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News in March
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| Wilier |
Posted on 23-03-2010 08:29
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https://www.cyclin...-exclusion
Greipel not happy with milan - san remo exclusion. Pretty weird from HTC - Columbia, since Cavendish is out of shape. I think Greipel could've done much better there than Cav. |
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Posted on 24-11-2024 19:48
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| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 23-03-2010 08:55
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Greipel can hardly claim to be surprised that Columbia favour Cavendish - it's his decision to stay there and benefit from strong support in non-Cavendish races. If he doesnt like it, he could go and try his luck elsewhere with a weaker train
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| issoisso |
Posted on 23-03-2010 09:34
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He's only there because he has a contract. He'd have left a while ago if he could.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| jolly_antunes |
Posted on 23-03-2010 09:41
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SportingNonsense wrote:
Greipel can hardly claim to be surprised that Columbia favour Cavendish - it's his decision to stay there and benefit from strong support in non-Cavendish races. If he doesnt like it, he could go and try his luck elsewhere with a weaker train
Sounds pretty much like Henderson, and i don't see the guy failling.
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| lasol |
Posted on 23-03-2010 14:15
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issoisso wrote:
He's only there because he has a contract. He'd have left a while ago if he could.
I'm sure someone would've bought out his contract with HTC, but he wished to stay. So it's his own decision to be 2nd fiddle to Cavendish.
Weird to protest to something you've already known when decided to stay. Also at this early in the season. Maybe he is trying to get a place in TDF with putting pressure to the team management.
I personally think he would be a mediocre protour sprinter with other teams trains. Because Quick Step, Rabo or any team with already better sprinter wouldn't want him as no1 sprinter.
Anyways HTC-Columbia has weakened quite a bit from last year. And with Cavendish injured early they are struggling. |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 23-03-2010 14:24
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Tour de France Champion
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lasol wrote:
issoisso wrote:
He's only there because he has a contract. He'd have left a while ago if he could.
I'm sure someone would've bought out his contract with HTC, but he wished to stay. So it's his own decision to be 2nd fiddle to Cavendish.
Buying out a contract would take an insanely high amount of money, that only one or two teams could afford, and would only be willing to do for the top 2-3 riders in the world. You really have no idea how much it would cost. The cost would be astronomical.
Also, Columbia would have to agree to it.
Greipel did agree to the contract, yes....in late 2007 when he hadn't proven much as a sprinter and didn't think himself worthy of being a top sprinter, and in fact would not be thinking of himself as someone who would be offered that spot.
Things are different now. As soon as he can bolt, he will.
lasol wrote:
Weird to protest to something you've already known when decided to stay. Also at this early in the season. Maybe he is trying to get a place in TDF with putting pressure to the team management.
I think he's done very badly to criticise the team publicly. You should never criticise your team publicly. In private, sure, complain because their decision was moronic. But not in public.
lasol wrote:
I personally think he would be a mediocre protour sprinter with other teams trains. Because Quick Step, Rabo or any team with already better sprinter wouldn't want him as no1 sprinter.
He hasn't had the train Cavendish has. And even so, he's still comfortably beat every sprinter he's been up against. Last year's Vuelta, anyone?
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 23-03-2010 15:39
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issoisso wrote:
lasol wrote:
I personally think he would be a mediocre protour sprinter with other teams trains. Because Quick Step, Rabo or any team with already better sprinter wouldn't want him as no1 sprinter.
He hasn't had the train Cavendish has. And even so, he's still comfortably beat every sprinter he's been up against. Last year's Vuelta, anyone?
Something to do with it being his only Grand Tour last year, while for the other main sprinters it was at least their 2nd (And for Farrar, his 3rd)?
And in 2007, Greipel was the one who felt he should be the lead sprinter. Hence the source of the Cav/Greipel friction because Greipel wanted to be leader, but Cav was faster
Edited by SportingNonsense on 23-03-2010 15:39
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| issoisso |
Posted on 23-03-2010 16:38
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Don't get me wrong, I didn't mean to imply he should be getting the same train as Cavendish. Those guys can't be everywhere all year round.
