|
Tour de France 11 Stage 17: Gap > Pinerolo 179km
|
| Andro |
Posted on 20-07-2011 21:47
|
Domestique
Posts: 665
Joined: 23-03-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
cactus-jack wrote:
I think that the Tour should determine who is the best complete rider, that means one who can ride on cobbles, who can downhill, who can timetrail and climb.
Unfortunately for Andy and Frank, Sanchez, Contador and Evans can do all those things!
Wait, what? |
| |
|
|
| cactus-jack |
Posted on 20-07-2011 21:49
|
Classics Specialist
Posts: 3936
Joined: 31-07-2009
PCM$: 200.00
|
Andro wrote:
cactus-jack wrote:
I think that the Tour should determine who is the best complete rider, that means one who can ride on cobbles, who can downhill, who can timetrail and climb.
Unfortunately for Andy and Frank, Sanchez, Contador and Evans can do all those things!
Wait, what?
Okay, maybe not ALL those things! But how many times have we seen cobbles in the Tour lately? Once, as far as I remember, and that was all that was needed to make the Schlecks complain (or was it Voigt?) |
| |
|
|
| fenian_1234 |
Posted on 20-07-2011 21:53
|
Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4790
Joined: 06-12-2006
PCM$: 200.00
|
On the downhilling I have mixed feelings.
On the one hand, I think Andy and Frank just sound like spoilt kids.
On the other, I remember back to how Contador felt about having to cope with Nibali going down the Crostis. And then I think of the beef, and the wonders that the rest day has done to him...
And then I think, anything can happen the next couple of days, so bring it on and be thankful there were no bad crashes the last few days. One really big day in the moutains might still decide this race. |
| |
|
|
| Zanci93 |
Posted on 20-07-2011 21:54
|
Neo-Pro
Posts: 276
Joined: 19-03-2011
PCM$: 200.00
|
cactus-jack wrote:
Has anyone else seen what Frank Schleck said today? Appearantly todays descent was way to dangerous and it shouldn't have been allowed because Contador and Sanchez to get away due to it. Also, he doesn't think that downhilling is part of what a complete cyclist is?
Atleast that's what the Norwegian newspapers are saying...
Let me get this straight; according to the Schlecks a "complete rider" is one who can't downhill, can't sprint, can't ride on cobbles, but who can only climb? I've always liked both Schlecks, but lately I've been kinda fedd up with the excuses.
I think that the Tour should determine who is the best complete rider, that means one who can ride on cobbles, who can downhill, who can timetrail and climb.
Unfortunately for Andy and Frank, Sanchez, Contador and Evans can do all those things!
OH come on ! Don't overrate Sanchez and Evans. I think the only rider who can say he is almost a complete rider is Contador. In the last years Evans lost much time in the high mountains and Sanchez isn't really good a timetrailing.
I'm a fan of the Schlecks but also I don't need this excuses for all the mistakes they made in this tour. They just have to say: Yes we had a bad day and the others were stronger today. And when you climb on a mountain it's almost clear that you have to downhill !!! That was really a bad excuse! I don't think that has anything to do with the accident of Wouter Weylandt like Johnny Schleck told in the interview. |
| |
|
|
| kumazan |
Posted on 20-07-2011 21:58
|
Team Leader
Posts: 6662
Joined: 02-07-2009
PCM$: 200.00
|
Zanci93 wrote:
cactus-jack wrote:
Has anyone else seen what Frank Schleck said today? Appearantly todays descent was way to dangerous and it shouldn't have been allowed because Contador and Sanchez to get away due to it. Also, he doesn't think that downhilling is part of what a complete cyclist is?
Atleast that's what the Norwegian newspapers are saying...
Let me get this straight; according to the Schlecks a "complete rider" is one who can't downhill, can't sprint, can't ride on cobbles, but who can only climb? I've always liked both Schlecks, but lately I've been kinda fedd up with the excuses.
I think that the Tour should determine who is the best complete rider, that means one who can ride on cobbles, who can downhill, who can timetrail and climb.
