|
The Difficult Topics
|
| fcancellara |
Posted on 07-11-2012 16:43
|
Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 5194
Joined: 18-08-2011
PCM$: 200.00
|
It's funny how almost all Europeans prefer Obama over Romney, but in the USA it's about 50/50 
|
| |
|
|
| ste_18 |
Posted on 07-11-2012 16:45
|
Protected Rider
Posts: 1430
Joined: 06-08-2012
PCM$: 200.00
|
fcancellara wrote:
It's funny how almost all Europeans prefer Obama over Romney, but in the USA it's about 50/50
That's because Obama has a very good relationship with Europe |
| |
|
|
| kumazan |
Posted on 07-11-2012 16:54
|
Team Leader
Posts: 6662
Joined: 02-07-2009
PCM$: 200.00
|
It also helps that no one in the Democratic Part has said that women getting pregnant after being raped is God's will, and that kind of retarded things. But hey, Europeans must be atheist nutjobs.
Edited by kumazan on 07-11-2012 16:55
|
| |
|
|
| Levi4life |
Posted on 07-11-2012 17:41
|
Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4882
Joined: 16-03-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Mresuperstar wrote:
Ian Butler wrote:
Well, it's already in the Café Pedro thread: Obama's re-elected.
Am I the only one bothered by the billions of dollars that they spend on election campaigns? Money that could be used for things like, oh you know, fighting poverty?
Well most now my opinion by now so I will leave it that be.
And yes, last I heard it was 6 billion dollars for campaigning!?! I find that sicking as well. In 4 years somebody should run off of using free social media sites and just say "I saved you all a bunch of money to fix all our problems." It would be genius but it's too bad they wouldn't get enough recognition.
How bout some perspective. America spent $6 billion on politics this campaign and about $6.9 billion on Halloween(2011. I heard that this year it was closer to $8 billion). $ 6 billion is the budget gap here in California that was closed by a quarter percent increase in sales tax and about 1% increase on incomes over $250,000.
Edited by Levi4life on 07-11-2012 17:41
|
| |
|
|
| sieve |
Posted on 07-11-2012 18:16
|
Free Agent
Posts: 139
Joined: 23-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
|
To you americans here on this forum, what are your reactions to the election?
meh.
I wish there was a politically viable alternative to republicrats. |
| |
|
|
| cactus-jack |
Posted on 07-11-2012 18:44
|
Classics Specialist
Posts: 3936
Joined: 31-07-2009
PCM$: 200.00
|
I myself is quiet pleased with Obama winning the election, part because I agree with his policies (I'm a bit of a leftie) and part because the media is very Obama-friendly here. I guess it is in most of Europe aswell.
There are a few things that continues to surprise me about the US. For a nation that is seen as the "perfect democracy" and "land of the free" (que bald eagle) religion seems to play a certain part in the elections(Santorum, Mitt the Mor(m)on, etc.)" and there's also the fact that it's a two-party system.
I believe there should be a greater flora of parties in all countries, it would give people an actual choise.
There's a fine line between "psychotherapist" and "psycho the rapist"
|
| |
|
|
| sieve |
Posted on 07-11-2012 19:01
|
Free Agent
Posts: 139
Joined: 23-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
|
Other parties have and do exist in the U.S. but they can't get any traction.
Anything to break up the 2 party polarity would be nice. But not so many parties that it becomes out of control.
I wonder if a coalition government has more corruption than a duopolistic one. |
| |
|
|
| Atlantius |
Posted on 07-11-2012 19:06
|
Team Leader
Posts: 6795
Joined: 21-07-2010
PCM$: 200.00
|
sieve wrote:
Other parties have and do exist in the U.S. but they can't get any traction.
Anything to break up the 2 party polarity would be nice. But not so many parties that it becomes out of control.
I wonder if a coalition government has more corruption than a duopolistic one.
