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News in February
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| Xavier |
Posted on 27-02-2009 12:58
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Breakaway Specialist
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do you use food supplements DP? |
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| Deadpool |
Posted on 27-02-2009 13:09
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Xavier wrote:
do you use food supplements DP?
Nah, I eat smart (Fruit, vegetables, just a little meat here and there), and I train as much as I can, which is hard with school and work |
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| CrueTrue |
Posted on 27-02-2009 13:11
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Tour de France Champion
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Somehow, AFLD managed to give Schumacher a suspension until February 2011. Why? Because it starts from the day that the suspension was given.
I don't think UCI will go along with that 
In other news about the new British team, the rumours have started. Ironically, the rider who's being rumoured to the team is not British, but the Norwegian Edvald Boasson Hagen.
--
On the whole Ringo discussion (and no, I wouldn't stop it as long as it's not personal and as long as people use arguments), you can't deny that there's some psychical / human limits.
You mentioned that cycling is an endurance sport, and that everyone therefore can become a pro since it's all about building up your endurance. I guess that means that everyone can become World Champions at running, swimming, rowing, etc. too?
No, of course not. It's about natural ability, about genetics (which was, partly, also what rjc explained). Unfortunately, he screwed up his explanation with this:
"With a few more years under their belt, I do not see why anyone could not potentially become a professional bike rider."
No, that's just not right. As he said himself, genetics have a huge influence here, especially when it comes to the muscle fibres (yes, I've also had some physiology courses). Depending on the average % composition of fibre types, you've got some limits.
During one of these physiology courses, we watched a video which tried to explain why you'd always see Kenyans / other Africans win the long-distance running disciplines, and why a perfectly trained and fit Dane wouldn't win. It's pretty much the same discussion as we're having here, actually.
They tested a lot. The Africans who later become long-distance winners are usually brought up in small villages where they run for water, etc. - but that doesn't make the difference. They found a Dane and made him run as long as the African test person did for a period of e.g. 1 year (I don't remember the specifics), yet the African would still completely outrun him.
They made a lot of other tests, e.g. which difference it makes that Africans actually relax when they're done with the day's work where Danes tend to sit up, watch tv, use their computer, etc. while the African will stay in his bed. It also makes a difference, but it's not anything major.
The major difference is in the two person's genetics - in their composition of muscle fibres. By making a biopsy, you could see that there was fundamental differences, and that's indeed what makes the difference.
Rjc said that you can tweak this composition. That's partly right - you may be able to alter it, but not by a lot, and not by something which determines whether you're a cobbles rider or a Tour de France winner, or whether you're a lousy amateur cyclit or a Tour de France winner.
So, again, my conclusion here is that unless you're naturally gifted, naturally talented, you won't win the Tour de France. Feel free to train from now on and til you die - you won't win the Tour. |
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 27-02-2009 13:13
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Deadpool wrote:
rjc_43 wrote:
Year 5 - 24 hours per week
Year 4 - 20 hours per week
Year 3 - 16 hours per week
Year 2 - 12 hours per week
Year 1 - 8 hours per week.
I quite agree, I'm in my first year of doing serious training, and around 8-10 hours is all I can manage in a week, but I was chatting with one of the guys on the team who has been racing forever, and he says he trains, work permitting, 18-24 hours a week.
is the 8-10 hours a week all you can manage because you are physically exhausted or because you have other commitments?
and your friend, he says "work permitting" which means he would do more if he could.
i still think that if you were doing it full time with no other commitments then you would manage more then 8 hours a week after 1 year. thats 1 and a half hours a day 5 days a week. what are you gonna be doing for the rest of the day? |
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| Deadpool |
Posted on 27-02-2009 13:15
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ringo182 wrote:
Deadpool wrote:
rjc_43 wrote:
Year 5 - 24 hours per week
Year 4 - 20 hours per week
Year 3 - 16 hours per week
Year 2 - 12 hours per week
Year 1 - 8 hours per week.
I quite agree, I'm in my first year of doing serious training, and around 8-10 hours is all I can manage in a week, but I was chatting with one of the guys on the team who has been racing forever, and he says he trains, work permitting, 18-24 hours a week.
is the 8-10 hours a week all you can manage because you are physically exhausted or because you have other commitments?
and your friend, he says "work permitting" which means he would do more if he could.
Physically I can only do 8-10 hours a week, and the guy I was chatting with can do 18-24 when he is not bothered with work, a lot less when he is. |
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 27-02-2009 13:16
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do you think you could do more if you had no other commitments and could work on it full time? |
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 24-11-2024 06:21
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| Deadpool |
Posted on 27-02-2009 13:18
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ringo182 wrote:
do you think you could do more if you had no other commitments and could work on it full time?
I think I would be able to later in the year, as my form builds up, simply because I would be in better fitness. But that is completely unrealistic, even pro's cannot work without any other commitments on their training. |
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| rjc_43 |
Posted on 27-02-2009 13:22
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Ah, Crue, that is where you missed what I didn't write. I said anyone could potentially become a pro. A pro, by definition, is someone who makes their living off of their sport. I could turn pro tomorrow and claim my only earnings will be off of cycling, I would however, be very very hungry in about a week. I also didn't say to turn pro means being able to WIN. How many domestiques out there only win one or two races in their entire career? Are you saying that they are not pro's because they don't win the Tour?
Upto 50% of the variability in the top athletes is due to genetics (and I get that drilled into me every lecture), and the other 50% is due to environmental reasons (training, what you eat, social support, mentality, etc). I fully believe it is possible to be as fit and capable and at the same fitness level as a professional via training. However, if you don't have the genetic's behind you, getting there will take an awful lot longer than someone naturally gifted.