Unfortunately for Andy and Frank, Sanchez, Contador and Evans can do all those things!
OH come on ! Don't overrate Sanchez and Evans. I think the only rider who can say he is almost a complete rider is Contador. In the last years Evans lost much time in the high mountains and Sanchez isn't really good a timetrailing.
I'm a fan of the Schlecks but also I don't need this excuses for all the mistakes they made in this tour. They just have to say: Yes we had a bad day and the others were stronger today. And when you climb on a mountain it's almost clear that you have to downhill !!! That was really a bad excuse! I don't think that has anything to do with the accident of Wouter Weylandt like Johnny Schleck told in the interview.
Yes, Samuel Sáncez is such a bad time trialist, specially in the 3rd week of a GT.
Oh, wait, he isn't:
https://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/...ceid=14048
https://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/...aceid=4458
|
| |
|
|
| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 20-07-2011 22:00
|
Team Manager
Posts: 33046
Joined: 08-03-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
kumazan wrote:
Zanci93 wrote:
cactus-jack wrote:
Has anyone else seen what Frank Schleck said today? Appearantly todays descent was way to dangerous and it shouldn't have been allowed because Contador and Sanchez to get away due to it. Also, he doesn't think that downhilling is part of what a complete cyclist is?
Atleast that's what the Norwegian newspapers are saying...
Let me get this straight; according to the Schlecks a "complete rider" is one who can't downhill, can't sprint, can't ride on cobbles, but who can only climb? I've always liked both Schlecks, but lately I've been kinda fedd up with the excuses.
I think that the Tour should determine who is the best complete rider, that means one who can ride on cobbles, who can downhill, who can timetrail and climb.
Unfortunately for Andy and Frank, Sanchez, Contador and Evans can do all those things!
OH come on ! Don't overrate Sanchez and Evans. I think the only rider who can say he is almost a complete rider is Contador. In the last years Evans lost much time in the high mountains and Sanchez isn't really good a timetrailing.
I'm a fan of the Schlecks but also I don't need this excuses for all the mistakes they made in this tour. They just have to say: Yes we had a bad day and the others were stronger today. And when you climb on a mountain it's almost clear that you have to downhill !!! That was really a bad excuse! I don't think that has anything to do with the accident of Wouter Weylandt like Johnny Schleck told in the interview.
Yes, Samuel Sáncez is such a bad time trialist, specially in the 3rd week of a GT.
Oh, wait, he isn't:
https://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/...ceid=14048
https://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/...aceid=4458
Well, he wasnt so great in last years TDF TT, but yes, he can do well on occasion
|
| |
|
|
| Zanci93 |
Posted on 20-07-2011 22:04
|
Neo-Pro
Posts: 276
Joined: 19-03-2011
PCM$: 200.00
|
kumazan wrote:
Zanci93 wrote:
cactus-jack wrote:
Has anyone else seen what Frank Schleck said today? Appearantly todays descent was way to dangerous and it shouldn't have been allowed because Contador and Sanchez to get away due to it. Also, he doesn't think that downhilling is part of what a complete cyclist is?
Atleast that's what the Norwegian newspapers are saying...
Let me get this straight; according to the Schlecks a "complete rider" is one who can't downhill, can't sprint, can't ride on cobbles, but who can only climb? I've always liked both Schlecks, but lately I've been kinda fedd up with the excuses.
I think that the Tour should determine who is the best complete rider, that means one who can ride on cobbles, who can downhill, who can timetrail and climb.
Unfortunately for Andy and Frank, Sanchez, Contador and Evans can do all those things!
OH come on ! Don't overrate Sanchez and Evans. I think the only rider who can say he is almost a complete rider is Contador. In the last years Evans lost much time in the high mountains and Sanchez isn't really good a timetrailing.
