|
The most gifted cyclist?
|
| hanspetter61 |
Posted on 28-07-2015 22:19
|
Protected Rider
Posts: 1037
Joined: 30-01-2014
PCM$: 200.00
|
If we think off Pele; Maradona in cycling. Riders that was something spesial, not only sprint or Climb but can do several Things for the last 10-15 years. I think of Three riders in spesial.
Valverde: He can sprint, he is a puncher and a climber. He win races all year. Not just in Three weeks.
Sagan: He is just amasing in nearly everything. He can also Climb if he have to. But not the longest one. A talent far beyone maybe everybody.
Boonen: Amasing sprinter in many years, and exelent on cobble. He is not that bad in hills to.
HP
|
| |
|
|
| trekbmc |
Posted on 28-07-2015 22:20
|
Team Leader
Posts: 7366
Joined: 11-07-2014
PCM$: 700.00
|
Was more speaking in reply to Dicyc, but just meant that Armstrong wasn't a super talent. But looking at it now, sounds very much like Kwiatkowski now. Again Nibali and Wiggins were very good at young are but weren't as gifted as say Quintana who came second in the tour at a similar age.
"What done is, is one." - Benji Naesen
|
| |
|
|
| Omloop |
Posted on 28-07-2015 22:20
|
Domestique
Posts: 433
Joined: 08-01-2014
PCM$: 200.00
|
Gilbert, Freire, Cunego, EBH and for some reason I wanna include Rujano. |
| |
|
|
| valverde321 |
Posted on 28-07-2015 22:28
|
World Champion
Posts: 12986
Joined: 20-05-2009
PCM$: 530.00
|
hanspetter61 wrote:
If we think off Pele; Maradona in cycling. Riders that was something spesial, not only sprint or Climb but can do several Things for the last 10-15 years. I think of Three riders in spesial.
Valverde: He can sprint, he is a puncher and a climber. He win races all year. Not just in Three weeks.
Sagan: He is just amasing in nearly everything. He can also Climb if he have to. But not the longest one. A talent far beyone maybe everybody.
Boonen: Amasing sprinter in many years, and exelent on cobble. He is not that bad in hills to.
I do tend to agree with this mindset. That the rider should be great at many aspects as opposed to just being a brilliant pure climber or just a sprinter.
trekbmc wrote:
Was more speaking in reply to Dicyc, but just meant that Armstrong wasn't a super talent. But looking at it now, sounds very much like Kwiatkowski now. Again Nibali and Wiggins were very good at young are but weren't as gifted as say Quintana who came second in the tour at a similar age.
Okay, you sort of just made it sound like they were nothing special at all, by putting them in the same category as Froome, when in actuality they were pretty good talents, just maybe not super talents 
|
| |
|
|
| trekbmc |
Posted on 28-07-2015 22:34
|
Team Leader
Posts: 7366
Joined: 11-07-2014
PCM$: 700.00
|
valverde321 wrote:
trekbmc wrote:
Was more speaking in reply to Dicyc, but just meant that Armstrong wasn't a super talent. But looking at it now, sounds very much like Kwiatkowski now. Again Nibali and Wiggins were very good at young are but weren't as gifted as say Quintana who came second in the tour at a similar age.
Okay, you sort of just made it sound like they were nothing special at all, by putting them in the same category as Froome, when in actuality they were pretty good talents, just maybe not super talents
Yeah, tying to say it faster because I'm using a tablet, but it just caused confusion. 
Btw, as hanspetter said, what about Boonen?
"What done is, is one." - Benji Naesen
|
| |
|
|
| Ad Bot |
Posted on 28-11-2024 18:23
|
Bot Agent
Posts: Countless
Joined: 23.11.09
|
|
| IP: None |
|
|
| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 29-07-2015 00:33
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15830
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Bettini definatly should be on this list..with Freire.
Ulle as nr1 fuck yeaah..this guy had so much talent to waste. Andy story also sad..sry to start , but part of he's downfall was also when doping hunters started to work better.
Cacellara.. also fuck yeaah. When Contador was on he's peak spartacus was most complete cyclist for me. People should notice that there is much more going on cycling world then TdF.
Ale Jet was stunning on he's peak.. I also would have added Cav, beside him. |
| |
|
|
| Bikex |
Posted on 29-07-2015 00:58
|
Team Leader
Posts: 7257
Joined: 25-08-2012
PCM$: 600.00
|
Maybe Erik Zabel? 6 times green in a row + 4 1/2 Milano - San Remo and many more wins. 