I hope thats clearer.
And yes, I've seen some literature and info on running etc (including the study you were talking about) and it is very interesting stuff, and helps show the genetic variation between two different locations. Regardless though, that Dane, even though he may never beat the Africans, could well be the best in his country, and turn "pro".
[url=cleavercycling.co.uk]  [/url] |
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| CrueTrue |
Posted on 27-02-2009 13:25
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Tour de France Champion
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I can agree with that  |
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| rjc_43 |
Posted on 27-02-2009 13:26
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Just to put out there, I've only just started to train seriously again now, and I'm doing the most I ever have done, and I'm only doing 14 hours a week. Physically I don't want to push myself further right now, because I get back knackered, and my body just isn't ready to do more. If I did more, I don't think I'd last long, I'd probably pack in cycling. I've been building up to this amount for a while now, and hope to keep building it up over the next 2 years until I'm at 20 hours a week or so. Training is, at the end of the day, completely personal. At the end of the day, the guy who trains 20 hours a week may not progress as much as someone who trains 15 hours a week due to differences in physiology. It's just humans. We're a strange bunch.
[url=cleavercycling.co.uk] [/url] |
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 27-02-2009 13:31
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Deadpool wrote:
ringo182 wrote:
do you think you could do more if you had no other commitments and could work on it full time?
I think I would be able to later in the year, as my form builds up, simply because I would be in better fitness. But that is completely unrealistic, even pro's cannot work without any other commitments on their training.
of course they can, it's their job, it's what they are paid to do. just like someone would go to the office for 8 hours a day, a pro cyclist would be training either on his bike of in the gym for that time. what other commitments would they have that would stop them from training?
and crue, those are some good points that have been explained well. but if that is the case, then why don't coaches just turn around to kids and say "sorry, your not Kenyan so don't even bother trying to become a long distance runner"? they would be able to test kids and decide who is going to be the best. but they can't. because it is impossible to say who has got the right skills at such an early age. no-one could say LA was going to win the tour 7 times when he was born because of his genetics. he achieved it by training his body and it adapted.
why do riders do high altitude training? to adapt their bodies to different conditions. if the body couldn't adapt and you where stuck with what you have got then what would be the point in that? that human body can always adapt and better itself depending on the stress that it is put under.
i just get the impression that everyone thinks that pro-cyclists are all super-human who were born better then everyone else at endurance. i don't believe that at all. |
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 27-02-2009 13:39
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rjc_43 wrote:
Ah, Crue, that is where you missed what I didn't write. I said anyone could potentially become a pro. A pro, by definition, is someone who makes their living off of their sport. I could turn pro tomorrow and claim my only earnings will be off of cycling, I would however, be very very hungry in about a week. I also didn't say to turn pro means being able to WIN. How many domestiques out there only win one or two races in their entire career? Are you saying that they are not pro's because they don't win the Tour?
i would say a pro athelete is someone who gets paid to do the sport, not someone who gets paid when thay win. thats an amature. if you quit your job and cliamed to be a pro-cyclist you wouldn't be, you'd just be a guy with no job who races his bike.
a pro athelete is paid to train and perform regardless of if they win or not.
Edited by ringo182 on 27-02-2009 13:39
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| t-baum |
Posted on 27-02-2009 15:44
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Small Tour Specialist
Posts: 2153
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I'm surprised no one has posted this...
https://velonews.c...-suspended
Que Isso...
Macquet wrote:
"We all know that wasn't the real footage of the Worlds anyway. That was just the staged footage to perpetuate the coverup that it was actually Vinokourov that won the race." |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 27-02-2009 16:30
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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I'm having a hectic day at work. Or should I say, I WAS having one...until now 
All hail new Portuguese national road race champion Tiago Machado
Edited by issoisso on 27-02-2009 16:54
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| rjc_43 |
Posted on 27-02-2009 17:09
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I strongly disagree with you on the "pro" front there ringo, but each to his or her own view.
As to altitude training, its to increase the amount of EPO released to stimulate the production of red blood cells. Ie LEGAL use of EPO.
And the body can't always adapt, there is a limit. Such as above a certain height ( I can't remember what it is), the body starts to basically die. Not adapt.
[url=cleavercycling.co.uk] [/url] |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 27-02-2009 18:01
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
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According to portuguese authorities, here's what happened:
Tests showed no trace of EPO. However, when the testers knowingly put EPO into the urine....they couldn't detect the EPO they just put there.......huge red flag for EPO masking agents.
So the samples were sent to germany to a lab that is experimenting with a new method to detect EPO masking agents....and the test came up positive for the masking agent.
All this took a while. The sample was taken last may.
Edited by issoisso on 27-02-2009 18:03
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 27-02-2009 18:55
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Scott Sunderland will manage the British Pro Team
https://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/S...77840.html |
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| CrueTrue |
Posted on 27-02-2009 19:09
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 29989
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Another rumour coming true
I actually asked him whether the rumours were true or not back when they were published:
Me: Since you didn't react to the news about you joining that new English professional team, I tend to think that those rumours are true...
Scott: ;-) considering options as we speak
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| doddy13 |
Posted on 27-02-2009 19:10
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CrueTrue wrote:
Another rumour coming true
I actually asked him whether the rumours were true or not back when they were published:
Me: Since you didn't react to the news about you joining that new English professional team, I tend to think that those rumours are true...
Scott: ;-) considering options as we speak
yeah not reacting is a give away that somethings happening.
There's no point slapping a schleck - Sean Kelly on "Who needs a slap"
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| chuckie |
Posted on 27-02-2009 19:11
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I guess that explains why he pulled out of the Cervelo job.
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