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Vuelta discussion
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| mrlol |
Posted on 14-09-2008 17:19
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issoisso wrote:
Indeed, this is lack of competition.
the competition there is, is in his own team  leipheimer. (and maybe armstrong next year???)
but the Astana's, mosquera and gesink are pretty much the only ones who really peaked here. and maybe rodrigues. so it isnt such a big suprize either... although Valverde should've done better with his WC form coming up. he should have won this stage... he didnt let his team chase to be passed by Gesink... |
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| ruben |
Posted on 14-09-2008 17:48
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Gesink is simply a better stage-racer than Valverde at this point. It's clear Gesink knows his limits better and just keeps riding his own pace, and he actually improves during the Vuelta, instead of getting worse like Valverde. |
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| Goldberger |
Posted on 14-09-2008 18:29
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Haha, ok Breschel beating Klöden on a mountain stage
Why?
1: Klöden works his ass off for Contador every day, while Breschel has more of a free role in CSC
2: Klöden is not anywhere near top shape, while Breschel probably is close to his.
3: Very unlikely that Klöden did not go a 100% up that last mountain, he clearly lacks motivation as he is far back on GC. |
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| Aquarius |
Posted on 14-09-2008 18:33
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Ruben wrote:
Gesink is simply a better stage-racer than Valverde at this point. It's clear Gesink knows his limits better and just keeps riding his own pace, and he actually improves during the Vuelta, instead of getting worse like Valverde. Valverde said he wasn't playing the GC before the Vuelta, then he lost almost all hope the other day when he lost a couple of minutes in an echelon.
Most likely it's a better preparation for the World Championships to hang on until you blow rather than to climb at your own pace. |
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| Phanekim |
Posted on 14-09-2008 21:08
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I'm so upset for Levi, Levi is only guy who can challenge Contador nowadays and he's stuck trying to work for that guy. Ugh. |
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| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 14-09-2008 21:13
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Phanekim wrote:
I'm so upset for Levi, Levi is only guy who can challenge Contador nowadays and he's stuck trying to work for that guy. Ugh.
Well, it was Leipheimer's choice to sign for Astana
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| omchi |
Posted on 14-09-2008 21:44
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Well I hope Levi will make something on ITT if he keeps his difference to Contador as it is now, he can do great ITT and Contador may fall of and so Levi will win  |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 14-09-2008 21:46
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omchi wrote:
Well I hope Levi will make something on ITT if he keeps his difference to Contador as it is now, he can do great ITT and Contador may fall of and so Levi will win
The ITT goes up a mountain.....
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| Phanekim |
Posted on 14-09-2008 21:57
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SportingNonsense wrote:
Phanekim wrote:
I'm so upset for Levi, Levi is only guy who can challenge Contador nowadays and he's stuck trying to work for that guy. Ugh.
Well, it was Leipheimer's choice to sign for Astana
Yeah, they also pay him one heck of a salary too if i'm not mistaken. |
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| ruben |
Posted on 14-09-2008 22:20
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Contador is not that extreme, in my opinion.
In the pyrenees he could barely make more difference then 10 seconds in total. On the Angliru he won 42 seconds on the 2nd, and today he was barely 3 seconds better then the second best. However, since overfatigued Valverde and Sastre both had their bad days, it looks like Contador is too good. However, Leipheimer is only at 1:17, after all these mountains, if there was a long TT at the end like in the Tour, Contador would've actually lost this one...My point being, he is not all that all-powerfull as people think he is. It's the same as I said before this race, why do people think he will be able to ride the rest at 5 minutes? He isn't capable of doing that, he isn't Armstrong, Heras or Basso... He is just incredibly consistent and just a bit better then the rest.
I expect Andy Schleck to give him a serious challenge next year, and maybe Kreuziger and Gesink too.
I didn't name Armstrong, because I have no idea what his level is, silly mtb races with bad starting fields don't tell me much. |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 14-09-2008 22:31
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Ruben wrote:
Contador is not that extreme, in my opinion.
In the pyrenees he could barely make more difference then 10 seconds in total. On the Angliru he won 42 seconds on the 2nd, and today he was barely 3 seconds better then the second best. However, since overfatigued Valverde and Sastre both had their bad days, it looks like Contador is too good. However, Leipheimer is only at 1:17, after all these mountains, if there was a long TT at the end like in the Tour, Contador would've actually lost this one...My point being, he is not all that all-powerfull as people think he is. It's the same as I said before this race, why do people think he will be able to ride the rest at 5 minutes? He isn't capable of doing that, he isn't Armstrong, Heras or Basso... He is just incredibly consistent and just a bit better then the rest.
