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De Ronde van Vlaanderen 2015
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| Avin Wargunnson |
Posted on 07-04-2015 13:45
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World Champion
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Now Guido reminded me there are still some forum legends left in cycling sections. But i hope he never leaves, as he is actually cool and non-arrogant guy that you can debate with. and he seems to dealing fine with my fanboyism 
I agree it is matter of taste Guido and i respect yours and Atlantius's. For me, i ever saw it as POINTS jersey, not SPRINTERs jersey, so anybody who accumulates best stage results and intermediate sprints was worthy winner for me (even before Sagan, so yeah, inclusing Hushovd).
Mainly because you dont get any prize for being all around and consistent. You have something to value best climbers, many flat stages are there to value sprinters, but what about consistency guys? That is the points jersey...
Edited by Avin Wargunnson on 07-04-2015 13:45
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| Riis123 |
Posted on 07-04-2015 14:51
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But as you have mentioned, that would be rather boring if they kept the system. Sagan has dominated that jersey and for the sake of creating a more even field, its the right think to do IMO.
But even if they didnt change the system, I think Kristoff this year would have given Sagan an actual fight. Especially since Contador should be their main focus, while Kristoff fore sure will be Katusha first man. And I dont think Sagan has the punch to gain significant points on Mur de Bretagne and for sure not Huy, but the change will also put Cav and Kittel into the mix which is good. |
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| CountArach |
Posted on 07-04-2015 22:30
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 8290
Joined: 14-07-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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Avin Wargunnson wrote:
Now Guido reminded me there are still some forum legends left in cycling sections. But i hope he never leaves, as he is actually cool and non-arrogant guy that you can debate with. and he seems to dealing fine with my fanboyism
I agree it is matter of taste Guido and i respect yours and Atlantius's. For me, i ever saw it as POINTS jersey, not SPRINTERs jersey, so anybody who accumulates best stage results and intermediate sprints was worthy winner for me (even before Sagan, so yeah, inclusing Hushovd).
Mainly because you dont get any prize for being all around and consistent. You have something to value best climbers, many flat stages are there to value sprinters, but what about consistency guys? That is the points jersey...
That's the exact idea behind the green jersey. It is just that sprinters get more stages where they can podium so they happen to win it far more often. As for the intermediate sprints I like them being important because they mean that it is actually worth watching the whole stage because you can speculate about who will take points there. This makes cycling a more interesting TV package.
Edit: and I feel offended that you've never tried to drive me off Avin now that I know you're only targeting legends.
Edited by CountArach on 07-04-2015 22:32
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| fidjim2013 |
Posted on 10-04-2015 19:14
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Posts: 348
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Avin Wargunnson wrote:
Guido Mukk wrote:
Avin hush..you should not talk about this subject. You can not be objective in this one..not even close.
Do not mock Kristoff about green jerseys..he has no chance against Sagan? Really?
Kristoff is not marked man in peloton? Really?
Sagan has great team around him..at least on paper. But at the end there is always BMC and Ettix show at classics ..I do not know why?
Sagan was really dominant at really young age. He had won many classics already if he had Kristoff ride sense. But he was usually forced to work alone. Do not worry he is still very young ..many good years a head. And look Vanmarcke results this year..how that strong man can always finish that far back?
I am not sure if you understood well Guido, i tried to be very objective in my posts about that matter, i know it was not my strong side in the past.
Nobody, not even Kristoff HAD (past tense) a chance against Sagan with old point jersey rules. I use past tense and 150+ point advantage really show it as the fact, not just my imagination (2013 advantage was even bigger). This year, i am the first to call that Sagan will not win the green, because rules were changed especially to not let Sagan win it 4 years in the row with help of his mountain stages attacks...
Kristoff was not marked as much as Sagan till 2015 classics campaign, because nobody knew how good on cobbles he really is, while Sagan was marked in every meter. Now it is of course changing and Kristoff will be the biggest hunting target. I never said Kristoff was unmarked, just that he was not the biggest "target". Fact that he was allowed to go in De ronde with Terpstra show it somehow.
Not sure to which team of Sagan you reffer to great on paper. Cannondale was tragical with this in classics, now Saxo is better on paper, but reality is again different so far. And i agree that Kristoff is much smarter tactic than Sagan and i already said that few posts ago. 
And i still have hope for Peter, dont worry. 
Do you really think that anyone would have let kristoff go with terpstra in De ronde ?
It doesn't make sense because kristoff is good tactically and he has a big sprint compared to most classicman. |
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| fidjim2013 |
Posted on 10-04-2015 19:18
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Neo-Pro
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Avin Wargunnson wrote:
Atlantius wrote:
Changing back is hardly acting against Sagan in the way your post suggest. It was en experiment that didn't work so now they abandon it and go back to the traditional system.
