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The Difficult Topics
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| Levi4life |
Posted on 16-11-2012 06:25
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ceasing the construction of settlements doesn't seem like a difficult precondition. All you have to do is not do something, that you shouldn't be doing in the first place, for 2 months.
According to Wikipedia, Likud is fundamentally opposed to Palestinian statehood.... Wikipedia also says that Netanyahu is the leader of Likud. Something tells me Netanyahu's heart isn't in the peace process, but I can't quite put my finger on it....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Likud#Pa...lestinians
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| acac |
Posted on 16-11-2012 07:17
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Domestique
Posts: 654
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Levi4life wrote:
ceasing the construction of settlements doesn't seem like a difficult precondition. All you have to do is not do something, that you shouldn't be doing in the first place, for 2 months.
According to Wikipedia, Likud is fundamentally opposed to Palestinian statehood.... Wikipedia also says that Netanyahu is the leader of Likud. Something tells me Netanyahu's heart isn't in the peace process, but I can't quite put my finger on it....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Likud#Pa...lestinians
Israel is divided in 2 camps, the right wing that is more aggressive to Palestinians and Arabs in general and the left wing that has a softer attitude to them. There is no way to deny that halikud and all of its members are in the right wing. But Wikipedia is wrong a bit at that. Halikud never completely rejected the idea of a free Palestinian state. And you know what, even if they were, they were chosen by the Israeli public to do what is best for the Israeli public, and if that means that under their leadership there will never be a Palestinian state then so be it. Then again, as I said before elections are coming up and they are likely to lose power. |
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 16-11-2012 08:53
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World Champion
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acac wrote:
But that is exactly what I said. He refused because he knew that they will come with some ridicules offer. And btw, Israel has already proven that we intend to make peace( Egypt and Jordan + very advanced peace talks with Syria until the rebels started).
What do you not understand on FACT that Israel has nothing to do in Gaza? They are occupying it like Hitler did with Poland and central Europe.
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| acac |
Posted on 16-11-2012 09:02
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Domestique
Posts: 654
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Avin Wargunnson wrote:
acac wrote:
But that is exactly what I said. He refused because he knew that they will come with some ridicules offer. And btw, Israel has already proven that we intend to make peace( Egypt and Jordan + very advanced peace talks with Syria until the rebels started).
What do you not understand on FACT that Israel has nothing to do in Gaza? They are occupying it like Hitler did with Poland and central Europe.
Israel is occupying gaza? There is not a signal Israeli in gaza right now, no settlements and since they fire rockets at us we do have something to do there.
EDIT: and no Israeli prime minister has claimed gaza is a part of Israel.
Edited by acac on 16-11-2012 09:04
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 16-11-2012 09:16
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I expressed myself badly, not ocupying, but terrorizing it and they will never stop, before every single Palestinian there will be dead or gone. You are the military superpower with Uncle Sam watching you , it seems to me that whole Israel is living only on hatred and war.
That does not mean i support terrorists in killing innocent people, they have just right to fight for their freedom like others did in the past. I cannot rid of impression that Israel is playing the role of Feudal opressor here.
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| acac |
Posted on 16-11-2012 09:58
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Domestique
Posts: 654
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Avin Wargunnson wrote:
I expressed myself badly, not ocupying, but terrorizing it and they will never stop, before every single Palestinian there will be dead or gone. You are the military superpower with Uncle Sam watching you , it seems to me that whole Israel is living only on hatred and war.
That does not mean i support terrorists in killing innocent people, they have just right to fight for their freedom like others did in the past. I cannot rid of impression that Israel is playing the role of Feudal opressor here.
You are still wrong in part. You are right that the IDF is probably the strongest army in the area, and he is stronger then Hamas which is more of a militia then a army. But what you seem to forget is that Israel did not just attack there. Life in southern Israel is a living hell because of the Hamas for a long time, the intention of this fight is to ruin all their rockets and their will to fight. |
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| acac |
Posted on 16-11-2012 09:58
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Domestique
Posts: 654
Joined: 20-09-2009
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Avin Wargunnson wrote:
I expressed myself badly, not ocupying, but terrorizing it and they will never stop, before every single Palestinian there will be dead or gone. You are the military superpower with Uncle Sam watching you , it seems to me that whole Israel is living only on hatred and war.
That does not mean i support terrorists in killing innocent people, they have just right to fight for their freedom like others did in the past. I cannot rid of impression that Israel is playing the role of Feudal opressor here.
You are still wrong in part. You are right that the IDF is probably the strongest army in the area, and he is stronger then Hamas which is more of a militia then a army. But what you seem to forget is that Israel did not just attack there. Life in southern Israel is a living hell because of the Hamas for a long time, the intention of this fight is to ruin all their rockets and their will to fight. |
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| Daggen |
Posted on 16-11-2012 10:03
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Sprinter
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Th war between Israel and every Arab nation in the world is something I couldn't care less about. |
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 23-11-2024 09:11
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| wackojackohighcliffe |
Posted on 16-11-2012 10:27
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It's hardly a balanced and just fight. More Palestinians were killed in Gaza on Wednesday than Israelis have been killed by fire from Gaza in the last three years. And in the Gaza War for example, 762 Palestian civilians (including over 300 children) were killed. How many Israelis? 3. |
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| Ian Butler |
Posted on 16-11-2012 10:30
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Dead on, wacko.
