|
Dekker leaves Rabobank
|
| stuartmcstuart |
Posted on 29-07-2008 16:51
|
Sprinter
Posts: 1682
Joined: 02-08-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
CrueTrue wrote:
CSC would be the wrong team to go to then 
Certainly would. If he has any ambition at all, he'll go to a smaller team like Garmin or FDJ where he can be the sole leader. Then again, maybe a CSC paycheck would put those ambitions on hold... |
| |
|
|
| issoisso |
Posted on 29-07-2008 17:17
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
stuartmcstuart wrote:
Ruben wrote:
CrueTrue wrote:
Wait? Is he still leaving Rabobank? They will speak with eachother next week. But from what I've heard, Dekker doesn't want to stay, and Rabobank is in a desperate struggle with themselves, they pictured Dekker as the new icon for the next ten years. But, they noticed Dekker doesn't actually like doing everything they tell him to, he likes to go his own way.
I hope he leaves. He deserves to be a team leader now, hes had too many seasons at Rabo being a domestique come the big tours.
I could not possibly disagree more. Being a team leader this young is the surest way to get a young talent to stop progressing and never fulfill his potential, as history shows us time and time and time and time and time and time again.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
|
| |
|
|
| brun sweater |
Posted on 29-07-2008 17:23
|
Neo-Pro
Posts: 273
Joined: 29-11-2006
PCM$: 200.00
|
I coldn't agree more 
Dekker, even though very talented, still have a lot to learn. CSC would be an excellent choice.
Anyways, with Dekkers TT abilities, he'll be leader in many races, no matter what team he ends up in. |
| |
|
|
| stuartmcstuart |
Posted on 29-07-2008 17:25
|
Sprinter
Posts: 1682
Joined: 02-08-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
issoisso wrote:
stuartmcstuart wrote:
Ruben wrote:
CrueTrue wrote:
Wait? Is he still leaving Rabobank? They will speak with eachother next week. But from what I've heard, Dekker doesn't want to stay, and Rabobank is in a desperate struggle with themselves, they pictured Dekker as the new icon for the next ten years. But, they noticed Dekker doesn't actually like doing everything they tell him to, he likes to go his own way.
I hope he leaves. He deserves to be a team leader now, hes had too many seasons at Rabo being a domestique come the big tours.
I could not possibly disagree more. Being a team leader this young is the surest way to get a young talent to stop progressing and never fulfill his potential, as history shows us time and time and time and time and time and time again.
Agreed.
However Dekker will be 24 this September and I really don't consider him a young rider any more - he's ridden a lot in the last few years. |
| |
|
|
| Ad Bot |
Posted on 21-09-2024 20:37
|
Bot Agent
Posts: Countless
Joined: 23.11.09
|
|
| IP: None |
|
|
| issoisso |
Posted on 29-07-2008 17:28
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
stuartmcstuart wrote:
issoisso wrote:
stuartmcstuart wrote:
Ruben wrote:
CrueTrue wrote:
Wait? Is he still leaving Rabobank? They will speak with eachother next week. But from what I've heard, Dekker doesn't want to stay, and Rabobank is in a desperate struggle with themselves, they pictured Dekker as the new icon for the next ten years. But, they noticed Dekker doesn't actually like doing everything they tell him to, he likes to go his own way.
I hope he leaves. He deserves to be a team leader now, hes had too many seasons at Rabo being a domestique come the big tours.
I could not possibly disagree more. Being a team leader this young is the surest way to get a young talent to stop progressing and never fulfill his potential, as history shows us time and time and time and time and time and time again.
Agreed.
However Dekker will be 24 this September and I really don't consider him a young rider any more - he's ridden a lot in the last few years.
he's done 1 tour and 1 giro. that's very very little in the way of 3 week races. he needs at the very least 2 more years backing someone else up.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
|
| |
|
|
| stuartmcstuart |
Posted on 29-07-2008 17:34
|
Sprinter
Posts: 1682
Joined: 02-08-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Thats still one more GT than Alberto Contador when he won the Tour last year I think. He should be given a shot at leading the team for the Vuelta - I am of the opinion that after several seasons of racing (and one or two experience rides in GTs) that a rider is ready to go to GT's with some idea of a target. At 24, surely Dekker's body can cope with 3 weeks of racing. |
| |
|
|
| issoisso |
Posted on 29-07-2008 17:37
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
stuartmcstuart wrote:
Thats still one more GT than Alberto Contador when he won the Tour last year I think.
