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Le Tour 09: Stage 14 - Colmar - Besanço
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| matt493 |
Posted on 19-07-2009 00:54
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but its ok for you to know me better then me. Ok. [sarcasm]Makes sense.[/sarcasm]
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| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 19-07-2009 00:56
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matt493 wrote:
but its ok for you to know me better then me. Ok. [sarcasm]Makes sense.[/sarcasm]
I havent pretended that at all. Your posts alone have shown that you firmly believe that Cav deserves disqualification. That means you are bound to be biased in your response to anyone arguing otherwise.
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| matt493 |
Posted on 19-07-2009 00:57
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and you aren't? The way I see it I am a third party that has no biased towards or against Cavendish. You (in case you forgot) are British, which means you tend to be biased to the situation as you have always been towards cavendish.
Edited by matt493 on 19-07-2009 00:58
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| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 19-07-2009 01:03
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matt493 wrote:
The way I see it I am a third party that has no biased towards or against Cavendish.
Oh dear.
(And thats my last response to you on this topic)
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| mb2612 |
Posted on 19-07-2009 01:06
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Cavendish was deliberately trying to box Hushovd in on the line to allow Renshaw to beat him, which I don't think is illegaland Cavendish did block Hushovd earlier and cause Hushovd to slow down which, if deliberate is illegal. Trying to convince the commisars that it wasn't deliberate is always going to be tough.
 [url=www.pcmdaily.com/forum/viewthread.php?thread_id=33182] Team Santander Media Thread[/url]
Please assume I am joking unless otherwise stated |
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| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 19-07-2009 01:12
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hakab wrote:
McEwen think it was because Cavendish looked behind himself and as if he was looking at Hushovd that made the commissionaire dq Cav
That is certainly very plausible. A combination of that, Hushovd's gestures on the line and Cervelo's fast response probablly helped to sway the commissaire into a pretty quick decision when perhaps more time should have been taken over deciding what to do.
You have to say it is rather petty of Hushovd to look for a disqualification in the first place - it was most likely that Cavendish would have beaten him anyway, and a DQ all-but gifts Thor the jersey. He said he would go for points whever he could but this and his anger towards Velits right after the finish on Friday takes it too far imo.
Oh well, I doubt that the decision will be changed. I dont agree with it, but theres nothing to do but accept it. Time to move on to the battle for the other classifications and look forward to a 5th stage win on the Champs Elysses. Hopefully the Yellow jersey battle can became as exciting as the Green jersey one was set to be.
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| kida |
Posted on 19-07-2009 01:17
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Well having no bias for or against either rider involved, it does seem a little harsh on Cavendish, I'm pretty sure other sprints this season/Tour have had more "crimes" committed than this one.
Maybe ASO thought that the Green Jersey "battle" was making people/the other riders forget about the battle for the Yellow jersey, and if they(ASO) ended the Green jersey comp, the Yellow jersey battle could start  |
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| marble |
Posted on 19-07-2009 03:07
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In my opinion a disqualification for that is too harsh, he didn't push Hushovd into the fences, he did move a bit but it was still possible to get past him as long as the fence was straight. That said, if it was maybe Hushovd would beat Cavendish seeing he was looking the wrong way to see if Renshaw beat him, which also made Hushovd pass Cavendish pretty quick after the finish line. I haven't read the rules, but in my opinion anyway a disqualification is too harsh and if there was any punishment at all, they could have given Hushovd the 13th place and put Cavendish in 14th? At least it would make a little part of this tour exciting. But it's the Tour de France.. Anything can happen. It's not over yet.. If Hushovd has a bad day or crashes on the Champs Elysees, then those 18 points are gone. If neither takes point on the stage before the Mont Ventoux, then Cavendish only needs Hushovd in 9th place on the Champs Elysees to take the jersey, right?.. And if the pack is intresting in saving their legs before the Mont Ventoux stage.. Maybe, just maybe Cavendish and Hushovd can survive the 2nd category climb and Cavendish grab a couple points there. If it's just 1 point then Hushovd needs to be top 7 on Champs Elysees. It's still not over, just not as exciting as it should have been. |
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| acornwell |
Posted on 19-07-2009 05:02
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When all is said and done, Cav was docked 14 points if I am not mistaken. I know that an 18 point lead or deficit will call for different strategy and decisions down the road than a 4 point lead or deficit, but can we not at least see if Hushovd wins by a margin greater than 14 points. If he does, then this decision would have been a mute point anyways. And if he does not, then the gloves can come off and we will forever have a controversial green jersey winner. |
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| TerpSpeed |
Posted on 19-07-2009 05:37
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Rather than assessing blame to Cavendish, Hushovd, or the french officials (as this discussion seems to focus on), I'd just like to point out that Columbia's team handling of the sprint is entirely responsible for all of this.
Was there really any reason for Columbia to attempt a train, under the circumstances? When your goal is to make the sprint as slow as possible, doesn't it make sense to just sit on Hushovd and make someone else do the work?
The other option (which they obviously chose) is to put your guys at the front, and ride as slowly as possible to try and stop an onrushing peloton of sprinters. Isn't that just asking for interference calls?