And the ones that can make a difference (the Western world, USA) are shite to do it. Keeping the holocaust as an excuse. |
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| acac |
Posted on 16-11-2012 10:34
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Domestique
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wackojackohighcliffe wrote:
It's hardly a balanced and just fight. More Palestinians were killed in Gaza on Wednesday than Israelis have been killed by fire from Gaza in the last three years. And in the Gaza War for example, 762 Palestian civilians (including over 300 children) were killed. How many Israelis? 3.
Where did you get those statistics from? Even Hamas did not claim such a high civil deathes ,and 13 Israelis died not 3 |
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| wackojackohighcliffe |
Posted on 16-11-2012 11:12
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Israeli human rights group BTselem. |
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 16-11-2012 12:33
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World Champion
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Ian Butler wrote:
Dead on, wacko.
And the ones that can make a difference (the Western world, USA) are shite to do it. Keeping the holocaust as an excuse.
USA are not closing eyes, they are even supporting it. Well, that is expectable, given the fact that Israel is something like child state to USA parent.
And Acac, i think there is no point to discuss if it was 10 people +-, the point still stand, that for every rocket that makes it through to kill an israeli, there are brutal answers that kill even more and more palestinians.
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| acac |
Posted on 16-11-2012 12:42
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Domestique
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wackojackohighcliffe wrote:
Israeli human rights group BTselem.
Israeli-Palestinian "human right group". Not such a reliable source in my opinion...
and avin, those 10 are more then important to the israelis, the reason that there are so much palesitinian deaths and "low" amout of israeli deaths is becuse the IDF defendes the citizens while hamas defendes only himself.
EDIT: rockets reach jerusalam.more reserve troops have been called.
Edited by acac on 16-11-2012 16:28
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| Aquarius |
Posted on 18-11-2012 11:45
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By the way, why on Earth is Israel DF striking Hamas nowadays when it's in fact djihadists from Iran or funded by Iran who're attacking Israel ?
Sure Hamas hate Israel and all, but picking at Hamas just seems wrong in the current situation. |
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| acac |
Posted on 18-11-2012 12:02
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Domestique
Posts: 654
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Aquarius wrote:
By the way, why on Earth is Israel DF striking Hamas nowadays when it's in fact djihadists from Iran or funded by Iran who're attacking Israel ?
Sure Hamas hate Israel and all, but picking at Hamas just seems wrong in the current situation.
i am rolling on the floor right now.not because of your opinion but my teacher told me exactly the same thing today.and you are right, hamas is an iran outpost in the area. what you see in gaza right now is that the trio of iran-syria-hezbollah vs turkey-egypt-oman.in case you did not know, there is anthor movement in gaza funded by iran called PIJ. they are the ones that shot the israeli humvee about a week ago.by doing that they basiclly told hamas"we are a force to be reconed with". hamas didnt like that and he dicided he needs to find a common enemy for them,israel. they started working togther and attack israel along side each other,and that led to the israeli air strikes. i agree with you that iran is also to blame, but the men that joined that movement knew that they will be chased by israel and they knew why. no one forced them to join hamas, they took the risk and now they are paying for losing that risk. |
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| wackojackohighcliffe |
Posted on 18-11-2012 12:29
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Grand Tour Champion
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acac wrote:
wackojackohighcliffe wrote:
Israeli human rights group BTselem.
Israeli-Palestinian "human right group". Not such a reliable source in my opinion...
If it's between both countries wouldn't that make it more trustworthy than most one-sided sources? |
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| acac |
Posted on 18-11-2012 12:36
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Domestique
Posts: 654
Joined: 20-09-2009
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wackojackohighcliffe wrote:
acac wrote:
wackojackohighcliffe wrote:
Israeli human rights group BTselem.
Israeli-Palestinian "human right group". Not such a reliable source in my opinion...
If it's between both countries wouldn't that make it more trustworthy than most one-sided sources?
the palestinians living in israel are considring themselves palestinians and not israelis,so no. the true number is most likely somewhere between what the IDF calimed and what hamas has claimed. |
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| wackojackohighcliffe |
Posted on 18-11-2012 12:46
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Grand Tour Champion
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In any case, I looked it up and they are Israelis. |
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| acac |
Posted on 19-11-2012 09:04
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Domestique
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i gusse we have to agree to disagree.
anyway ceasefire offers have been made:
hamas wants:
1)removal of the naval blockade on gaza.
2)IDF troops wont be allowed to be closer then 300 meters to gaza
3)egyptian forces to make sure the truce will be respected.
4)israel to stop pinpoint its leaders.
israel wants:
1)a long lasting truce for at least 15 years.
2)bringing all the wepons smuggling to a holt.
3)hamas and all other movements to stop shooting rockets to israel.
4)israel saves the right to hunt militants that have made an attack on either its citizens or troops.
5)the border control between gaza and egypt will open but the border between gaza and israel will remain closed.
6)the egyptian goverment will make sure the agreement will be respected(important note:this means it will be coved politicli and not by the milatry). |
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