That's the exception, not really the rule.
stuartmcstuart wrote:
He should be given a shot at leading the team for the Vuelta
That's Gesink's place. it wouldn't be even remotely fair to change his goal for the season just before it starts.
stuartmcstuart wrote:At 24, surely Dekker's body can cope with 3 weeks of racing.
That's not the point. the point is experience and decision making. If he's the leader, he doesn't have many people to learn from.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
|
| |
|
|
| stuartmcstuart |
Posted on 29-07-2008 17:44
|
Sprinter
Posts: 1682
Joined: 02-08-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
issoisso wrote:
stuartmcstuart wrote:
Thats still one more GT than Alberto Contador when he won the Tour last year I think.
That's the exception, not really the rule.
stuartmcstuart wrote:
He should be given a shot at leading the team for the Vuelta
That's Gesink's place. it wouldn't be even remotely fair to change his goal for the season just before it starts.
stuartmcstuart wrote:At 24, surely Dekker's body can cope with 3 weeks of racing.
That's not the point. the point is experience and decision making. If he's the leader, he doesn't have many people to learn from.
But Gesink has never ridden a GT and now he's supposed to be leader? Surely he should be giving the role to a more experienced rider? Now that Dekker's season has gone higglety-pigglety, perhaps he should be allowed to prove his worth at the Vuelta alongside Gesink? |
| |
|
|
| issoisso |
Posted on 29-07-2008 17:46
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
stuartmcstuart wrote:
But Gesink has never ridden a GT and now he's supposed to be leader? Surely he should be giving the role to a more experienced rider? Now that Dekker's season has gone higglety-pigglety, perhaps he should be allowed to prove his worth at the Vuelta alongside Gesink?
You miss the point. The Vuelta is irrelevant for Rabobank. It's a means of testing Gesink's level.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
|
| |
|
|
| SotD |
Posted on 29-07-2008 17:52
|
World Champion
Posts: 12144
Joined: 29-11-2006
PCM$: 2880.00
|
snoep_de_hond wrote:
SotD wrote:
Like everyone else would, besides Boogerd..
What do you mean by that? Because I'm not sure which part you are referring to, but I think I'm not going to agree with you.
A decent guess based on the time differences of the posts would be that i'm commenting on the last post before my own statement... |
| |
|
|
| issoisso |
Posted on 29-07-2008 17:54
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
he means which part of the post are you commenting on? there are several points to the post.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
|
| |
|
|
| SotD |
Posted on 29-07-2008 17:59
|
World Champion
Posts: 12144
Joined: 29-11-2006
PCM$: 2880.00
|
issoisso wrote:
he means which part of the post are you commenting on? there are several points to the post.
Well I can't really see it replies in any fasion to any points except one...
"They will speak with eachother next week."
"Like everyone else would, besides Boogerd.."
Does that sound like anything at all???
"But, they noticed Dekker doesn't actually like doing everything they tell him to, he likes to go his own way."
"Like everyone else would, besides Boogerd.."
This, however could be in sync... as the only part of the statement. |
| |
|
|
| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 29-07-2008 19:59
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15830
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Maybe..this all was just one bubble. But when it's gonna be fact that he is leaving Rabo...then it isnt just bubble for me anymore.Young talented Dutchman leaving one and strongest Dutch team that wont sound good for me. |
| |
|
|
| stuartmcstuart |
Posted on 29-07-2008 20:10
|
Sprinter
Posts: 1682
Joined: 02-08-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
issoisso wrote:
stuartmcstuart wrote:
But Gesink has never ridden a GT and now he's supposed to be leader? Surely he should be giving the role to a more experienced rider? Now that Dekker's season has gone higglety-pigglety, perhaps he should be allowed to prove his worth at the Vuelta alongside Gesink?