When everyone KNOWS that Cavendish is pursuing the contradictory objectives of
1) beating Hushovd, and
2) sprinting at a slow pace,
don't you think that the officials will be already expecting some sort of potential interference to occur, just by the obvious objectives of the team?
Under those circumstances, even the smallest change in line, or "squeezing" into barriers (uneven or not) will be viewed under an unfavorable light by the officials. It doesn't take much to make an impression, when you're already being suspected of a possible violation.
So, boo to Columbia for putting Cavendish in that position. Stick him on Hushovd's wheel if possible, or even Farrar's, and let someone else do the work, instead of putting yourself in a position to get slammed. |
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| matt493 |
Posted on 19-07-2009 05:47
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make sure its Hushovd because Farrar doesn't sprint when a breakaway has won. But i do agree with you. I feel bad for Hincapie. He was pretty pissed in an interview after the stage.
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| issoisso |
Posted on 19-07-2009 08:46
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About Stapleton and Hincapie: oh PUT A SOCK IN IT.
If it was Hincapie's only chance in his career to get yellow? Fine, whine. But it's not, so shut the hell up. Who cares. |
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| doddy13 |
Posted on 19-07-2009 09:06
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issoisso wrote:
About Stapleton and Hincapie: oh PUT A SOCK IN IT.
If it was Hincapie's only chance in his career to get yellow? Fine, whine. But it's not, so shut the hell up. Who cares.
oh yeah, definatly. I mean i like Hincapie, but thats bike racing. Armstrong missed the jersey by 0.22 of a second, he didn't go moaning.
@matt - Me using the same point over and over, take a look at your posts, they've gone in 2 phases. Phase 1 - "Commissaire thinks it's a DQ, and so they are right" And commissaires aren't always right.
Phase 2 - Shut up doddy because you are using the same material. Oh really, the only thing staying the same in my posts there was the fact the barriers bulged. If you would read the posts rather than skipping them and thinking you know whats in them, fine so be it.
Just stop being as ass about it, because the only thing you are proving is that, and when you jump in to defend an American rider, don't expect me to act "nicely" to you, because i won't. (Unless of course it's a correct decision)
There's no point slapping a schleck - Sean Kelly on "Who needs a slap"
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| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 19-07-2009 09:13
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issoisso wrote:
About Stapleton and Hincapie: oh PUT A SOCK IN IT.
If it was Hincapie's only chance in his career to get yellow? Fine, whine. But it's not, so shut the hell up. Who cares.
But a reason?
They are US team (even worse George is US rider) as we...so..we don't want them to have yellow. Where is the logic?
Thor should pprotest about Velits to..because this Milram bitch passed him and he lost one point. |
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| Kami |
Posted on 19-07-2009 09:17
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Tbh, there was nothing wrong with Cav his sprint, he was on his line, it were the barriers. Thor shouldnt have complained about the sprint. And if you still dont accept it then look at it that Thor wasnt didnt get a good place. |
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| doddy13 |
Posted on 19-07-2009 09:17
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There is no reason, Vaughters is using a BS reason "to get wiggins out of trouble".
I think the real issue is this Columbia vs Garmin rivalry going too over the top. Columbia i think tease Garmin with it a little, Garmin get angry.
They are both to blame, columbia for teasing. Garmin for being just plain werid and chasing something down that didn't need to be. Hincapie won't be 2nd tonight.
There's no point slapping a schleck - Sean Kelly on "Who needs a slap"
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| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 19-07-2009 09:22
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yeaah you are correct this Garmin-Columbia rivality saterted at Giro..when Vaughters sayd that season starts now with TTT.
Columbia respons was..What are you talking about..we have raced few months already.
And irony was that Columbia won this TTT |
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| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 19-07-2009 09:28
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Vaughters, who wasn’t at the race today and followed the final kilometres of the stage, countered: "I was assuming that we were working to keep Wiggo [Bradley Wiggins] and Christian [Vande Velde] out of trouble. From what I saw from the television some of our guys were just on rotation at the front. that’s pretty normal if you’re trying to keep out of trouble.
Nice..Bravo!..this is BS maestro. |
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| doddy13 |
Posted on 19-07-2009 09:30
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Guido Mukk wrote:
Vaughters, who wasn’t at the race today and followed the final kilometres of the stage, countered: "I was assuming that we were working to keep Wiggo [Bradley Wiggins] and Christian [Vande Velde] out of trouble. From what I saw from the television some of our guys were just on rotation at the front. that’s pretty normal if you’re trying to keep out of trouble.
Nice..Bravo!..this is BS maestro.
yep complete BS. Also the team had a meeting as soon as the stage ended. (to get their stories straight perhaps?)
Also L'equipe reports that Lance turned upto the hotel yesterday 30 minutes before Contador. - Thats big shocking news.
There's no point slapping a schleck - Sean Kelly on "Who needs a slap"
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| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 19-07-2009 09:33
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doddy13 wrote:
Also L'equipe reports that Lance turned upto the hotel yesterday 30 minutes before Contador. - Thats big shocking news.
We should start a new thread on that subject..
(Btw. intresting to know how many pages we had spammed already If TdF would have been in one thread..) |
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