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PCMdaily DB Stat Discussion - PCM15
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| Naxela |
Posted on 10-02-2016 22:54
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Stagiare
Posts: 169
Joined: 25-02-2015
PCM$: 200.00
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Croatia14 wrote:
Anderis wrote:
I think Sagan is overrated with his MO. In most of my careers, he turns out to be a rider who finishes GTs in top10 overall on a regular basis. Maybe you should also consider setting an MO limit for him at his current level.
I´m not a fan of setting limits, I even would appreciate that this can happen. F.e. we will see a massive cobbles upgrade for Tony Martin over the next years (similar to Nibalis when he did well in that Tour stage), just becauses he changes his focus partly to cobbled classics and I am pretty sure he will do well.
So I would even love if it´s possible that riders on later ages suddenly get a massive boost in some stats (and lose something in other stats) due to focus changes...we see late starting riders kind of often (especially when they go from Cyclocross to Road Racing, thinking of Stybar, Peraud,...), and these options are not able in the current system
though I don´t think it´s possible to change something in that direction and don´t know if that would be appreciated by a lot of people, I would love to hear a feedback about that...
sorry for being a little off-topic...
Even though i would like a feature like that because of the realism in it i doubt it can be done. The engine would have too be allot more intelligent to pick the riders that can possibly take the step from a climber to a cobble specialist for example, it would only be limited to sprinters i would assume with already a decent cobble stat. it would just make the game unstable in the long run where climbers with already low cobble stat (low 60's) won't get their stats above 70 and ruin their mountain stats at the same time, making them worthless. I just do not think a Contador type of rider that turn into a cobble specialist is a good idea, it would make it go away from reality and more into fantasy based game.
While speaking of Sagan i definitely agree on his mountain downgrade, even if he can back up his stats he would have too be downgraded to keep his real life objectives (which is classics and sprints). I think he finished the TDF sixth or something on the last career i took.
New York Knicks - Bardiani CFS - AG2R - Millwall FC - Le Havre AC
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| irdalopez |
Posted on 11-02-2016 09:16
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Under 23
Posts: 75
Joined: 06-04-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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Hello!
Stats Palini?? Sp ACC Hil? |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 11-02-2016 10:37
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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He's 74 sprint 75Acc and 70 Hill. he can't really be any higher than this because he races at continental level and higher than this would have him winning nearly every sprint he contests.
If he raced at PT level then he'd probably deserve a higher sprint but it's worth bearing in mind that he is in peak condition for the middle east races as well so his results are going to be good.
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 23-11-2024 17:09
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Bot Agent
Posts: Countless
Joined: 23.11.09
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| AiZaK |
Posted on 13-02-2016 17:16
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1190
Joined: 13-04-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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Hi Tafiolmo, I think Fabio Felline 74 in mountain its too. Because in career mode in 4 or 5 months he will be 75.
He did a good Giro de Italia, but I think that with 73 would be fine. If you give Nerz 74, Giampaolo Caruso 74, Felline is worse climber than them.
I think that Felline with his high hill it's ok.
The last suggestions, Visconti and Luis Leon Sanchez 77 on hills!
Visconti is better than Izagirre in hills, Izagirre 1 point less in hills (76)
Byeee |
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| sgdanny |
Posted on 13-02-2016 18:22
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3591
Joined: 18-03-2014
PCM$: 200.00
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AiZaK wrote:
Hi Tafiolmo, I think Fabio Felline 74 in mountain its too. Because in career mode in 4 or 5 months he will be 75.
Not a factor we always include when making stats, or at least in such a case 
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 13-02-2016 23:20
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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AiZaK wrote:
Hi Tafiolmo, I think Fabio Felline 74 in mountain its too. Because in career mode in 4 or 5 months he will be 75.
He did a good Giro de Italia, but I think that with 73 would be fine. If you give Nerz 74, Giampaolo Caruso 74, Felline is worse climber than them.
I think that Felline with his high hill it's ok.
The last suggestions, Visconti and Luis Leon Sanchez 77 on hills!