You miss the point. The Vuelta is irrelevant for Rabobank. It's a means of testing Gesink's level.
But following your argument, isn't this ruining his possible future potential? He will surely try and place high overall in the GC. |
| |
|
|
| issoisso |
Posted on 29-07-2008 20:13
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
stuartmcstuart wrote:
issoisso wrote:
stuartmcstuart wrote:
But Gesink has never ridden a GT and now he's supposed to be leader? Surely he should be giving the role to a more experienced rider? Now that Dekker's season has gone higglety-pigglety, perhaps he should be allowed to prove his worth at the Vuelta alongside Gesink?
You miss the point. The Vuelta is irrelevant for Rabobank. It's a means of testing Gesink's level.
But following your argument, isn't this ruining his possible future potential? He will surely try and place high overall in the GC.
he's too young to ride the Tour, so he'll ride the much shorter Vuelta so they can pinpoint where exactly he is in his development. After that he'll be supporting and learning from Menchov at the Tour. The same way he didn't ride the classics except the Fléche this year, but will ride them next year.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
|
| |
|
|
| SotD |
Posted on 29-07-2008 20:14
|
World Champion
Posts: 12144
Joined: 29-11-2006
PCM$: 2880.00
|
stuartmcstuart wrote:
issoisso wrote:
stuartmcstuart wrote:
But Gesink has never ridden a GT and now he's supposed to be leader? Surely he should be giving the role to a more experienced rider? Now that Dekker's season has gone higglety-pigglety, perhaps he should be allowed to prove his worth at the Vuelta alongside Gesink?
You miss the point. The Vuelta is irrelevant for Rabobank. It's a means of testing Gesink's level.
But following your argument, isn't this ruining his possible future potential? He will surely try and place high overall in the GC.
I was thinking the exact same. Where's the difference in testing Dekker as captain vs. testing Gesink as captain?
I really don't see it... I would've put Dekker in the lead, with Gesink helper/free role. That could prove them into having a top 3 GC rider for each GT next year. Gesink for Giro, Menchov for Tour and Dekker for Vuelta. It wouldn't be all that unrealistic imo... |
| |
|
|
| issoisso |
Posted on 29-07-2008 20:18
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
SotD wrote:
I was thinking the exact same. Where's the difference in testing Dekker as captain vs. testing Gesink as captain?
I really don't see it... I would've put Dekker in the lead, with Gesink helper/free role. That could prove them into having a top 3 GC rider for each GT next year. Gesink for Giro, Menchov for Tour and Dekker for Vuelta. It wouldn't be all that unrealistic imo...
Dekker has shown exactly where his development is. And he's learning from Menchov at the Tour, or at least should be.
As for having one rider for each grand tour, there are several arguments against that:
Gesink would die from riding the classics then the Giro.
Gesink would never accept not putting his focus on the Tour.
The Giro doesn't matter much to the sponsor. The tour is where they really need to do well
Menchov is team leader for the Giro, since it's been proven he does better at the Tour that way;
Dekker would never accept not putting his focus on the Tour.
Gesink and Dekker's development would suffer.
Again: Gesink will ride the Vuelta, just as Dekker rode the Giro to pinpoint where they are in terms of development. THEN Gesink will switch to a support role for the Tour just as Dekker did. That is what happens with most cases of success.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
|
| |
|
|
| ruben |
Posted on 29-07-2008 20:20
|
Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7721
Joined: 23-10-2006
PCM$: 200.00
|
I'm sure Gesink and Dekker will be fine in a few years, I just hope they won't be riding at the same team, because that is set out to end in fail |
| |
|
|
| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 29-07-2008 20:44
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15830
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
They still should have few years room for that...and then decide who is who |
| |
|
|
| ruben |
Posted on 29-07-2008 20:47
|
Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7721
Joined: 23-10-2006
PCM$: 200.00
|
Gesink has more potential, but Dekker is more a winnerstype in my opinion. Gesink is just a tad too 'normal'.
champions are extravagant. |
| |
|
