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Giro d'Italia 2017 - Week 2
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| alexkr00 |
Posted on 16-05-2017 08:33
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Kalach wrote:
I was just thinking about Nibali. He has 4 Grand Tour wins to his name. But it looked to me that he has always some kind of avoided the best GC threat in his grand tour camapaign.
2013 Giro: Well there was old Cadel Evans and upcoming star Rigoberto Uran. But none of them could challenge Nibali either because of age (Cadel faded in GT from 2012) or not enough experience (Uran?).
2014 Tour: I think everybody knows that if Froome and Contador had not crashed Nibali would have been only 3rd.
2016 Giro: Again, no Froome, Quintana or Contador. Well there was Chavez and Kruiswijk but.....
And then 2010 vuelta: Okey there were Frank Schleck, Rodriguez and Sastre.
I do not want to discredit Nibali`s win I was just thinking about his Grand Tour wins.
Interesting points. Not to mention last year he only beat Kruijswijk only because of his crash. And Steven isn't exactly a World Class GC rider to begin with.
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 25-11-2024 02:43
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| Selwink |
Posted on 16-05-2017 08:45
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Kalach wrote:
2014 Tour: I think everybody knows that if Froome and Contador had not crashed Nibali would have been only 3rd.
Not too sure about that one. I remember someone saying that the 2014 Nibali values were around Froome's 2013 levels (or something like that), so he wouldn't have been worse than 2nd normally. I can't seem to find that post though 
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| Kalach |
Posted on 16-05-2017 08:52
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@alexkr00: Exactly what I was thinking.
@Selwink: Well okay I do not know about that. But I am just trying to point out that we have never seen a GC battle between Nibali and Contador or Nibali and Froome and only now in this Giro we can see Nibali vs Quintana. I remember that Oleg Tinkoff wanted to offer some money in order to force Nibali Contador Froome and Quintana to go against each other in GT.
I am also missing from Nibali that he is not consistent through the whole season (I think last time was in 2013). Looked at contador for instance he is in top 3 almost in all his races.
Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth.
_____________________________________________
PCM Velogames Championship - Top Results
* 1st Tour de Suisse ('23)
* 1st Tour de Romandie ('19, '18)
* 1st Tour de Pologne ('20, '19)
* 2nd Tour of California ('19)
* 2nd Tour de Suisse ('18)
* 3rd Tour de France ('23, '21)
* 3rd Giro d’Italia ('22)
* 3rd Vuelta Espana ('23)
* 3rd Autumn Classics ('19, '18)
* 9th Spring Classics ('18)
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| Riis123 |
Posted on 16-05-2017 10:52
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Nibali was an absolute monster and was 3 minutes ahead of Contador at that point.
I don't really know, it was without a doubt the best Contador we have seen since the suspension, but it would have been hella hard. I don't believe Froome would have challenged with the season he had had in 2014 (assuming he would have lost around 2 minutes on the cobbles which is likely).
So no, not everybody knows that would have happened. Nibali is was a very different rider in that summer of 2014 compared to what he is now. |
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| matt17br |
Posted on 16-05-2017 10:52
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Imo if there is a GT victory that Nibali would have still retained with a tougher field, then that's the 2014 Tour. He had about 3 minutes on Contador after the cobbled stage, and even if that year's Contador was the best since 2009, there is no way that with a Nibali in that form he would have got all that time back. He looked untouchable, but then again, that year's Tour field was pretty weak.
You could make a similar argument for Giro 2013 too, Nibali during those 2 years was unarguably top 3.
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| Ian Butler |
Posted on 16-05-2017 11:27
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matt17br wrote:
Imo if there is a GT victory that Nibali would have still retained with a tougher field, then that's the 2014 Tour. He had about 3 minutes on Contador after the cobbled stage, and even if that year's Contador was the best since 2009, there is no way that with a Nibali in that form he would have got all that time back. He looked untouchable, but then again, that year's Tour field was pretty weak.
You could make a similar argument for Giro 2013 too, Nibali during those 2 years was unarguably top 3.
I agree. Tour 2014 saw a very strong Nibali (or weaker opposition or both) but besides that, I've never been that impressed by Nibali. He strikes me as an unpredictable fellow who can be very strong on some days and quite weak on others. His 4 GT wins are no accident but he probably has had some luck, maybe a bit more than you normally need to win a GT. |
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| Kalach |
Posted on 16-05-2017 11:55
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Okey guys you are right with that Tour 2014 I forgot about that cobbles and take it into the account. Maybe that time which he gained would be really sufficient.
