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Dot managing
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| foskikaiser92 |
Posted on 14-07-2017 15:18
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Amateur
Posts: 17
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How do you understand which is the right number to set in the free effort cursor?? |
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| matt17br |
Posted on 14-07-2017 15:22
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Directeur Sportif
Posts: 10525
Joined: 28-09-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Trial and error?
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| foskikaiser92 |
Posted on 14-07-2017 15:28
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Amateur
Posts: 17
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Surely but a rough indication |
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| Teddy The Creator |
Posted on 14-07-2017 18:04
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Small Tour Specialist
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Just have a go, it really depends completely on the stage, rider, form etc.. could be anywhere from 10 to 90 required to keep up. Only way to work it out is to try. |
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| foskikaiser92 |
Posted on 14-07-2017 18:39
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Amateur
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Teddy The Creator wrote:
Just have a go, it really depends completely on the stage, rider, form etc.. could be anywhere from 10 to 90 required to keep up. Only way to work it out is to try.
The question can be reduced to the fact that i have to increase if the pace is strenghten up and to decrease if the pace is slower |
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| GTSilvano |
Posted on 15-07-2017 07:43
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I may not be a great PCM player but here are my numbers for a stage racer:
using maintain position at 59, because lower flat skill. If the peloton accelerates, I find myself to use 70-75 in order to keep position and not fall back.
For hills/mountains for a stage racer I can keep either 59 or 59 with dot as the dot won't take much of the green bar for this kind of cyclist.
At the end of the race to keep up in the last 40-30 km I have to use 70-75 on flat and 75-80 on hills/mountains.
Using the dot on hills and mountains only at the end instead of constantly attacking like the computer does and near the end I do one attack and go on by myself. |
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| foskikaiser92 |
Posted on 15-07-2017 11:41
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Amateur
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GTSilvano wrote:
I may not be a great PCM player but here are my numbers for a stage racer:
using maintain position at 59, because lower flat skill. If the peloton accelerates, I find myself to use 70-75 in order to keep position and not fall back.
For hills/mountains for a stage racer I can keep either 59 or 59 with dot as the dot won't take much of the green bar for this kind of cyclist.
At the end of the race to keep up in the last 40-30 km I have to use 70-75 on flat and 75-80 on hills/mountains.
Using the dot on hills and mountains only at the end instead of constantly attacking like the computer does and near the end I do one attack and go on by myself.
Thank you for the suggestion. I never go down 70 because 70 is the default value |
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| foskikaiser92 |
Posted on 17-07-2017 10:51
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I noticed that in pcm17 if i put dot on 70 i lose contact of the peloton very soon |
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| Lamba |
Posted on 17-07-2017 11:05
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Stagiare
Posts: 150
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foskikaiser92 wrote:
I noticed that in pcm17 if i put dot on 70 i lose contact of the peloton very soon
I've used ~60-70 in breakaways and 70-88 while sitting in peloton at 70-72 flat stat (as climber).
I keep it on 70 and sit behind the front when the early breakaway goes off. No reason my guy tries to maintain position at the front while they're chasing and he doesn't tire too much from 70.
As soon as the pace has settled, I figure out how the rest of the stage is for my guy and typically sit at the back of the front or at the front of the middle of the pack, just so he's not in the wind and can sit tight and put it on maintain at 87 or so.
IF I need to go on the attack later, I've found that 85-88 is roughly what you can do Froome-style without going completely in the red for a longer period of time, hence that's the number I'm typically hoovering about at. |
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| Ad Bot |
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| foskikaiser92 |
Posted on 17-07-2017 11:11
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Lamba wrote:
foskikaiser92 wrote:
I noticed that in pcm17 if i put dot on 70 i lose contact of the peloton very soon
I've used ~60-70 in breakaways and 70-88 while sitting in peloton at 70-72 flat stat (as climber).
I keep it on 70 and sit behind the front when the early breakaway goes off. No reason my guy tries to maintain position at the front while they're chasing and he doesn't tire too much from 70.
