Bojan wrote:
Neymar has great vision too and the goal per game ratio the last year has been around 1. He has also proven to be able to shoot great free kicks. He has also been showing a more humble attitude lately. So a lot of things point to him not becoming a new Robinho. If he's gonna fit into Barca's system is a whole other question though...
Okay, don't know about the attitude, I have to believe you I guess
You won't convince me until he proves that he can be as good as this in Europe
(I'm not saying that he won't be doing good at Europe, but I'm not convinced about that yet, there's no guarentee...)
Brasilian league is not crap defensively (look at all that great defenders from Barsil in the past or recent times) ,but i agree with the majority said about Neymar. And same as Messi, he would imo have problems in any than Spanish league, because of much more physical play and stronger teams across the leagues.
And i know Messi is fantastic player, but on the other hand he has imo better collegues than Ronaldo and that is what i like the most on Ronaldo, he makes every team he plays for 200% better and can bring goals and wins almost single-handed. But as Cunego points out, we will never know how would Messi play in different team, so i just guess.
What i dont like is, that Ronaldo is so much hated by many, being called arrogant or selfish. while he has donated like 4 million euros to palestinian schools or battling famine in africa. He also does not want to tatoo himself, so he can donate blood twice a year...and years have passes from times when he was diving and acting arrogantly on the pitch too.
Edited by Avin Wargunnson on 12-02-2013 11:54
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
Brasilian league is not crap defensively (look at all that great defenders from Barsil in the past or recent times) ,but i agree with the majority said about Neymar. And same as Messi, he would imo have problems in any than Spanish league, because of much more physical play and stronger teams across the leagues.
Ah, the good old "how would Messi perform in a cold, wet evening at Stoke?" I guess that repeatedly raping most German and English clubs he plays against in the Champions League isn't enough.
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
Since when he is a better player and who decide that, you or Blatter? He is certainly not more complete football player, what he is best at is converting the chances created from two of the best playmakers in history of football, i cant deny that.
He would be half a player anywhere from Barcelona or Spanish league, that can be hardly said about Ronaldo imo, who is also much more mportant for his national team, where Messi usually play shite (like we have seen in South Africa).
Messi goals for Barcelona 2012 (up to the day he broke Muller's record): 74
Assists from Iniesta: 9
Assists from Xavi: less than 6 (not sure about the exact number, but i's definitely less than 6)
% of goals Messi scored not assisted by Xavi or Iniesta (if we assume Xavi has 5): 81%
But but.. Messi uses an environmental friendly shampoo when he showers! Therefore he is a better player and human. Really? No.
1. Messi would own in Premier League. Look at how the tiny Spanish and South American players are dictating the league and shining even more than they did in the La Liga. Also look at how well the Spanish teams have been in European cups compared the the English teams in the last years.
2. Ronaldo is a great individual player, but he is selfish and a bad teammate. Often seizes the chance to shoot friom a ridiculous angle or distance, instead of passing. It is spectacular when does succeed with his free kick or long shots though, like in the last game. But his effectiveness is one of the lowest of the top scorers in Europe. His demanding personality can also bring a team down though. You don't think there is a correlation between Real's bad season and Ronaldo's/the Portuguese Madrid-gang's off-pitch problems?
Bojan wrote:
But but.. Messi uses an environmental friendly shampoo when he showers! Therefore he is a better player and human. Really? No.
I spoke about what Ronaldo does not because it affect how he plays, but as the answer on many people claiming him being arrogant and selfish prick of the pitch...
Crommy wrote:
Messi goals for Barcelona 2012 (up to the day he broke Muller's record): 74
Assists from Iniesta: 9
Assists from Xavi: less than 6 (not sure about the exact number, but i's definitely less than 6)
% of goals Messi scored not assisted by Xavi or Iniesta (if we assume Xavi has 5): 81%
The statistics disagree with you
That does not mean that Xavi or Iniesta did not created the play that lead to the goal...and again i know Messi is awesome, it is just hard to prove something against this overwhelming wall of his ass lickers like Blatter, who gave him undeserved 4 baloons da shite in the row (while some years other Barca teammates deserved that more,especially Xavi in 2010, or this year when it should be Ronaldo imo).