I think what's keeping other parties from establishing is your winner-takes-it-all electoral system. If a party can't get half the vote they don't have a platform. For me that's a basic democratic flaw in your system
I think more parties are better as your vote can be more specific. You could vote for Romney without voting for Palin and Tea-party for exampel.
|
| |
|
|
| Aquarius |
Posted on 07-11-2012 19:33
|
Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 5220
Joined: 29-11-2006
PCM$: 200.00
|
ste_18 wrote:
fcancellara wrote:
It's funny how almost all Europeans prefer Obama over Romney, but in the USA it's about 50/50
That's because Obama has a very good relationship with Europe
Still he's the first post-European US President. He said USA focus should now be on the Pacific (Asia & Oceania) rather than on the Atlantic (Europe). |
| |
|
|
| Ad Bot |
Posted on 23-11-2024 05:08
|
Bot Agent
Posts: Countless
Joined: 23.11.09
|
|
| IP: None |
|
|
| jph27 |
Posted on 07-11-2012 19:49
|
Team Leader
Posts: 7339
Joined: 20-03-2010
PCM$: 900.00
|
All that is wrong with America is illustrated in this picture, showing who would be the preferred president in each country. And yet Romney got nearly 50%? 1% for Gary Johnson though. |
| |
|
|
| miggi133 |
Posted on 07-11-2012 19:51
|
Classics Specialist
Posts: 3141
Joined: 19-08-2009
PCM$: 200.00
|
cactus-jack wrote:
To you americans here on this forum, what are your reactions to the election?
I may not be american but here is my cut on the election result:
The wrong person has won. A friend of mine exressed it this way:
Obama vs. Romney is like the plague vs. Cholera.
To be honest, Id rather die of Cholera in this case.
The US re-elected a president that promised:
1. The closing of Guantanamo Bay
2. The withdrawal of Troops from Iraq
3. A cut in the output of Weapons
4. Healthcare
Lets start from the top!
1. Yes he did formally close Guantanamo Bay. Wait it is still open! That is because only a few days after offically closing the Bay, he ratified some Anti-Terrorism laws, that make it basically impossibe to shut down the Bay completely. Eventhough he was against the Torture of its prisoners, those laws state something like: "If a person is suspected in planning a terrorist attack against the United States of America, excessive (brutal) force may be used in order to prevent such attacks!" So basically: Torture is ok, if a person is suspected of a plot against the US.
I am moving on from those laws to the fact that only some 3 people were released from Guantanmo but 5 new prisoners were added to the camp! That doesnt look like closing but more like a false pretence so far. Lastly, Mr Obama only promised the closing of the Bay, but never mentioned the closing of other CIA/FBI Black Sites (The bay is one ). So in actual fact,if Guantanamo were to be closed, the US would still carry on wth its inhumane measures against Potetial terrorists...
At least Romney and the republicans woud not lie about their desire to keep Guantanamo open!
2. Obama promised the withdrawal of US military from Iraq. 4 years later they are still there... Not very effective... And most of them soldiers who were retrieved from Iraq are no stationed across the border in Afghanistan!
3. The output of weaponary in the last 4 years was higher than in any of the Bush Periods... So much for cutting down on that!
4. Obama care never really got started. Actually, The healthcare system has merekly changed. And I believe some might argue not for the better...
(I leave some of the debatable controversies out, such as Osama and the Navy Seals as this is an old AND different debate)
In total, I think Obama was the worse choice in this years election (dont get me wrong I was for him 4 years ago and I am usually pro democrats).
This is my point of view!
Lets bring on the argumetations!
|
| |
|
|
| felix_29 |
Posted on 07-11-2012 19:55
|
Classics Specialist
Posts: 3054
Joined: 08-08-2009
PCM$: 200.00
|
Funny that in Pakistan Romney has more supporters than Obama. The right-wing "Obama is a Moslem" propaganda hasn´t reached them yet.
|
| |
|
|
| miggi133 |
Posted on 07-11-2012 19:59
|
Classics Specialist
Posts: 3141
Joined: 19-08-2009
PCM$: 200.00
|
jph27 wrote:
All that is wrong with America is illustrated in this picture, showing who would be the preferred president in each country. And yet Romney got nearly 50%? 1% for Gary Johnson though.
Funny how the graphic says countries ranked by their SUPPORT FOR OBAMA!