I'm a fan of the Schlecks but also I don't need this excuses for all the mistakes they made in this tour. They just have to say: Yes we had a bad day and the others were stronger today. And when you climb on a mountain it's almost clear that you have to downhill !!! That was really a bad excuse! I don't think that has anything to do with the accident of Wouter Weylandt like Johnny Schleck told in the interview.
Yes, Samuel Sáncez is such a bad time trialist, specially in the 3rd week of a GT.
Oh, wait, he isn't:
https://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/...ceid=14048
https://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/...aceid=4458
In the last years timetrial he wasn't much better than A.Schleck (23 sec) I don't think S.Sanchez has even a chance for the podium. |
| |
|
|
| Ad Bot |
Posted on 24-11-2024 23:35
|
Bot Agent
Posts: Countless
Joined: 23.11.09
|
|
| IP: None |
|
|
| issoisso |
Posted on 20-07-2011 22:05
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
After being coached by Igor González de Galdeano, Samuel became fantastically good at TTs that have a lot of corners and rest sessions because Igor taught him perfectly when to push it and when just to make tempo.
However, when (like last year's TT) it's all about pure power, he doesn't stand a chance.
Just compare his results in the two TTs of the 2007 Vuelta. One was 52kms on a highway with no corners, the other was tight and twisty. In the first he lost over three and a half minutes, the second he won.
I'm not sure where this year's TT stands on that continuum
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
|
| |
|
|
| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 20-07-2011 22:06
|
Team Manager
Posts: 33046
Joined: 08-03-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
issoisso wrote:
After being coached by Igor González de Galdeano, Samuel became fantastically good at TTs that have a lot of corners and rest sessions because Igor taught him perfectly when to push it and when just to make tempo.
However, when (like last year's TT) it's all about pure power, he doesn't stand a chance.
Just compare his results in the two TTs of the 2007 Vuelta. One was 52kms on a highway with no corners, the other was tight and twisty. In the first he lost over three and a half minutes, the second he won.
I'm not sure where this year's TT stands on that continuum
Well, he wasnt great in the Dauphine TT (which of course, is the same tt), but then, he wasnt in top form there, so hard to tell
Edited by SportingNonsense on 20-07-2011 22:10
|
| |
|
|
| Wilier |
Posted on 20-07-2011 22:06
|
Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 5405
Joined: 28-04-2008
PCM$: 200.00
|
The timetrial is the exactly the same as in the Dauphiné.
https://www.cqrank...ceid=20550
Martin won it.
Evans 6th at 1'20"
Taaramäe 9th at 01'56"
Uran 18th at 02'41"
Voeckler 40th at 03'18"
Sanchez 42 at 03'27"
Of course a certain Cancellara wasn't participating as well as Contador and the Schlecks.
Edited by Wilier on 20-07-2011 22:13
|
| |
|
|
| Zanci93 |
Posted on 20-07-2011 22:09
|
Neo-Pro
Posts: 276
Joined: 19-03-2011
PCM$: 200.00
|
issoisso wrote:
After being coached by Igor González de Galdeano, Samuel became fantastically good at TTs that have a lot of corners and rest sessions because Igor taught him perfectly when to push it and when just to make tempo.
However, when (like last year's TT) it's all about pure power, he doesn't stand a chance.
Just compare his results in the two TTs of the 2007 Vuelta. One was 52kms on a highway with no corners, the other was tight and twisty. In the first he lost over three and a half minutes, the second he won.
I'm not sure where this year's TT stands on that continuum
I think this year's TT will show who has got the most reserves. It's a really difficult parcour and I don't think you can compare it to last years TT. |
| |
|
|
| issoisso |
Posted on 20-07-2011 22:14
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Wilier wrote:
The timetrial is the exactly the same as in the Dauphiné.
https://www.cqrank...ceid=20550
Martin won it.
Evans 6th at 1'20"
Taaramäe 9th at 01'56"
Uran 18th at 02'41"
Voeckler 40th at 03'18"
Sanchez 42 at 03'27"
Of course a certain Cancellara wasn't participating as well as Contador and the Schlecks.