And i am even not a die-hard fan of Ronaldo, i just see what he is doing. I am the Gunner only...
And Kumazan, i know that "he wont do anything outside of Barcelona or Spain" is old and not totally true, but who thinks that Messi would be owning so much anywhere else, is imo lying into his pocket. Especially when Barcelona and Fifa cheated their way through the CHL many times.
Bojan wrote:
... and the likes of Özil have assisted Ronaldo in scoring many of his tap-ins.
You obviously did not get my point, so no reason to discuss it further (every Avin vs. Messi camp discussion ends like this, but i like it from time to time).
Avin Wargunnson wrote:
...
and again i know Messi is awesome, it is just hard to prove something against this overwhelming wall of his ass lickers like Blatter, who gave him undeserved 4 baloons da shite in the row (while some years other Barca teammates deserved that more,especially Xavi in 2010, or this year when it should be Ronaldo imo).
I'm not sure you know how the Ballon d'Or works but it's a jury of more than a 100 sports journalists and other football associates. It's fine by me if you think you know better I know, I know, Messi has quite a lobby, but maybe you shouldn't underestimate autonomy of these people.
And i am even not a die-hard fan of Ronaldo, i just see what he is doing. I am the Gunner only...
And Kumazan, i know that "he wont do anything outside of Barcelona or Spain" is old and not totally true, but who thinks that Messi would be owning so much anywhere else, is imo lying into his pocket. Especially when Barcelona and Fifa cheated their way through the CHL many times.
So, still a bit upset about his four goals a couple of years ago, hm?
And again, of course he wouldn't be as good as now somewhere else, no one would, because it's freaking Barca!! But saying that he would be shitty or not half as good can only be said because of personal antipathy or ignorance. And I'm not going to say anything about the cheating thing, it's hard to argue with something like that ...
I don't think it's about one player. They need to wake up and realize that people know how they play and that strong teams have learned to defend them successfully. They've become too predictable. That's fine against weeker teams because they're still incredibly good with their whole passing and stuff, but you've seen it against Milan this year (and now today), and not for the first time, that it's no longer enough against top teams. Their system needs an update.
cunego59 wrote:
I don't think it's about one player. They need to wake up and realize that people know how they play and that strong teams have learned to defend them successfully. They've become too predictable. That's fine against weeker teams because they're still incredibly good with their whole passing and stuff, but you've seen it against Milan this year (and now today), and not for the first time, that it's no longer enough against top teams. Their system needs an update.
My point is that whilst other teams are learning how to contain them (there's a good analysis from the Milan game here), look at the number of shots in those games. Given the possession they're still getting (and still in good zones to an extent), they're lacking the striker to up that rate.
Yeah, totally agree, I was trying to make the same point, they need to get more shots I just think that guys like Messi or Iniesta or Villa (if he would play) have the possibilities to do so, but the system doesn't "allow" them to. They need to become more open to other ways of playing than just passing until they cross the line.
cunego59 wrote:
I don't think it's about one player. They need to wake up and realize that people know how they play and that strong teams have learned to defend them successfully. They've become too predictable. That's fine against weeker teams because they're still incredibly good with their whole passing and stuff, but you've seen it against Milan this year (and now today), and not for the first time, that it's no longer enough against top teams. Their system needs an update.
Predictable and boooring!
Hala Madrid, this is football, not handball... Edited by Avin Wargunnson on 27-02-2013 06:37
This is not directed to you Alakagom but I found it funny how Madrid fans complaining about Barcaplayers diving etc, when they have the biggast dork in their own team, Pepe!
I guess that repeatedly raping most German and English clubs he plays against in the Champions League isn't enough.