Visconti is better than Izagirre in hills, Izagirre 1 point less in hills (76)
Byeee
Some very good mentions here especially with Felline who will be downgraded to 73, for the simple reason his overall stats are very high and we don't want to turn him into a new Sagan. He was also a rider that I had a question mark against anyway for his high overall stats to be checked at the end.
Visconti is also worth going to 77 and because his sta is not great, that will make him very effective over races of less than 200km, also his high FS helps here too and he did well towards the end of 2015.
Sanchez though will be left at 76 hill, for the simple reason he's more of a roleur these days and I already upgraded him quite a bit in mtn stat, to turn him into a stronger climnbing domestique for Aru or Nibali.
Izgirre good call at 76 and because he has high TT skills that will help him lot in some week long races.
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| Croatia14 |
Posted on 14-02-2016 01:21
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Directeur Sportif
Posts: 9099
Joined: 13-03-2013
PCM$: 2100.00
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AiZaK wrote:
He did a good Giro de Italia, but I think that with 73 would be fine. If you give Nerz 74, Giampaolo Caruso 74, Felline is worse climber than them.
I think that Felline with his high hill it's ok.
To be honest Nerz and Caruso are pretty bad comparisons. Dom suffered due to many injuries last season and should in my opinion be a little higher than 74 there...
With Caruso, we can´t be sure of what he´s capable of at the moment...in my opinion he hardly deserves his climbing stats, though he can still be a great puncheur...
To the Palini disussion: we shoudn´t break out of the CT borders we have...is he better than Kump last year outside his teams' home race? or as the yearly Daniel Diaz? as the Americans peaking in their home race? I doubt it... So I would keep him in the 73 borders until he shows off consistently on a higher level with SkyDive (they should apply for PCT next year...)
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 14-02-2016 10:34
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Croatia14 wrote:
AiZaK wrote:
He did a good Giro de Italia, but I think that with 73 would be fine. If you give Nerz 74, Giampaolo Caruso 74, Felline is worse climber than them.
I think that Felline with his high hill it's ok.
To be honest Nerz and Caruso are pretty bad comparisons. Dom suffered due to many injuries last season and should in my opinion be a little higher than 74 there...
With Caruso, we can´t be sure of what he´s capable of at the moment...in my opinion he hardly deserves his climbing stats, though he can still be a great puncheur...
To the Palini disussion: we shoudn´t break out of the CT borders we have...is he better than Kump last year outside his teams' home race? or as the yearly Daniel Diaz? as the Americans peaking in their home race? I doubt it... So I would keep him in the 73 borders until he shows off consistently on a higher level with SkyDive (they should apply for PCT next year...)
Both Nerz and Caruso had good 2014's in terms of their mtn stats, so their 74/75 stats are from that. Both were weaker in 2015 and when its through injury or crashes it's always debatable whether a rider should be lowered or not. For example Gerrans had 2015 ruined by lot of crashes, but kept his high stats as I feel he's still at the height of his powers. Nerz I'll keep an eye on and see how he performs this year. Caruso is more difficult as he's old and doesn't have a team, so a decrease for him is more logical.
73 max stat is just a guideline for CT level and normally is applied to mtn stat. With flat and sprint you can go to 74 as in the case of Palini and some 74's are ok as well. If you have too high stats for a rider at CT level he'll just dominate too much. For example Wiggins was a major problem as even with heavy decreases, you still can't downgrade his TT skills too mch.
Edited by Tafiolmo on 14-02-2016 13:25
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| miguejack |
Posted on 14-02-2016 18:58
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 321
Joined: 02-08-2014
PCM$: 200.00
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What about Rinaldo Nocentini? 76 or 77 for his hill?
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Edited by Tafiolmo on 14-02-2016 19:05
Costa ~ Machado ~ Quintana ~ Gallopin
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 14-02-2016 19:05
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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The problem is he's gone down two divisions, based on 2015 he was easily worth 77 hill, but the most we can give him now is 74 hill and even then that's the highest hill stat for any rider at CT level
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| miguejack |
Posted on 14-02-2016 19:09
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 321
Joined: 02-08-2014
PCM$: 200.00
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Tafiolmo wrote:
The problem is he's gone down two divisions, based on 2015 he was easily worth 77 hill, but the most we can give him now is 74 hill and even then that's the highest hill stat for any rider at CT level
Agree. But less than 74 is not okay. 74 fits perfectly!