Quite simply that I don't understand how someone can say he's a mediocre sprinter when he trounces everyone else despite not having anywhere near the best train.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| Il Grillo |
Posted on 23-03-2010 17:02
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where do you have it from that Greipel actually wanted to be the sprint captain in 2007? Now way dude, he wasnt even speculating with his selection for the tour squad. He did some co-commentating that year and clearly said that.
Ciolek was the one though that wanted to be the sprint captain in 2007.
All Greipel says his performances justify a team spot at the tour(just look at the past tours there he always showd he is a team player, for example piloting Tony Martin into the hills in the early stages of Paris-Nice). Now he feels just disappointed because it was a clear sign now that he wont get a tour spot with his MSR non selection (being in top shape and Cavendish not really up there to compete in a 300km race) . And he was promised to be the sprint captain at the Giro and now suddenly Cavendish thinks about doing the Giro which doesnt make him happy either. Several things that coming together so i understand why he is disappointed. |
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| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 23-03-2010 17:08
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Il Grillo wrote:
where do you have it from that Greipel actually wanted to be the sprint captain in 2007? Now way dude, he wasnt even speculating with his selection for the tour squad.
Team captain in races which he and Cavendish were at
And I dont recall Ciolek riding any GrandTours in 07
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| Il Grillo |
Posted on 23-03-2010 17:12
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Ciolek wanted to do the Tour though Cavendish was doing it, mainly because the tour started in London. Which Ciolek wasnt happy at all with. |
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| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 23-03-2010 17:13
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issoisso wrote:
Quite simply that I don't understand how someone can say he's a mediocre sprinter when he trounces everyone else despite not having anywhere near the best train.
He still has the Columbia train, whether its their Tour de France Cavendish train or not, its still a lot better than what a lot of other teams can produce. Greipel's notable results are either in smaller races, at the very start of the season, or against tired opposition.
The general consensus a couple of years ago was that Ciolek was better than Greipel. Ciolek leaves Columbia and struggles - until it happens, its hard to say Greipel wont struggle also, comparatively.
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| issoisso |
Posted on 23-03-2010 17:30
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SportingNonsense wrote:
He still has the Columbia train, whether its their Tour de France Cavendish train or not, its still a lot better than what a lot of other teams can produce.
Doesn't seem to make much of a difference. But time will tell on that front, I guess.
SportingNonsense wrote:
Greipel's notable results are either in smaller races, at the very start of the season, or against tired opposition. .
Tired opposition? The Vuelta was tired opposition?
Boonen had spent half the season not training hard and not racing hard because of a ban and subsequent lack of training.
Farrar was clearly (and self-admittedly too) in his best form of the season.
Bennati was fresh as a cucumber from not racing much because of an injury.
Bozic was also in his best form of the season.
And he trounced them. How is that tired opposition?
SportingNonsense wrote:
The general consensus a couple of years ago was that Ciolek was better than Greipel. Ciolek leaves Columbia and struggles - until it happens, its hard to say Greipel wont struggle also, comparatively.
Ciolek left for a stone age team with awful training methods that lives in the metaphorical 19th century and gives the riders nothing. He'll do miles better once he leaves, as will all of them.
On a side note, for the sake of most of the riders on the team, the sooner that team is "euthanized" (as someone once put it), the better.
Edited by issoisso on 23-03-2010 17:30
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| doddy13 |
Posted on 23-03-2010 17:33
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Isso = Greipel fan boy 
There's no point slapping a schleck - Sean Kelly on "Who needs a slap"
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| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 23-03-2010 17:35
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Boonen had spent half the season not training hard and not racing hard because of a ban and subsequent lack of training.
Farrar was clearly (and self-admittedly too) in his best form of the season.
Bennati was fresh as a cucumber from not racing much because of an injury.
Bozic was also in his best form of the season.