But I agree with @Ian Butler I have also never been so impressed by Nibali. I am missing that consistency from him considering he is one of the top GT riders at the moment. On the other hand his descending skills are amazing ;-)
@matt17br: yeah Giro 2013 he was good no doubt about that but there was also missing some of the best  In 2013 I think he was also a more consistent and also won some other stage races (Tirreno) where he won againt froome and contador
Everybody has a plan until they get punched in the mouth.
_____________________________________________
PCM Velogames Championship - Top Results
* 1st Tour de Suisse ('23)
* 1st Tour de Romandie ('19, '18)
* 1st Tour de Pologne ('20, '19)
* 2nd Tour of California ('19)
* 2nd Tour de Suisse ('18)
* 3rd Tour de France ('23, '21)
* 3rd Giro d’Italia ('22)
* 3rd Vuelta Espana ('23)
* 3rd Autumn Classics ('19, '18)
* 9th Spring Classics ('18)
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 16-05-2017 13:01
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Interview with Campenaerts: He's not allowed to ride a good time trial, but has team orders to spare himself for supporting Kruijswijk later on.
Hasn't this thing gone a bit too far? Obviously he's not going to win it, but he could get a top 5 result. It's not even for a race favourite either, Kruijswijk is not the best time trialer and his climbing looks less good then last year as well. I'm going to keep an eye on Kyrienka and Amador if other teams do this as well. I really don't like this.
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| Selwink |
Posted on 16-05-2017 13:07
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Ollfardh wrote:
Interview with Campenaerts: He's not allowed to ride a good time trial, but has team orders to spare himself for supporting Kruijswijk later on.
Hasn't this thing gone a bit too far? Obviously he's not going to win it, but he could get a top 5 result. It's not even for a race favourite either, Kruijswijk is not the best time trialer and his climbing looks less good then last year as well. I'm going to keep an eye on Kyrienka and Amador if other teams do this as well. I really don't like this.
The decision stems from the fact that tomorrow's a mountain stage. I don't even think Campenaerts could contribute that much anyway. Real sad and in my opinion exaggerated decision. With Van Emden the same seems to happen to another outsider in LottoNL for today.
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| Paul23 |
Posted on 16-05-2017 13:14
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I don't really think that Van Emden is taking is easy today.
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 16-05-2017 13:26
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I don't think saying something like that would work well on Van Emden
Campenaerts is young and new to the team, different story. And I also think Campenaerts can climb slightly better, but he'll be dropped fast anyway tomorrow.
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| Paul23 |
Posted on 16-05-2017 13:28
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The polish Michael Hepburn did a nice time as well.
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| Paul23 |
Posted on 16-05-2017 13:37
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Dumoulin about to take the stage. Kiriyenka fucked up.
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| Riis123 |
Posted on 16-05-2017 13:39
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Ian Butler wrote:
matt17br wrote:
Imo if there is a GT victory that Nibali would have still retained with a tougher field, then that's the 2014 Tour. He had about 3 minutes on Contador after the cobbled stage, and even if that year's Contador was the best since 2009, there is no way that with a Nibali in that form he would have got all that time back. He looked untouchable, but then again, that year's Tour field was pretty weak.
You could make a similar argument for Giro 2013 too, Nibali during those 2 years was unarguably top 3.
I agree. Tour 2014 saw a very strong Nibali (or weaker opposition or both) but besides that, I've never been that impressed by Nibali. He strikes me as an unpredictable fellow who can be very strong on some days and quite weak on others. His 4 GT wins are no accident but he probably has had some luck, maybe a bit more than you normally need to win a GT.
It was an very strong Nibali, won the hilly stage and his cobbled performance speaks for itself, Contador was still in the race at that point. Then he went on to win 3 MTFs. Sure, the competition was weak, but he won with 8 minutes if I remember correctly. |
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| Nin1388 |
Posted on 16-05-2017 13:43
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Poor Kirienka |
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 16-05-2017 13:46
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What's Kirienka done?
That's Thomas, Yates and Kirienka all destroying my velogames team in the space of 2 days 
"Ringo is exactly right", Shonak - 8 September 2016
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| Paul23 |
Posted on 16-05-2017 13:47
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ringo182 wrote:
What's Kirienka done?
That's Thomas, Yates and Kirienka all destroying my velogames team in the space of 2 days
He just crashed just before the finishing line and will not win the TT probably.
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| Paul23 |
Posted on 16-05-2017 15:03
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HERE WE GOOOOOO
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| Kirchen_75 |
Posted on 16-05-2017 15:26
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Bob is doing great but theres no doubt in my mind that Tommy D will own everyones soul |
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| Paul23 |
Posted on 16-05-2017 15:31
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Thomas with a nice ride.
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