Costa ~ Machado ~ Quintana ~ Gallopin
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| AiZaK |
Posted on 16-02-2016 16:18
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1190
Joined: 13-04-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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2 suggestions Tafiolmo:
Diego Rosa currently in the Beta is Mountain 76 and Hill 78, I think is better for him 77 in hills.
And Gallopin is 77/77 I think he is better 78 in hills. Its true that in Lombardia Diego Rosa was better than Gallopin, but only in 1 race. I think Gallopin showed many times that he is very good rider in hills. 78 for him is perfect |
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| matt17br |
Posted on 16-02-2016 16:26
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Directeur Sportif
Posts: 10525
Joined: 28-09-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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About Rosa, I think what he's done in the later races of the season justify fully that 78. His domestique work at Lombardia was outstanding making him seem much stronger than his captain Nibali - who then won it - and his performance up Superga at Milano-Torino was inhuman too. 78 may seem high at first glance, but his backup stats are lower than basically all of the other riders on 78 HI.
I tend to agree about Gallopin but even in this case you'd have to look carefully at the rest of his stats not to make him too OP, as he's an allround beast.
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| AiZaK |
Posted on 16-02-2016 16:32
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1190
Joined: 13-04-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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Another one:
Dani Navarro, in the Beta is 75 in Mountain, I think he deserves 76. He always does very good Tour de France and Vueltas a España.
You must remember that he went to the Tour very ill, later he improves a little for the Vuelta but he wasn't 100%. |
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| AiZaK |
Posted on 16-02-2016 16:39
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1190
Joined: 13-04-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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Matt17br he was fantastic but in my opinion he doesn't deserves 78. I think with 77 its perfect for him. |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 16-02-2016 20:58
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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AiZaK wrote:
Matt17br he was fantastic but in my opinion he doesn't deserves 78. I think with 77 its perfect for him.
Dani Navarro had a great 2014 but not so good in 2015 and is only worth 75, I upped his FS a point to 76 and has started 2016 quite well, so will watch how he goes in the mtns but for now he's worth no more than 75 mtn.
You really can't put Gallopin higher than 77 hill at the moment, because his backup and all round stats make him more powerful than a 77 hill man and we don't want another Thomas MK.11, we had enough problems with him in testing.
For Rosa to ride how he rides in real life, you would actually need to put him to 79, because even with 78 it doesn't do him justice and he just rides like a normal domestique in the testing I've done, but for now he'll stay at 78 hill.
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| AiZaK |
Posted on 17-02-2016 16:32
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1190
Joined: 13-04-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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Hi again!
Matteo Rabottino his secundary stats are too high! |
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| AiZaK |
Posted on 18-02-2016 17:08
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1190
Joined: 13-04-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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Geraint Thomas in the Beta is 79 in Climbs, I would give 1 less, 78 |
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| Naxela |
Posted on 18-02-2016 20:29
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Stagiare
Posts: 169
Joined: 25-02-2015
PCM$: 200.00
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I don't agree with downgrading Thomas. What he did in the Tour last year would definitely give him the podium in the Vuelta or the Giro. Probably the third best climber in the tour besides the two last mountain stages where he collapsed. Most people said Landa should be given 80 after his effort in the Giro last year, he got it if i remember correctly. IMO Thomas season was far more impressive but 79 is fine.
Where do everyone find the beta stats? Is it out anywhere or is it the beta testers who keeps debating?
New York Knicks - Bardiani CFS - AG2R - Millwall FC - Le Havre AC
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| matt17br |
Posted on 18-02-2016 21:21
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Directeur Sportif
Posts: 10525
Joined: 28-09-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Where do everyone find the beta stats? Is it out anywhere or is it the beta testers who keeps debating?
Well we have announced that a beta testing phase of the 2016 DB would take place a couple of weeks ago, Aizak is one of the beta testers so he's got access to the most up to date stats.
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