One of the best sprinters in the late 90's, early 00's plus a decent climber for a sprinter. |
| |
|
|
| MrUfo87 |
Posted on 29-07-2015 01:30
|
Classics Specialist
Posts: 2803
Joined: 06-01-2012
PCM$: 700.00
|
Haven't seen Kwiatkowski yet. Sep Vanmarcke, Alexander Kristoff and John Degenkolb as well.
I've once read a column about Lars Boom, and he's actually very talented but lazy as hell. He only performs when he has to, for example last year when he won a stage at the Tour because his contract ended at the end of that season. Could've won much more by now.
|
| |
|
|
| valverde321 |
Posted on 29-07-2015 01:42
|
World Champion
Posts: 12986
Joined: 20-05-2009
PCM$: 530.00
|
Bikex wrote:
Maybe Erik Zabel? 6 times green in a row + 4 1/2 Milano - San Remo and many more wins.
One of the best sprinters in the late 90's, early 00's plus a decent climber for a sprinter.
Didn't he win AGR? Thats pretty good for a "sprinter"
|
| |
|
|
| Malkael |
Posted on 29-07-2015 01:56
|
Sprinter
Posts: 1697
Joined: 02-08-2010
PCM$: 200.00
|
The 2000 Amstel Gold Race according to PCS, also finished in third place on Paris - Roubaix that same year.
|
| |
|
|
| mattie524 |
Posted on 29-07-2015 02:03
|
Domestique
Posts: 578
Joined: 15-07-2011
PCM$: 400.00
|
I think someone mentioned Cavendish but I'll say it again. I think he's the best pure sprinter we've seen. Although this is talent-wise/all round I do think he deserves to be at least anywhere from 5-10 on this list
Manager of Team Lamborghini - Monster |
| |
|
|
| hanspetter61 |
Posted on 29-07-2015 02:40
|
Protected Rider
Posts: 1037
Joined: 30-01-2014
PCM$: 200.00
|
Maybe some off you also use CQ ranking from time to time. For those who dont they have ranking from all races not just world tour. Give a good indiation off the best overall rider.
Valverde stats are amazing
2015 Esp Movistar Team PRT 1 2142 All Points (rank 1)
2014 Esp Movistar Team PRT 1 3152 All Points (rank 1)
2013 Esp Movistar Team PRT 4 2403 All Points ( rank 4)
2012 Esp Movistar Team PRT 4 2013 All Points (rank 4)
2010 Esp Caisse d'Epargne PRT - 0 All Points
2009 Esp Caisse d'Epargne PRT 1 2494 All Points (rank 1)
2008 Esp Caisse d'Epargne PRT 1 2662 All Points (rank 1)
2007 Esp Caisse d'Epargne PRT 3 1897 All Points (rank 3)
2006 Esp Caisse d'Epargne - Illes Balears PRT 2 2469 All Points (rank 2)
2005 Esp Illes Balears - Caisse d'Epargne PRT 14 1100 All Points (rank 14)
2004 Esp Comunidad Valenciana - Kelme TT2 4 1892 All Points (rank 2)
This is 11 years. Thats simply stunning!
https://www.cqrank...?riderid=5
HP
|
| |
|
|
| Riis123 |
Posted on 29-07-2015 04:17
|
Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 5075
Joined: 07-08-2008
PCM$: 200.00
|
hanspetter61 wrote:
Maybe some off you also use CQ ranking from time to time. For those who dont they have ranking from all races not just world tour. Give a good indiation off the best overall rider.
Valverde stats are amazing
2015 Esp Movistar Team PRT 1 2142 All Points (rank 1)
2014 Esp Movistar Team PRT 1 3152 All Points (rank 1)
2013 Esp Movistar Team PRT 4 2403 All Points ( rank 4)
2012 Esp Movistar Team PRT 4 2013 All Points (rank 4)
2010 Esp Caisse d'Epargne PRT - 0 All Points
2009 Esp Caisse d'Epargne PRT 1 2494 All Points (rank 1)
2008 Esp Caisse d'Epargne PRT 1 2662 All Points (rank 1)
2007 Esp Caisse d'Epargne PRT 3 1897 All Points (rank 3)
2006 Esp Caisse d'Epargne - Illes Balears PRT 2 2469 All Points (rank 2)
2005 Esp Illes Balears - Caisse d'Epargne PRT 14 1100 All Points (rank 14)
2004 Esp Comunidad Valenciana - Kelme TT2 4 1892 All Points (rank 2)
This is 11 years. Thats simply stunning!
https://www.cqrank...?riderid=5
Yup, I have lobbyed for Valverde for a good year now for being the best cyclist of this era. Unfortunately for me, most in here just laugh at me.  |
| |
|
|
| valverde321 |
Posted on 29-07-2015 06:12
|
World Champion
Posts: 12986
Joined: 20-05-2009
PCM$: 530.00
|
Riis123 wrote:
hanspetter61 wrote:
Maybe some off you also use CQ ranking from time to time. For those who dont they have ranking from all races not just world tour. Give a good indiation off the best overall rider.
