franki28 wrote:
bah wrote:
AiZaK wrote:
Ok, Finally Gianni Moscon which stats he will be in the Final Expansion Pack???
You mean when it's released? He'll be retired.
daily reminder that you can provide help for its completion
No I can't. I'm useless.
Well, a good part of making stages is sitting in front of your computer complaining about how long it takes for something to happen (in this case being the stage editor loading). So perhaps you'd be pretty good at it.
Many years ago I actually tried to create a race and did my homework, made notes and watched a whole load of You Tube videos as well and after a lot of time I actually started to create my first race Kuurne Brussels Kuurne but in the end what finished me doing stages was that ******* stage editor loading slowly, crashing and freezing randomly!
I was able to cope with the loading, but when 4h of work just crash and lose it all, I stopped trying.
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 11-10-2017 22:05
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Paul23 wrote:
Tafiolmo wrote:
trekbmc wrote:
bah wrote:
franki28 wrote:
bah wrote:
AiZaK wrote:
Ok, Finally Gianni Moscon which stats he will be in the Final Expansion Pack???
You mean when it's released? He'll be retired.
daily reminder that you can provide help for its completion
No I can't. I'm useless.
Well, a good part of making stages is sitting in front of your computer complaining about how long it takes for something to happen (in this case being the stage editor loading). So perhaps you'd be pretty good at it.
Many years ago I actually tried to create a race and did my homework, made notes and watched a whole load of You Tube videos as well and after a lot of time I actually started to create my first race Kuurne Brussels Kuurne but in the end what finished me doing stages was that ******* stage editor loading slowly, crashing and freezing randomly!
I was able to cope with the loading, but when 4h of work just crash and lose it all, I stopped trying.
I lost some of my work as well.......... it's soul destroying!
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| trekbmc |
Posted on 11-10-2017 22:42
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Team Leader
Posts: 7336
Joined: 11-07-2014
PCM$: 700.00
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Tafiolmo wrote:
Paul23 wrote:
Tafiolmo wrote:
trekbmc wrote:
bah wrote:
franki28 wrote:
bah wrote:
AiZaK wrote:
Ok, Finally Gianni Moscon which stats he will be in the Final Expansion Pack???
You mean when it's released? He'll be retired.
daily reminder that you can provide help for its completion
No I can't. I'm useless.
Well, a good part of making stages is sitting in front of your computer complaining about how long it takes for something to happen (in this case being the stage editor loading). So perhaps you'd be pretty good at it.
Many years ago I actually tried to create a race and did my homework, made notes and watched a whole load of You Tube videos as well and after a lot of time I actually started to create my first race Kuurne Brussels Kuurne but in the end what finished me doing stages was that ******* stage editor loading slowly, crashing and freezing randomly!
I was able to cope with the loading, but when 4h of work just crash and lose it all, I stopped trying.
I lost some of my work as well.......... it's soul destroying!
It is 
A good stage for me is sticking under 150 saves because I'm so scared of it crashing that I save it super regularly.
"What done is, is one." - Benji Naesen
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| timpiej |
Posted on 11-10-2017 23:32
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Domestique
Posts: 598
Joined: 08-12-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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Tafiolmo wrote:
AiZak
Trentin will be 78 flat 77 sprint and 74 hill
Timpiej
Stats are the easiest to do for the DB as long as they are done on a regular basis but the delays are always caused by the more technical stuff like graphics, stages and making sure everything gels together etc and this requires a hell of a lot more time to achive for those that do it. and as always it will arrive when it arrives
If it's any consolation to you, I also have no idea when the DB will be released and I'm part of the team!
Yeah, but I don't mind making some more trainers (like all directeur sportifs of the teams registered on UCI website) for example. I know I'm shit at graphical stuff so that's why I asked in the bug thread what I can help in terms of DB-work. No reply came, so I guess then that means that that part is as good as finished? |
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