As if that aint subjectif!
|
| |
|
|
| Crommy |
Posted on 07-11-2012 20:18
|
World Champion
Posts: 10018
Joined: 29-11-2006
PCM$: 200.00
|
miggi133 wrote:
jph27 wrote:
All that is wrong with America is illustrated in this picture, showing who would be the preferred president in each country. And yet Romney got nearly 50%? 1% for Gary Johnson though.
Funny how the graphic says countries ranked by their SUPPORT FOR OBAMA!
As if that aint subjectif!
I really, really hope (mostly for your own sake) that was sarcasm.
Otherwise, try having another read
|
| |
|
|
| Levi4life |
Posted on 07-11-2012 20:20
|
Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4882
Joined: 16-03-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Crommy wrote:
miggi133 wrote:
jph27 wrote:
All that is wrong with America is illustrated in this picture, showing who would be the preferred president in each country. And yet Romney got nearly 50%? 1% for Gary Johnson though.
Funny how the graphic says countries ranked by their SUPPORT FOR OBAMA!
As if that aint subjectif!
I really, really hope (mostly for your own sake) that was sarcasm.
Otherwise, try having another read
I found the opposite chart, the one that ranks by support for Romney. It's the exact same thing except the blue bar is on the bottom and the red bar was on top.
Edited by Levi4life on 07-11-2012 20:20
|
| |
|
|
| Mresuperstar |
Posted on 07-11-2012 20:35
|
Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 8058
Joined: 22-06-2009
PCM$: 650.00
|
Levi4life wrote:
Mresuperstar wrote:
Because they realize how bad these welfare checks are... they are reasonable people. They have received the most and see how much it is damaging our economy.
At least that's the argument I'm going with. I have no facts to back it up and don't have the time to look it up because it really doesn't matter anymore. Obama is our President and we have to limp through another 4 years on his policies and hope for the best. And for my sake I hope he completes his *change because right now mine (and America's future) looks like a big black hole.
Got a strange feeling that 50 years from now there will be no USA. And it won't matter who we elect either way. We are crumbling to the ground. Is England any good? I might need to get on a boat. 
I think the welfare argument, on the republicans side, is idiotic. Partially because, as was noted, Red states tend to be the leaches (I'm a Californian, and we pay out more than we get back). And also because I actually know people who have been on welfare. Interestingly, of the 9 nuclear units in my family(my parents generation), 2 are conservative, and one of those conservative units has been on welfare(unemployment insurance, food stamps, housing assistance, and an extra subsidy to help pay for my cousins education, who has autism). That one conservative unit is the only unit to have received "welfare." All the other people who I know to be on food stamps receive those food stamps even though they have a job. I don't know if you've ever had a job, but if you worked 40 hours a week, 52 weeks out of the year at minimum wage ($8/hour) you'd make under $17,000 a year. It's pretty difficult to live on that little money. That is well below the poverty line, in the US. People who receive food stamps don't want to be on food stamps. They'd much rather live a cushy life like you me. I had a job when I was 15. Fortuitously I also have parents who make middle income wages. I would not be at a top tier public educational institution if it wasn't for my parents.
In reality we all receive welfare. Roads are a form of welfare. State education is a form of welfare, oil is as cheap as it is because it is subsidized. Michigan's economy is dependent upon the auto industry, which was saved from the brink by the Obama administration. If the auto industry collapsed, the rest of Michigan's economy would have gone with it. Technically, the entire state of Michigan are welfare queens. Even the clothes on you back are made of subsidized cotton.
It seems we only whine about welfare when it's poor people who are getting the help.
*Moved over from Pedro. Because Pedro can't handle politics.
All your points are valid however you are missing the other side of the argument. We have no data to suggest that Obama's "extreme" welfare or bailouts are going to work. Are they going to solve our problems or is it just going slow them down, or in the worse case scenario make everything worse?
And by judging on the last 4 years (after everyone believed "Change" and elected him) his welfare plan made the deceit grow the faster than it's every been. And last I check is still growing. Unemployment is just now starting to change, for the better, after 4 years (and who knows if it will continue to get better). And for my sake I want a job when I leave college. And yes, I have worked for minimum wage.
