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PCM.daily Projects WT Stat Discussion
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| Redsskull |
Posted on 06-08-2016 20:26
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Amateur
Posts: 14
Joined: 01-04-2015
PCM$: 200.00
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I don't understand why the consensus is that Quinitana is as good as Froome in the mountains . he was distanced many times during this tour while climbing, and couldn't distance Froome. if you go by last years tour and say "he put a minute and a half into Froome" you're giving weight to one day that he was better Vs. all the days he was beaten. if anyojne proved this tour he could keep up with Froome in the mountains, it's Porte(who also distanced Quintana). |
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| Arberg27 |
Posted on 06-08-2016 20:26
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1070
Joined: 21-10-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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He attacked and was in many outbreaks in tour.
Missing a point in PCM, where you can choose one-day races or stage races. For example Froome is a monster that does not have lactic acids in the body in stage races and a man of meat and blood in one-day races. So he should have check marks in stage races, so he in one-day races have worse stats than he normally has. Froome, Porte, Quintana etc stage races. Cancellara, Vanmarcke etc one-day races, Valverde, Nibali etc both. |
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| jandal7 |
Posted on 06-08-2016 20:29
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World Champion
Posts: 11392
Joined: 17-12-2014
PCM$: 1020.00
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Redsskull wrote:
I don't understand why the consensus is that Quinitana is as good as Froome in the mountains . he was distanced many times during this tour while climbing, and couldn't distance Froome. if you go by last years tour and say "he put a minute and a half into Froome" you're giving weight to one day that he was better Vs. all the days he was beaten. if anyojne proved this tour he could keep up with Froome in the mountains, it's Porte(who also distanced Quintana).
I know it was over a year ago but if you said Froome should be above Quintana after that Tour you're giving weight to one day that Froome was better vs. all the days he was beaten really 
24/02/21 - kandesbunzler said “I don't drink famous people."
15/08/22 - SotD said "Your [jandal's] humour is overrated"
11/06/24 - knockout said "Winning is fine I guess. Truth be told this felt completely unimportant."
[ICL] Santos-Euskadi | [PT]  Xero Racing
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| Arberg27 |
Posted on 06-08-2016 20:45
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1070
Joined: 21-10-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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Redsskull wrote:
I don't understand why the consensus is that Quinitana is as good as Froome in the mountains . he was distanced many times during this tour while climbing, and couldn't distance Froome. if you go by last years tour and say "he put a minute and a half into Froome" you're giving weight to one day that he was better Vs. all the days he was beaten. if anyojne proved this tour he could keep up with Froome in the mountains, it's Porte(who also distanced Quintana).
Agree! What has Quintana won? Was Froome with?
Froome won the tour three times easy. (Could have been 4, if he had been allowed in 2012)
Last year Quinitana was equally good in the mountains, because Froome was sick the last day. But otherwise, Froome always beaten Quinitana in mountains, as example 1 minute this year and 2 minutes in 2013.
Edited by Arberg27 on 06-08-2016 21:00
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| asoutar |
Posted on 10-08-2016 17:40
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Junior Rider
Posts: 40
Joined: 23-08-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Arberg27 wrote:
Redsskull wrote:
I don't understand why the consensus is that Quinitana is as good as Froome in the mountains . he was distanced many times during this tour while climbing, and couldn't distance Froome. if you go by last years tour and say "he put a minute and a half into Froome" you're giving weight to one day that he was better Vs. all the days he was beaten. if anyojne proved this tour he could keep up with Froome in the mountains, it's Porte(who also distanced Quintana).
Agree! What has Quintana won? Was Froome with?
Froome won the tour three times easy. (Could have been 4, if he had been allowed in 2012)
Last year Quinitana was equally good in the mountains, because Froome was sick the last day. But otherwise, Froome always beaten Quinitana in mountains, as example 1 minute this year and 2 minutes in 2013.
Froome is better than Quintana in the mountains and should have better mountain stat. Add to that the fact that Quintana has better recovery. The gap between their TTing ability should be greater. Quintana can compete in TTs which are either hilly/mountainous or 3rd week of GT where his recovery comes in. Froome gets top 3s and wins in flat TTs in weeklong stage races. |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 10-08-2016 21:56
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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I still can't believe you guys are still going on about Froome v Quintana, Quintana will stay as he is in the stats at least until his next big test and even like so in the stats, he will be very hard pressed to beat Froome in a GT because of Froome's overall high stats, which may even get higher after his TT today where a tired Froome was still able to finish third over a hard TT course.