As soon as the pace has settled, I figure out how the rest of the stage is for my guy and typically sit at the back of the front or at the front of the middle of the pack, just so he's not in the wind and can sit tight and put it on maintain at 87 or so.
IF I need to go on the attack later, I've found that 85-88 is roughly what you can do Froome-style without going completely in the red for a longer period of time, hence that's the number I'm typically hoovering about at.
Obviously i am talking about mountain stage. I was with richie porte and at the foot of last climb i put dot on 70 and arrived at 3 minutes from the winner froome! |
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| Lamba |
Posted on 17-07-2017 11:17
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Stagiare
Posts: 150
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Mountains is a matter of very few points to one side or the other. You can't just go 75 and then expect same (good) result every time. |
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| foskikaiser92 |
Posted on 17-07-2017 11:18
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Amateur
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Lamba wrote:
Mountains is a matter of very few points to one side or the other. You can't just go 75 and then expect same (good) result every time.
Can you explain what do you mean? |
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| Lamba |
Posted on 17-07-2017 11:24
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Stagiare
Posts: 150
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For a decent (78+) climber, you can often go between 75 and 85 uphill for like 7-10km, maybe even more. But your RDC can influence it greatly and it begins to matter how much energy you've used on the stage.
In my be a pro career as a climber, I've just got to season 2 and changed to Sunweb. I'm almost as good as Kelderman, but he was captain of GP Abu Dhabi (or something like that). I won the first climbing stage (had +2 RDC) and simply outclimbed all the climbers after sitting tight in the peloton all day. The next days I didn't get much help and when we got to the mountains, I'd maybe only have 90-95% yellow bar, while Kelderman had 95-100%. That little bit, along with -1 RDC on both climb finishes meant that I couldn't keep up the pace. Mind you I didn't even attack, I just tried keeping up the pace 'cause I knew I wasn't the strongest.
So you have to do some trial and error as suggested and figure out exactly how you ride with certain riders/stats and then learn to perfect it.
In PCM16, I could just put effort between 70 and 77 when I had 80 MON and then I'd simply grind out the others who'd spend more energy attacking while I just rode my steady pace. It seems to be harder in this version and I like it. |
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| foskikaiser92 |
Posted on 17-07-2017 11:24
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Moreover the problem is that if i increase effort level my rider continues to lose positions instead of recovering positions |
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| Lamba |
Posted on 17-07-2017 11:33
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Stagiare
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If your rider is simply worse than those you're trying to follow, that could be the cause. As a worse rider, a higher effort will drain your energy faster and at 0 energy, you can only ride at like 145 pulse and much slower than if you had just been riding the tempo you knew you could get to the top at. |
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| foskikaiser92 |
Posted on 17-07-2017 11:48
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Lamba wrote:
If your rider is simply worse than those you're trying to follow, that could be the cause. As a worse rider, a higher effort will drain your energy faster and at 0 energy, you can only ride at like 145 pulse and much slower than if you had just been riding the tempo you knew you could get to the top at.
So i have to play with the cursor,increasing or decreasing depending on the pace of the peloton. For example i begin with 70,i lose some positions so i increase of 2-3-4 points and when i have regained the position i decrease to 70. I have to react to peloton behaviour |
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| matt17br |
Posted on 17-07-2017 14:13
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Exactly, that's what you should learn to do in order to improve your skills in PCM, especially when it comes to mountain stages where you have to save up energies in order to win.
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| foskikaiser92 |
Posted on 18-07-2017 11:31
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matt17br wrote:
Exactly, that's what you should learn to do in order to improve your skills in PCM, especially when it comes to mountain stages where you have to save up energies in order to win.
I tried to do this with some problems. In fact when i lose some positions with the dot if i increase the effort to recover positions i continue to drop down. Is it normal? |
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| matt17br |
Posted on 18-07-2017 11:52
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It's normal, because you might not be increasing the dot enough.
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| foskikaiser92 |
Posted on 18-07-2017 11:59
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Amateur
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matt17br wrote:
It's normal, because you might not be increasing the dot enough.
Nono i start to do 71,72,73,74,75 every second in a very fast way but my rider keeps losing positions |
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