Samuel is F***ed
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
|
| |
|
|
| Zanci93 |
Posted on 20-07-2011 22:24
|
Neo-Pro
Posts: 276
Joined: 19-03-2011
PCM$: 200.00
|
issoisso wrote:
Wilier wrote:
The timetrial is the exactly the same as in the Dauphiné.
https://www.cqrank...ceid=20550
Martin won it.
Evans 6th at 1'20"
Taaramäe 9th at 01'56"
Uran 18th at 02'41"
Voeckler 40th at 03'18"
Sanchez 42 at 03'27"
Of course a certain Cancellara wasn't participating as well as Contador and the Schlecks.
Samuel is F***ed
Yes he is. But you can't compare it to a timetrial in the third week of the tour.
I'm really excited about A.Schlecks performance in the timetrial. I think he looks more muscular than in the last years. It's also possible that he lost some climbing skills.
When you are interested watch this video about Andy and his efforts to get better in timetrialing
https://www.youtub...o-tISaJUho |
| |
|
|
| ruben |
Posted on 20-07-2011 22:26
|
Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7721
Joined: 23-10-2006
PCM$: 200.00
|
No Samuel isn't fucked.
Samuel rode that Dauphine at pure training and also rode like shit in the mountain stages.
A good Samuel WON the final Vuelta ITT against guys like Menchov and Evans.
Do not underestimate Samuel Sanchez in the ITT or you will be seriously suprised on saturday. |
| |
|
|
| kumazan |
Posted on 20-07-2011 22:36
|
Team Leader
Posts: 6662
Joined: 02-07-2009
PCM$: 200.00
|
SportingNonsense wrote:
Well, he wasnt so great in last years TDF TT, but yes, he can do well on occasion
He fell in the stage to Tourmalet, iirc, and wasn't in top shape. Also, keep in mind that it as a flat, windy TT, where even Clentie sucked. He should do better in the lumpy parcourse of this year. And I don't think his Dauphiné result is worth much, he was just rolling around doing a reconnaissance of the route.
Edited by kumazan on 20-07-2011 22:37
|
| |
|
|
| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 20-07-2011 23:19
|
Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15830
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
Sami is rasing all the time in GC..
Riis told us few years ago..at the tour de france. Frank had yellow..at the climb (do not remember a name)..leader group was so exausted. Riis told him..atack now. It will hurt like hell..but today you can win the tour. Fränk did not moved..
Riis was dissapointed..this guy is great rider..but do not have that extra emotional kick to be come a great one.
Again ..I have nothing against Fränk..he is smartest Schleck on this race. But when Contador need a choose..would I follow Andy or Fränk atack..he will choose Andy.
Btw. Taaramäe should have raise he's arm and get disqual. to Andy..when he pushed him after hill top..before descent..
Edited by Guido Mukk on 20-07-2011 23:22
|
| |
|
|
| ruben |
Posted on 20-07-2011 23:33
|
Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7721
Joined: 23-10-2006
PCM$: 200.00
|
SportingNonsense wrote:
Well, he wasnt so great in last years TDF TT, but yes, he can do well on occasion
Ah, the ITT where he rode around with a broken wirst. Great fucking example champ. |
| |
|
|
| Christer |
Posted on 20-07-2011 23:55
|
Protected Rider
Posts: 1414
Joined: 30-09-2007
PCM$: 200.00
|
I remember someone wanting to see the Norwegian commentators in this thread. Well... Here you go: https://www.tv2.no...43123.html
|
| |
|
|
| viking90 |
Posted on 20-07-2011 23:58
|
Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4032
Joined: 24-01-2009
PCM$: 200.00
|
If you could only watch it outside of Norway, not working in Sweden anyway.
Edited by viking90 on 20-07-2011 23:59
|
| |
|
|
| cunego59 |
Posted on 21-07-2011 00:04
|
Team Manager
Posts: 6508
Joined: 14-09-2008
PCM$: 1090.00
|
Neither in Germany.
|
| |
|