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 22-11-2024 18:11
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Bot Agent
Posts: Countless
Joined: 23.11.09
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| Arberg27 |
Posted on 11-08-2016 19:53
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1070
Joined: 21-10-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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TT
81: Dumoulin
80: Cancellara, Dennis
79: Froome, Martin
78: Kiryienka, Malori |
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| gontzal29 |
Posted on 11-08-2016 20:49
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Amateur
Posts: 4
Joined: 30-06-2015
PCM$: 200.00
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what about castroviejo?? 4TH place in Richmond and in Rio, i think he deserves a 78 in TT |
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| Arberg27 |
Posted on 11-08-2016 21:10
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1070
Joined: 21-10-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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gontzal29 wrote:
what about castroviejo?? 4TH place in Richmond and in Rio, i think he deserves a 78 in TT 77/78 |
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| camouflage |
Posted on 12-08-2016 16:42
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Amateur
Posts: 10
Joined: 08-07-2016
PCM$: 200.00
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Just a suggestion (because this game is mostly a management game, not a simulation). rider stats would be adjusted to the season start, as the game starts at 2016.01.01 and potentials should control their stat increase or decrease after that. Currently the rider's stats mostly built on some real life results, ignored their real life fitness, tiredness, form, etc, what is unknown for us ofc, but can be roughly figured about rider's team, division, nationality, ranking, etc. For example, Kruijswijk got some nice results on 2016 giro, but that doesnt means, he is really 80 MON, especially seeing his other results. But sadly its true for whole database 
1-2 differencies between stats is nothing, in good form a 75 climber can beat the beasts, or a 74-75 sprinter can win against kittel, sagan and others, so i guess the stats should move around in 75-81 range for the bests, instead of 80-82, above average riders between 70-74, average somewhere 62-69, and worst between 50-60.
Edited by camouflage on 12-08-2016 16:53
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| camouflage |
Posted on 12-08-2016 17:01
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Amateur
Posts: 10
Joined: 08-07-2016
PCM$: 200.00
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or maybe 74 with +4 RDC |
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| matt17br |
Posted on 12-08-2016 17:11
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Directeur Sportif
Posts: 10525
Joined: 28-09-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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You're right, but it would be stupid to do so if we want to constantly have updated stats and 99% of the players do the same.
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| camouflage |
Posted on 12-08-2016 17:46
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Amateur
Posts: 10
Joined: 08-07-2016
PCM$: 200.00
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matt17br wrote:
You're right, but it would be stupid to do so if we want to constantly have updated stats and 99% of the players do the same.
I understand that, problem is, they mostly updated based on latest results, but thats not necessarily reflects their stats. For example, Froome is not the best climber, moreover, he is not a climber, his real strength in his endurance. he can keep up with others, because of he gots the best STA/RES in the world. I guess 78MON 82STA 84RES would be more realistic, and he could still win the Tour (if the AI won't do any stupid, like usually does by train him as baroedour or stands "tour of his neighbour" as goals  ) but in my opinion, the solution is not raising riders stats to sky high.
Edited by camouflage on 12-08-2016 17:57
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| matt17br |
Posted on 12-08-2016 18:25
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Directeur Sportif
Posts: 10525
Joined: 28-09-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Clearly you don't know how pcm works. 78 mo can win the tour? It's hard to reply to that with a serious argument even though I know you're serious.
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| camouflage |
Posted on 12-08-2016 19:02
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Amateur
Posts: 10
Joined: 08-07-2016
PCM$: 200.00
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Not impossible with well balanced stats, where climbers has fairly high res, stage racers (where are theye gone btw?) has higher rec and more sta. Mon, fla, hil, ttr gives nothing else, but speed for the riders. Means with lower terrain skill needs higher effort to keep up, so needs more endurance. But if everyone is 80+ allrounders, i dont think that is more realistic. |
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| Arberg27 |
Posted on 12-08-2016 19:16
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1070
Joined: 21-10-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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I'm not sure if he is stupid or troll, maybe both? |
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| Paul23 |
Posted on 12-08-2016 19:29
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4411
Joined: 10-08-2011
PCM$: 400.00
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Funny of all people, that you mention this. 
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| camouflage |
Posted on 12-08-2016 19:37
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Amateur
Posts: 10
Joined: 08-07-2016
PCM$: 200.00
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haasje33 wrote:
1. If you comment on someone's post, comment on the contents of the post, not on the person!
So why dont you say something constructive, istead of insult me.
I just mean, not everything is depends on the main stats, like mon, spr, ttr. There are other important stats too and theres is RDC too, which, i think is a bit overpowered in 2016. for expample in my career, Math Frank was 2nd on 2016 Vuelta, moved IAM up to 15th place from the last, and keep his team in WT. BTW AI team.
Edited by camouflage on 12-08-2016 19:46
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| asoutar |
Posted on 12-08-2016 19:50
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Junior Rider
Posts: 40
Joined: 23-08-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Stamina doesn't work like that on pcm mate. It will have a miniscule effect of your tour winning chances because most mountain stages are under 200km. This is a fault of the game but I don't really understand you point anyway. |
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| camouflage |
Posted on 12-08-2016 20:51
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Amateur
Posts: 10
Joined: 08-07-2016
PCM$: 200.00
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I've tested it. I know that, as cyanide says, stamina only has effect over 200km, but thats not true. Tested on TDF, with 9 guys, 3 of 'em got 85MON 75STA 75RES 75REC other 3 75MON 85STA 75RES 75REC, and the last 3 guy got 75MON 75STA 85RES 75REC, every other stats on 50. Guys with 85 mon was faster on climbs, but 85STA guys was able to keep up on a bit higher effort (+6-8) without loosing more yellow, red, or even green bar, while guys with 85 res died soon, and fallen back. I've also read somewhere, res doesnt works in 2016. Considering the aboves, looks to me, cyanide mixed up sta and res somehow. OFC it needs more testing, for example 200+K stages, with 85 res to be sure its true. Its just my theory, im not absolutely sure im right, but everyone knows cyanide and their bugs, so... |
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