Boonen I dont rate as a sprinter. He can sprint, yes, but he doesnt always seem to want to.
Farrar may have been in his best form, but it was still his 3rd GT - even if he missed the last week of the Giro. And Farrar is still struggling it seems to turn Top 5s into regular wins.
Bennati had a poor season last year (for what he is capable of), and Bozic isnt really a major sprinter yet - in a way the Vuelta was his first breakthrough with a major stage win.
And anyway, Greipel still had his team support. That was good enough that Henderson was able to win a stage despite intending to lead out Greipel.
Edited by SportingNonsense on 23-03-2010 17:35
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| issoisso |
Posted on 23-03-2010 20:57
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doddy13 wrote:
Isso = Greipel fan boy
It's a ring toss game!
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| issoisso |
Posted on 23-03-2010 20:59
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doddy13 wrote:
Isso = Greipel fan boy
It's a ring toss game!
SportingNonsense wrote:
Boonen had spent half the season not training hard and not racing hard because of a ban and subsequent lack of training.
Farrar was clearly (and self-admittedly too) in his best form of the season.
Bennati was fresh as a cucumber from not racing much because of an injury.
Bozic was also in his best form of the season.
Boonen I dont rate as a sprinter. He can sprint, yes, but he doesnt always seem to want to.
Farrar may have been in his best form, but it was still his 3rd GT - even if he missed the last week of the Giro. And Farrar is still struggling it seems to turn Top 5s into regular wins.
Bennati had a poor season last year (for what he is capable of), and Bozic isnt really a major sprinter yet - in a way the Vuelta was his first breakthrough with a major stage win.
And anyway, Greipel still had his team support. That was good enough that Henderson was able to win a stage despite intending to lead out Greipel.
So, to recap your logic: Greipel isn't all that because the guys he beat all suck.
Cavendish is awesome even though the opposition he beats consists of exactly the same guys.
Add national bias, rinse and repeat
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| rjc_43 |
Posted on 23-03-2010 21:13
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issoisso wrote:
Add national bias, rinse and repeat
You missed the splash of bicarbonate of soda.
[url=cleavercycling.co.uk]  [/url] |
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| doddy13 |
Posted on 23-03-2010 21:30
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Grand Tour Champion
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rjc_43 wrote:
issoisso wrote:
Add national bias, rinse and repeat
You missed the splash of bicarbonate of soda.
I drunk it, sorry.
There's no point slapping a schleck - Sean Kelly on "Who needs a slap"
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| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 23-03-2010 21:41
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issoisso wrote:
doddy13 wrote:
Isso = Greipel fan boy
It's a ring toss game!
SportingNonsense wrote:
Boonen had spent half the season not training hard and not racing hard because of a ban and subsequent lack of training.
Farrar was clearly (and self-admittedly too) in his best form of the season.
Bennati was fresh as a cucumber from not racing much because of an injury.
Bozic was also in his best form of the season.
Boonen I dont rate as a sprinter. He can sprint, yes, but he doesnt always seem to want to.
Farrar may have been in his best form, but it was still his 3rd GT - even if he missed the last week of the Giro. And Farrar is still struggling it seems to turn Top 5s into regular wins.
Bennati had a poor season last year (for what he is capable of), and Bozic isnt really a major sprinter yet - in a way the Vuelta was his first breakthrough with a major stage win.
And anyway, Greipel still had his team support. That was good enough that Henderson was able to win a stage despite intending to lead out Greipel.
So, to recap your logic: Greipel isn't all that because the guys he beat all suck.
Cavendish is awesome even though the opposition he beats consists of exactly the same guys.
Add national bias, rinse and repeat
Basically, I had to put up with the Cavendish argument for a good season where he 'wasnt winning the right races' or 'beating the right people'. Now people accept he is the best, and its my turn to slate all other sprinters
Plus, having read Cav's autobiography, I have a great dislike of Greipel!
Edited by SportingNonsense on 23-03-2010 21:42
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