His policies are flawed (I'm not saying Romney's were "completely" right either) but Obama doesn't deserve to continue throwing around taxpayers dollars for a policy that is quickly corrupting this country.
(I really don't want to argue this anymore because it doesn't matter. Obama won, and I have to agree with the majority of America, wait I mean the electoral college, that his policies will work. For you and mine sake I hope he pulls us through and not down.)
God Bless America. 
|
| |
|
|
| Crommy |
Posted on 07-11-2012 20:39
|
World Champion
Posts: 10018
Joined: 29-11-2006
PCM$: 200.00
|
Mresuperstar wrote:
*Moved over from Pedro. Because Pedro can't handle politics.
All your points are valid however you are missing the other side of the argument. We have no data to suggest that Obama's "extreme" welfare or bailouts are going to work. Are they going to solve our problems or is it just going slow them down, or in the worse case scenario make everything worse?
And by judging on the last 4 years (after everyone believed "Change" and elected him) his welfare plan made the deceit grow the faster than it's every been. And last I check is still growing. Unemployment is just now starting to change, for the better, after 4 years (and who knows if it will continue to get better). And for my sake I want a job when I leave college. And yes, I have worked for minimum wage.
His policies are flawed (I'm not saying Romney's were "completely" right either) but Obama doesn't deserve to continue throwing around taxpayers dollars for a policy that is quickly corrupting this country.
(I really don't want to argue this anymore because it doesn't matter. Obama won, and I have to agree with the majority of America, wait I mean the electoral college, that his policies will work. For you and mine sake I hope he pulls us through and not down.)
God Bless America.
You do realise Obama won the popular vote too?
 |
| |
|
|
| issoisso |
Posted on 07-11-2012 20:42
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Crommy wrote:
Mresuperstar wrote:
*Moved over from Pedro. Because Pedro can't handle politics.
All your points are valid however you are missing the other side of the argument. We have no data to suggest that Obama's "extreme" welfare or bailouts are going to work. Are they going to solve our problems or is it just going slow them down, or in the worse case scenario make everything worse?
And by judging on the last 4 years (after everyone believed "Change" and elected him) his welfare plan made the deceit grow the faster than it's every been. And last I check is still growing. Unemployment is just now starting to change, for the better, after 4 years (and who knows if it will continue to get better). And for my sake I want a job when I leave college. And yes, I have worked for minimum wage.
His policies are flawed (I'm not saying Romney's were "completely" right either) but Obama doesn't deserve to continue throwing around taxpayers dollars for a policy that is quickly corrupting this country.
(I really don't want to argue this anymore because it doesn't matter. Obama won, and I have to agree with the majority of America, wait I mean the electoral college, that his policies will work. For you and mine sake I hope he pulls us through and not down.)
God Bless America.
You do realise Obama won the popular vote too?
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
|
| |
|
|
| Mresuperstar |
Posted on 07-11-2012 20:46
|
Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 8058
Joined: 22-06-2009
PCM$: 650.00
|
Yes, reread what I said.
"I have to agree with the majority of America, wait I mean the electoral college"
I have to agree with the popular vote and electoral college. I was just trying to point out the electoral college is flawed system as well. So is the popular vote. In general politics is a load of corrupt systems and yet we still all manage to get along.
Some how... 
Edited by Mresuperstar on 07-11-2012 20:47
|
| |
|
|
| Levi4life |
Posted on 07-11-2012 20:55
|
Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4882
Joined: 16-03-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
The budget deficit that is so antithetical to Republicans is largely driven by Bush era policies. You can't ignore this fact. Of the 5.5 or so trillion dollars in debt accumulated during Obama's first term, the vast majority (about 4.5 trillion) was the result of the Bush tax cuts and the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq. Stimulus spending was less than a trillion.
I don't buy republican fiscal policy. Republicans have had about 30 years to make it happen, with a slight blip in the 90's under Clinton. The most prosperous time period in the past 30 years for America? Under Clinton. The only balanced budgets? Under Clinton. Relatively high tax rate? Under Clinton.
It seems that if you really care about debt, deficits and the economy you should be voting for Democrats. There's a reason Clinton is the most popular man in American politics.
|
| |
|