Okay, it is just me, the fanboy view. Oh wait, Velonews has to be bunch of fanboys too:
Spoiler "In another significant change, the Tour has reshuffled the points competition in what could be viewed as the “anti-Sagan” rule change. Like time bonuses, the new points rules will apply to the first nine stages only.
In 2014, Sagan won his third consecutive points jersey without winning a stage. By consistently placing in the top-5, Sagan picked up points to coast relatively unchallenged into his third green jersey. Under new rules introduced for 2015, that feat could prove more difficult, with a new rule structure favoring stage winners."
Read more at https://velonews.c...Wgm0AOx.99
It is funny how people tend to make an impression that Sagan won the three jerseys just because nobody else cared about it, especially the mighty Kristoff 
Yeah, 150points is nothing from base of 431 points, just more then third of it. You know why nobody cared in second and third week? Because Sagan has already won it with top5s in first seven stages. that was the point where all other sprinters gave up and concentrated themselves on stage finishes. But till that time, we could see a couple of guys trying to snatch bonus points in the intermediates, because they cared at the first place....
Quite frankly sagan won green jersey because he's all around but he didn't got a win last year in the the tour as I remembered while guys like marcel kittel or kristoff were colleting wins. Better to win a stage in the tour than collecting a green jersey. |
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| Shonak |
Posted on 10-04-2015 20:21
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15615
Joined: 16-07-2013
PCM$: 350.00
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Cyclingtips AU joined the Tiesj Benoot hypetrain too and asked him about Ronde and Paris-Roubaix https://cyclingtip...nd-future/
"It’s a little bit scary when Contador attacks." - Tommy V
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| Ian Butler |
Posted on 10-04-2015 21:04
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 21854
Joined: 01-05-2012
PCM$: 400.00
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Awesome!
Maybe I'll run into him once, since I live in Ghent, too
Also, I just had some kind of dream for the future. I can already imagine Benoot, Wellens, Van Der Poel and Teuns battling it out together. Oh, that would be amazing Feel like I'm forgetting someone, though... |
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| Shonak |
Posted on 10-04-2015 21:16
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15615
Joined: 16-07-2013
PCM$: 350.00
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Ian Butler wrote:
Awesome!
Maybe I'll run into him once, since I live in Ghent, too
Also, I just had some kind of dream for the future. I can already imagine Benoot, Wellens, Van Der Poel and Teuns battling it out together. Oh, that would be amazing Feel like I'm forgetting someone, though...
There won't be much of a battle once VDP hits the road full-time
The Grubers are really worth following on instagram by the way. On strava they have published some shots from De Ronde. Stunning, as usual.
https://stories.st....com/ronde
"It’s a little bit scary when Contador attacks." - Tommy V
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| Strydz |
Posted on 10-04-2015 21:53
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Team Leader
Posts: 5894
Joined: 02-08-2011
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Shonak wrote:
There won't be much of a battle once VDP hits the road full-time
Now that is some fanboyism I could get into
Hells 500 Crew and 6 x Everester
Don Rd Launching Place
Melbourne Hill Rd Warrandyte
Colby Drive Belgrave South
William Rd The Patch
David Hill Rd Monbulk
Lakeside Drive Emerald
https://www.everesting.cc/hall-of-fame/ |
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| Shonak |
Posted on 10-04-2015 22:41
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15615
Joined: 16-07-2013
PCM$: 350.00
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Strydz wrote:
Shonak wrote:
There won't be much of a battle once VDP hits the road full-time
Now that is some fanboyism I could get into
Soon VanDerPoel.Daily to launch.
"It’s a little bit scary when Contador attacks." - Tommy V
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| Alakagom |
Posted on 10-04-2015 23:05
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World Champion
Posts: 10891
Joined: 19-11-2010
PCM$: 200.00
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The hype train is too much for me now...
I'll just move to Enzo Wouters, so please just **** off and don't try to take him away from me..for now...
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| cio93 |
Posted on 10-04-2015 23:08
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World Champion
Posts: 10845
Joined: 29-10-2007
PCM$: 500.00
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Move to Herklotz, noone believes in him anymore
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 10-04-2015 23:09
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 18187
Joined: 12-05-2012
PCM$: 0.00
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I'll keep hipstering all over Womens Cycling 
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| Strydz |
Posted on 11-04-2015 22:26
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Team Leader
Posts: 5894
Joined: 02-08-2011
PCM$: 1625.00
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Shonak wrote:
Strydz wrote:
Shonak wrote:
There won't be much of a battle once VDP hits the road full-time
Now that is some fanboyism I could get into
Soon VanDerPoel.Daily to launch.
Lock and load! 
Hells 500 Crew and 6 x Everester
Don Rd Launching Place
Melbourne Hill Rd Warrandyte
Colby Drive Belgrave South
William Rd The Patch
David Hill Rd Monbulk
Lakeside Drive Emerald
https://www.everesting.cc/hall-of-fame/ |
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![imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg](https://imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg)
