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PCM.daily Stats Discussion
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| matt17br |
Posted on 16-06-2017 22:30
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Directeur Sportif
Posts: 10525
Joined: 28-09-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Here's a thread to discuss the stats for the PCM.daily Projects for PCM 17.
Everything written down here will be considered for the next release.
Keep in mind that top stats are the most noticeable stats, but those are most often a matter of opinion. I advice people to change some of those stats to their own likings if you don't agree to the stats in our projects.
For us it'd be much more useful to especially discuss stats about smaller riders, those are often easier to miss.
As of last year, we decided to add some rules, because of some conflicts in the stat discussion that got out of hand. Yes, we know stat discussions, like politics and religion discussions, often show the worst side of people.
1. If you comment on someone's post, comment on the contents of the post, not on the person!
2. Don't make fun of suggestions of other members. Everyone can post their suggestions. It's up to our statmakers to decide what to do with them.
3. Keep your posts strictly on-topic.
Any posts that violate these rules will be deleted immediately.
The stats google document (has got all the most updated stats)
The most recent databases have been attached below:
Edited by matt17br on 18-11-2017 23:47
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| Paul23 |
Posted on 16-06-2017 22:34
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4411
Joined: 10-08-2011
PCM$: 400.00
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The obligatory "Tony needs more of everything" post.
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| Waghlon |
Posted on 16-06-2017 22:41
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7694
Joined: 18-08-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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The obligatory "where is Rebellin"-post that doesn't even mention stats.
Oh, and buff Lasse Norman Hansens stats
THE THOMAS VOECKLER PROPHET OF PCM DAILY
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| Ian Butler |
Posted on 16-06-2017 23:09
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 21854
Joined: 01-05-2012
PCM$: 400.00
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The obligatory "Contador is overrated" post.
Oh - wait. I'm not arberg.
Sorry boys, my bad! |
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| Maddox |
Posted on 17-06-2017 11:04
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 329
Joined: 19-06-2013
PCM$: 400.00
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I just copy-paste my post in here:
Just some thoughts concerning Giant-Castelli
Mikkel Bjerg needs a huge boost in TT and other stats (like 69-70 in TT)
Frederik Rodenberg (for some reason he is called Madsen in the db) needs 69-71 in SP
Rasmus Quaade needs a bit more hill
Mathias Norsgaard needs a boost in TT
Nicklas Amdi Pedersen needs a HUGE boost in especially hill and sp
Casper Pedersen also a huge boost, at least 69 in sp
Thomas Jensen is Thomas Edemann
Rasmus Iversen is Rasmus Byriel
If you were to rank the riders in the team it would be something like (riders in top are the best, so here Quaade is best slightly in front of Casper P and Amdi, then a jump down to Rodenberg and so on...)
Quaade-Casper P-Amdi
Rodenberg-Bjerg-Norsgaard
Vorre-Vinjebo-Folsach-Egholm
Byriel-Therkildsen-Edemann-Bøje
Take a look at PCS to see their results over the season - a general update would be justified.
For other Danish CT teams
Almeborg: Søren Siggard and Morten Hulgaard needs a giant boost. Salby should be 68 or so in so. Martin Toft (not Madsen) is also quite good in hill, Mathias Skov is way better in TT than shown here. Steffen Christiansen may need a little boost.
Toft-Øllegaard-Siggaard-Hulgaard-Lisson
Andreasen-Christiansen-Bigum-Hansen-Salby
Toudal-Skov-Bregnhøj-Hjort
coloQuick: Torkil Veyhe deserves a huge boost (look at PCS). Christien Jørgensen is not Jørgensen but Moberg. Wallin needs a huge boost in SP (69 or so). Vingegaard should be better in mo/hill
Veyhe-Wallin-Vingegaard-Mortensen
Almindsø-Schultz-Klaris-Krigbaum-Schultz
Moberg-Nielsen-Bendixen-Lyhne-Herforth-Hardahl
Riwal: Jonas Gregaard, not Wilsly. Andreas Kron deserves a huge upgrade. Brøchner, Gregaard and Stokbro should get an upgrade, Jonas Aaen (not Jørgensen), Patrick Clausen, Chris Anker Sørensen and Mathias Westergaard should get a little downgrade. Who the hell is Jesper Christensen?
Brøchner-Stokbro-Gregaard-Vinther
Kron-CAS-Clausen-Aaen-Djurhuus
Mygind-Westergaard-Kongstad-Vinkel-Würtz
Veloconcept: Eg derserves an upgrade in mo/hill. Anthon Charmig an upgrade in stage race-stats (he is a huge talent!!!). Otherwise great job.