Valverde stats are amazing
2015 Esp Movistar Team PRT 1 2142 All Points (rank 1)
2014 Esp Movistar Team PRT 1 3152 All Points (rank 1)
2013 Esp Movistar Team PRT 4 2403 All Points ( rank 4)
2012 Esp Movistar Team PRT 4 2013 All Points (rank 4)
2010 Esp Caisse d'Epargne PRT - 0 All Points
2009 Esp Caisse d'Epargne PRT 1 2494 All Points (rank 1)
2008 Esp Caisse d'Epargne PRT 1 2662 All Points (rank 1)
2007 Esp Caisse d'Epargne PRT 3 1897 All Points (rank 3)
2006 Esp Caisse d'Epargne - Illes Balears PRT 2 2469 All Points (rank 2)
2005 Esp Illes Balears - Caisse d'Epargne PRT 14 1100 All Points (rank 14)
2004 Esp Comunidad Valenciana - Kelme TT2 4 1892 All Points (rank 2)
This is 11 years. Thats simply stunning!
https://www.cqrank...?riderid=5
Yup, I have lobbyed for Valverde for a good year now for being the best cyclist of this era. Unfortunately for me, most in here just laugh at me.
He is overlooked because he has only won 1 Grand Tour I assume, but his results outside of grand tours are amazing and its hard to find a big name race he hasn't won. Riders go their entire careers chasing a classic, he seems to win 2 every year.
|
| |
|
|
| CountArach |
Posted on 29-07-2015 06:22
|
Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 8290
Joined: 14-07-2008
PCM$: 200.00
|
I am astonished that some people are saying EBH. He was always hailed as someone with potential and yet he never lived up to it. Is it perhaps then the case that he just simply didn't have the potential in the first place? Just like Sicard - spent his whole career on the verge of a breakthrough and then.... nothing.
Boonen and Cancellara are almost automatic inclusions for me. Certainly you could not possibly argue with what Cancellara has done in his career and in several disciplines.
|
| |
|
|
| Ton1Mart1n |
Posted on 29-07-2015 07:17
|
Domestique
Posts: 400
Joined: 14-06-2011
PCM$: 200.00
|
I think we miss one specific rider here, guys.
Joaquim "Purito" Rodriguez.
Palmarès:
2001
1st Escalada a Montjuïc
3rd Subida a Urkiola
2003
1st Stage 8 Vuelta a España
1st Stage 6 Paris–Nice
2004
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Setmana Catalana de Ciclisme
2005
1st Jersey red.svg Mountains classification Vuelta a España
1st Subida a Urkiola
2nd Overall Vuelta a Burgos
2nd Clásica de San Sebastián
2006
1st Stage 5 Paris–Nice
17th Overall Vuelta a Espana
2007
1st MaillotEspaña.PNG National Road Race Championships
1st Klasika Primavera
1st GP Villafranca de Ordizia
2008
1st Stage 3 Tirreno–Adriatico
6th Overall Vuelta a España
6th World Road Race Championships
8th Amstel Gold Race
8th La Flèche Wallonne
8th Liège–Bastogne–Liège
2009
1st Stage 4 Tirreno–Adriatico
1st Stage 2 Vuelta a Burgos
2nd Liège–Bastogne–Liège
3rd Bronze medal blank.svg World Road Race Championships
7th Overall Vuelta a España
17th Overall Giro d'Italia
2010
1st Overall UCI World Ranking
1st MaillotVolta.png Overall Volta a Catalunya
1st GP Miguel Indurain
1st Stage 5 Tour of the Basque Country
2nd La Flèche Wallonne
3rd Overall Vuelta a España
1st Stage 14
5th Clásica de San Sebastián
7th Overall Tour de France
1st Stage 12
2011
1st Jersey violet.svg Overall Vuelta a Burgos
1st Jersey green.svg Points classification
1st Stage 2
Vuelta a España
1st Stages 5 & 8
1st Stage 1 Tour of the Basque Country
2nd Amstel Gold Race
2nd La Flèche Wallonne
3rd Giro di Lombardia
4th Overall Giro d'Italia
5th Overall Critérium du Dauphiné
1st Stages 6 & 7
1st Jersey green.svg Points classification
1st Jersey polkadot.svg Mountains classification
9th GP Miguel Indurain
2012
1st Overall UCI World Tour
1st La Flèche Wallonne
1st Giro di Lombardia
2nd Overall Giro d'Italia
1st Jersey red.svg Points classification
1st Stages 10 & 17
2nd Overall Tour of the Basque Country
1st Stages 4 & 5
3rd Overall Vuelta a España
1st Stages 6, 12 & 14
6th Overall Tirreno–Adriatico
1st Stage 6
8th Clásica de San Sebastián
2013
1st Overall UCI World Tour
1st Giro di Lombardia