Exactly. But for no reason at all people expect him to dominate. He won't.
And people will never realise that. they'll just say something like "oh he never came back to his 2007 and 2008 level" when it's just the competition that isn't up to snuff right now.
Contador right now sucks compared to even his 2007 self. Cobo's Hautacam performance would've beaten him.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 24-11-2024 11:56
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| Goldberger |
Posted on 14-09-2008 22:57
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Yeah the competition is weak right now, we have seen this in all 3 grand tours this year. But if Lance and Basso doesn't come back to their high level from the early years, I still don't see anyone who can beat Conta next year.
Contador is still young and he will still continue to improve, expecially in the time trial. The only one who can possebly challenge him of the young guys is Andy Schleck, but Contador is much stronger than him in tt's atm. |
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| ruben |
Posted on 14-09-2008 22:58
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To make it even worse, Menchov last year won with much greater difference against Sastre, Sanchez and Evans then Contador this year... I mean, cmon... |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 14-09-2008 23:07
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Ruben wrote:
To make it even worse, Menchov last year won with much greater difference against Sastre, Sanchez and Evans then Contador this year... I mean, cmon...
But Menchov got that difference in the TT. Although he was much stronger than Contador is this year, so were his rivals.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| Goldberger |
Posted on 14-09-2008 23:11
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Domestique
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We should't forget that this Vuelta isn't the only big season goal for Conta. He started racing in febuary, and already in March he was in top shape, he won the Vuelta Castilla Y' Leon, the Basque Tour and also his second grand tour the Giro D'Italia.
So if Contador had a easier early season without a second grand tour and not going for the win in so many races, he would probably also be fresher and produce even greater results in the Vuelta.
I think many people forget what a big achievment it is to win 2 Grand Tours in the same season |
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| fenian_1234 |
Posted on 15-09-2008 03:18
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Phanekim wrote:
I'm so upset for Levi, Levi is only guy who can challenge Contador nowadays and he's stuck trying to work for that guy. Ugh.
Just remind me - when did Levi put in a turn at the front for Dertie - either here or at the Giro??? |
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| Phanekim |
Posted on 15-09-2008 03:38
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fenian_1234 wrote:
Phanekim wrote:
I'm so upset for Levi, Levi is only guy who can challenge Contador nowadays and he's stuck trying to work for that guy. Ugh.
Just remind me - when did Levi put in a turn at the front for Dertie - either here or at the Giro???
you didn't watch stage 13? He put in a turn that blew up the field. Afterwards contador attacked rodriguez and valverde ...the only two that were left. |
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| fenian_1234 |
Posted on 15-09-2008 04:19
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Err....I think you'll find that as soon as Levi was at the front, the attacks started due to the 'pace' he was setting....
That's what blew the race apart. |
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| Aquarius |
Posted on 15-09-2008 09:09
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Ruben wrote:
Contador is not that extreme, in my opinion.
In the pyrenees he could barely make more difference then 10 seconds in total. On the Angliru he won 42 seconds on the 2nd, and today he was barely 3 seconds better then the second best. However, since overfatigued Valverde and Sastre both had their bad days, it looks like Contador is too good. However, Leipheimer is only at 1:17, after all these mountains, if there was a long TT at the end like in the Tour, Contador would've actually lost this one...My point being, he is not all that all-powerfull as people think he is. It's the same as I said before this race, why do people think he will be able to ride the rest at 5 minutes? He isn't capable of doing that, he isn't Armstrong, Heras or Basso... He is just incredibly consistent and just a bit better then the rest.
I expect Andy Schleck to give him a serious challenge next year, and maybe Kreuziger and Gesink too.
I didn't name Armstrong, because I have no idea what his level is, silly mtb races with bad starting fields don't tell me much. Well, actually I prefer races like this one (although it's lacking its share of big names) than races with Rasmussen, Armstrong, Ullrich, Basso.
That looks less like a swindle.
Though, given his 2007 TDF and wattages, and even his Giro, I have no doubt that Contador could be stronger than what he is now, and thus able to face the Schlecks, Evans, top Sastre and Valverde, etc. |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 15-09-2008 09:34
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I don't think anyone is saying he can't face them. It's about so many people thinking he's some sort of Armstrong or Induráin when he's only a slightly better climber than Schleck, Evans, etc. on a good day...
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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