Kamp-Guldhammer
Asgreen-Carbel-Eg-Reihs
Charmig-Larsen-Steen
Pedersen-Rahbek-Jeppsen-Riis
I know my stat suggestions are a little unprecise, but my ranking should be a great starting point in terms of definating the strength between the riders in the team. Moreover, I can make a ranking between all riders from the Danish CT teams?
Also, keep in mind that when I write Casper Pedersen should get an increase in SP, I also mean the associated stats. |
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| Croatia14 |
Posted on 17-06-2017 13:14
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Directeur Sportif
Posts: 9099
Joined: 13-03-2013
PCM$: 2100.00
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Fantastic insight given Maddox! While I agree on most ones I am not sure with others (Bjerg f.e., we have to compare him to other junior riders of his year (like McNulty) and then weight them up, which means that for him f.e. something like 68 would be better - remember, a rider like him is very likely to develop over the season)
but again thanks a lot for this detailed insight 
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| Maddox |
Posted on 17-06-2017 13:21
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 329
Joined: 19-06-2013
PCM$: 400.00
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Croatia14 wrote:
Fantastic insight given Maddox! While I agree on most ones I am not sure with others (Bjerg f.e., we have to compare him to other junior riders of his year (like McNulty) and then weight them up, which means that for him f.e. something like 68 would be better - remember, a rider like him is very likely to develop over the season)
but again thanks a lot for this detailed insight
As a person close to Giant-Castelli, I can say that Mikkel Bjerg is not far a away from Quaade TT-wise and that should be reflected in his stats. He will do top 8 in Danish National TT next week, no doubt.
EDIT: Rodenberg could turn into a TOP TOP sprinter btw. |
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| Maddox |
Posted on 17-06-2017 13:41
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 329
Joined: 19-06-2013
PCM$: 400.00
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For Danish CT the ranking would be something like (just categories, not that number 1 in the category is better than number 2 etc)
Quaade-Casper P-Amdi-Toft-Veyhe-Wallin-Brøchner-Stokbro-Kamp-Guldhammer-Asgreen
Rodenberg-Øllegaard-Vingegaard-Mortensen-Almindsø-Gregaard-Vinther-Kron-Carbel
Bjerg-Norsgaard-Vorre-Siggaard-Hulgaard-Lisson-Schultz-Klaris-Krigbaum-Clausen-CAS-Aaen-Djurhuus-Eg-Reihs-Christiansen-Bigum
Vinjebo-Folsach-Egholm-Byriel-Hansen-Salby-Toudal-Skov-Moberg-Bendixen-Lyhne-Nielsen-Mygind-Westergaard-Charmig-Larsen-Steen-Pedersen-Rahbek-Jeppesen-Riis
Therkildsen-Edemann-Bøje-Brergnhøj-Hjort-Herforth-Hardahl-Kongstad-Vinkel-Würtz
This is the general level between the riders - so the first category is the best -
the strongest - riders in the Danish CT level. Some are better in TT and hill (like Quaade) and others in sprint/hill (like Wallin). |
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| O-D-Marseille |
Posted on 19-06-2017 16:45
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Under 23
Posts: 66
Joined: 25-08-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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Wait a minute..... I just downloaded the db, and I saw Fuglsang has 77 mountain? Please. |
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| matt17br |
Posted on 19-06-2017 16:49
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Directeur Sportif
Posts: 10525
Joined: 28-09-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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He's 78 in the stats sheet, the db last got copied over before Dauphiné. He might get 79 depending on circumstances.
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 26-11-2024 06:40
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Bot Agent
Posts: Countless
Joined: 23.11.09
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| O-D-Marseille |
Posted on 19-06-2017 16:52
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Under 23
Posts: 66
Joined: 25-08-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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hmm, okay :/+
EDIT: Btw. he is 77 in mountain and 78 in hills in my version, just downloaded it today. |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 19-06-2017 17:22
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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O-D-Marseille wrote:
hmm, okay :/+
EDIT: Btw. he is 77 in mountain and 78 in hills in my version, just downloaded it today.
What you have is the last PCM16 season 2017 update that came out after the Giro which is the latest DB update.
But in the working stats sheet which is done on a daily basis he has 78 in both mtn and hills with the possibility to go even higher depending how well he does at the Tour for the next DB which will be for PCM17.