2nd Silver medal blank.svg World Road Race Championships
2nd Liège–Bastogne–Liège
2nd Overall Volta a Catalunya
3rd Overall Tour de France
4th Overall Vuelta a España
1st Stage 19
4th Overall Tour of Oman
1st Stage 4
5th Overall Tirreno–Adriatico
1st Stage 5
6th La Flèche Wallonne
2014
1st MaillotVolta.png Overall Volta a Catalunya
1st Stage 3
3rd Clásica de San Sebastián
4th Overall Tour of Oman
4th Overall Vuelta a España
5th Milano-Torino
8th Giro di Lombardia
Tour de France
Held Jersey polkadot.svg after Stages 10–12, 14–15
2015
1st Jersey yellow.svg Overall Tour of the Basque Country
1st Jersey white.svg Points classification
1st Stages 3 & 4
3rd Liège–Bastogne–Liège
4th La Flèche Wallonne
8th Overall Critérium du Dauphiné
Tour de France
1st Stages 3 & 12
Held Jersey polkadot.svg after Stages 3–5, 18
“When it’s hurting you, that’s when you can make a difference”
|
| |
|
|
| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 29-07-2015 07:43
|
World Champion
Posts: 14236
Joined: 20-06-2011
PCM$: 300.00
|
valverde321 wrote:
Riis123 wrote:
Wiggins also. But how much of that transition is due to the presumed unlevelled playing ground in 2012 (and to some extent, I guess also now)? Its all assumptions. But either way, extremely talented, yes. Schleck was just in another league, wouldnt dump him a spot.
True, Schleck and Contador together were in another league. I was more going off results. Conta always seemed to have Schleck in his back pocket, for his only goal of every season after 2009.
And yeah, first to go off the list would be Petacchi.
Mayo is a good suggestion as well.
Why put Petacchi out and getting Cavendish in? Petacchi is twice a sprinting talent, he also does not need to be placed perfectly into last 100ms,like Cavendish, who would do like tenth of his success without perfect teammates. while that list is full of guys who can dominate all by themselves...
Freire is one of them.
No Vino or Ricco please, those are cheaters more then anything else.
Nice list Riijs123, i agree with majority of it.
Regarding Sagan, dont forget that he is a Junior MTB world champion and came 2nd at CX world championships juniors same year. That shows how much of a talent he is, i think he maybe deserves spot nr.1 with the raw talent and power. Imagine him with racing mind of Bettini.
Just looked at resume of Sagans palmares:25years old
67 wins
54 2nd places
25 3rd places.
Edited by Avin Wargunnson on 29-07-2015 07:49
|
| |
|
|
| trekbmc |
Posted on 29-07-2015 08:13
|
Team Leader
Posts: 7366
Joined: 11-07-2014
PCM$: 700.00
|
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
Just looked at resume of Sagans palmares:25years old
67 wins
54 2nd places
25 3rd places.
What's amazing about it is that he has more wins than second places!? 
"What done is, is one." - Benji Naesen
|
| |
|
|
| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 29-07-2015 08:19
|
World Champion
Posts: 14236
Joined: 20-06-2011
PCM$: 300.00
|
trekbmc wrote:
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
Just looked at resume of Sagans palmares:25years old
67 wins
54 2nd places
25 3rd places.
What's amazing about it is that he has more wins than second places!?
Majority of second places is from 2014 and 2015. Before that he had like three wins on every second place.
|
| |
|
|
| trekbmc |
Posted on 29-07-2015 08:26
|
Team Leader
Posts: 7366
Joined: 11-07-2014
PCM$: 700.00
|
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
trekbmc wrote:
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
Just looked at resume of Sagans palmares:25years old
67 wins
54 2nd places
25 3rd places.
What's amazing about it is that he has more wins than second places!?
Majority of second places is from 2014 and 2015. Before that he had like three wins on every second place.
I know, just couldn't resist saying it. I guess that was before he was marked so heavily.
"What done is, is one." - Benji Naesen
|
| |
|