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| R_U_MINE |
Posted on 19-06-2017 19:10
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Amateur
Posts: 17
Joined: 15-05-2014
PCM$: 200.00
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Mathias Frank 76 mountain ? Come on... at least 77... |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 19-06-2017 19:24
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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He has the Tour Suisse in his fav races list but I do agree he is nearer 77 than 76 based on the last week. Like Fuglsang if he does well at the Tour he will certainly go up and I'll mark that in his stat notes
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| DiCyc |
Posted on 19-06-2017 19:45
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Sprinter
Posts: 1636
Joined: 09-03-2015
PCM$: 200.00
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I think Hirt should be 77 MTN?
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| Forever the Best |
Posted on 19-06-2017 20:02
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3803
Joined: 27-06-2014
PCM$: 400.00
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Agreed. Showed great form in the final week of Giro (especially stage 19 and 20 but was also good at stages 16 and 18 where he was the 2nd and 3rd finisher from the breakaway respectively) and was decent at Tiefenbachferner. |
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| ppanther |
Posted on 21-06-2017 16:59
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Domestique
Posts: 482
Joined: 25-12-2011
PCM$: 200.00
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The Schleck Fan wrote:
Agreed. Showed great form in the final week of Giro (especially stage 19 and 20 but was also good at stages 16 and 18 where he was the 2nd and 3rd finisher from the breakaway respectively) and was decent at Tiefenbachferner.
I think you can even argue for 78 in Hirt's case. Have out him on 78 with low Flat and low Resistance and also 74 Hills or something like this and it works pretty well in replicating his results (cause to be honest he is a great climber, who really sucks at putting out huge power numbers and losing lots of time in "easy" stages). |
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| Croatia14 |
Posted on 21-06-2017 17:06
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Directeur Sportif
Posts: 9099
Joined: 13-03-2013
PCM$: 2100.00
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ppanther wrote:
The Schleck Fan wrote:
Agreed. Showed great form in the final week of Giro (especially stage 19 and 20 but was also good at stages 16 and 18 where he was the 2nd and 3rd finisher from the breakaway respectively) and was decent at Tiefenbachferner.
I think you can even argue for 78 in Hirt's case. Have out him on 78 with low Flat and low Resistance and also 74 Hills or something like this and it works pretty well in replicating his results (cause to be honest he is a great climber, who really sucks at putting out huge power numbers and losing lots of time in "easy" stages).
please keep in mind that he has a very high REC to replicate his Giro results
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| Gentleman |
Posted on 25-06-2017 21:50
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Free Agent
Posts: 138
Joined: 12-02-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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I recall that LottoNL Jumbo's Timo Roosen used to have a better COB stat. Am I mistaken or is he downgraded for some reason?
Looking at his rankings, he generally ends up somewhere around 15 to 20th position in the 'easier' races (E3, Omloop) and around 40-50th in RvV and Paris-Roubaix last year as a teammate who has given his all for his leader. Based on that I would say he deserves a little more than the 63 COB currently assigned in the Lite DB. I recall he used to have a 71 or 73 for it, but not sure whether that's from memory, because I don't have the old DB anymore - only the one I edited here and there  Still, I thought he might deserve a little more than this. 73 sounds reasonable for someone with those rankings. Won't win anything, but will still be able to finish reasonably in lesser races.
Also, didn't he have more TT as well? He currently has a 69, but that looks a little meager for someone who was part of the WC TTT last year. He's no exceptional TTer, but should still be able to consistently push a 72 or 73 at least. Again, it won't win him any prizes, but he should be a tad better than 69 I believe.
I looked up his results from 2017 and it surprised me how he ended up on the podium in the Tour des Fjords in Norway. He finished podium, but also ended up 2nd in the Points ranking. Granted, he is part of the sprint train for Groenewegen, but still, the DB doesn't do him justice with a 64 for sprint and a 71 for flat, but I don't dare to recommend new values for that. For now, I'll stick to his COB and TT values. But if someone else can comment on his SP/FL, I would appreciate that. |
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| cio93 |
Posted on 26-06-2017 01:34
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World Champion
Posts: 10845
Joined: 29-10-2007
PCM$: 500.00
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Gentleman wrote:
I looked up his results from 2017 and it surprised me how he ended up on the podium in the Tour des Fjords in Norway. He finished podium, but also ended up 2nd in the Points ranking. Granted, he is part of the sprint train for Groenewegen, but still, the DB doesn't do him justice with a 64 for sprint and a 71 for flat, but I don't dare to recommend new values for that. For now, I'll stick to his COB and TT values. But if someone else can comment on his SP/FL, I would appreciate that.
Tour des Fjords was a hardman's race and he won a stage solo and a couple of intermediate sprint seconds which got them to that GC and points tally.
Not much sprint skill involved, it all was from small groups.
He does deserve good flat, hill and secondary stats for that race though, I agree on that.
Edited by cio93 on 26-06-2017 01:40
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