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News in November
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| rjc_43 |
Posted on 16-11-2009 22:59
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Team Leader
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mattiasgt wrote:
So you will get 10 years in jail but at the same time only suspended 2-4 years from cycling. Where is the logic in that. 
To prevent cyclists and coaches to supply the drugs to anyone else. The risk is instantly doubled if you start supplying. You may not get suspended, but you'd get the jail time. I say kudos to Austria for making a statement and a stand. I just can't believe how many of you are so seemingly anti anti-doping. |
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| mb2612 |
Posted on 17-11-2009 01:47
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Team Leader
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Well, lets face it, no cyclist is going to get caught doping in Austria, there just aren't any big enough races, hence it doesn't really matter,
 [url=www.pcmdaily.com/forum/viewthread.php?thread_id=33182] Team Santander Media Thread[/url]
Please assume I am joking unless otherwise stated |
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| mattiasgt |
Posted on 17-11-2009 05:51
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Small Tour Specialist
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rjc_43 wrote:
mattiasgt wrote:
So you will get 10 years in jail but at the same time only suspended 2-4 years from cycling. Where is the logic in that.
To prevent cyclists and coaches to supply the drugs to anyone else. The risk is instantly doubled if you start supplying. You may not get suspended, but you'd get the jail time. I say kudos to Austria for making a statement and a stand. I just can't believe how many of you are so seemingly anti anti-doping.
I'm just pointing out it is more logic to start with a life-time ban from cycling before or in the same time you go to jail sentences.
(Previously) Manager of Koenigsegg
Koenigsegg: ( Media)
Livin' Loud |
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 24-11-2024 16:03
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| issoisso |
Posted on 17-11-2009 07:55
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
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PCM$: 200.00
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mattiasgt wrote:
rjc_43 wrote:
mattiasgt wrote:
So you will get 10 years in jail but at the same time only suspended 2-4 years from cycling. Where is the logic in that.
To prevent cyclists and coaches to supply the drugs to anyone else. The risk is instantly doubled if you start supplying. You may not get suspended, but you'd get the jail time. I say kudos to Austria for making a statement and a stand. I just can't believe how many of you are so seemingly anti anti-doping.
I'm just pointing out it is more logic to start with a life-time ban from cycling before or in the same time you go to jail sentences.
The UCI want to, but the WADA keep saying no. And since the WADA have the final word....
This year the UCI finally convinced WADA to allow 4 year suspensions for a first offence and lifetime bans for a second one. It's going to take a long time until they allow lifetime bans for a second offence.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| mb2612 |
Posted on 17-11-2009 08:26
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Team Leader
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issoisso wrote:
The UCI want to, but the WADA keep saying no. And since the WADA have the final word....
This year the UCI finally convinced WADA to allow 4 year suspensions for a first offence and lifetime bans for a second one. It's going to take a long time until they allow lifetime bans for a second offence.
You mean first offence right?
[url=www.pcmdaily.com/forum/viewthread.php?thread_id=33182] Team Santander Media Thread[/url]
Please assume I am joking unless otherwise stated |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 17-11-2009 13:02
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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mb2612 wrote:
issoisso wrote:
The UCI want to, but the WADA keep saying no. And since the WADA have the final word....
This year the UCI finally convinced WADA to allow 4 year suspensions for a first offence and lifetime bans for a second one. It's going to take a long time until they allow lifetime bans for a second offence.
You mean first offence right?
Right, sorry 
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| mrlol |
Posted on 17-11-2009 15:15
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 5005
Joined: 24-06-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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rjc_43 wrote:
mattiasgt wrote:
So you will get 10 years in jail but at the same time only suspended 2-4 years from cycling. Where is the logic in that.
To prevent cyclists and coaches to supply the drugs to anyone else. The risk is instantly doubled if you start supplying. You may not get suspended, but you'd get the jail time. I say kudos to Austria for making a statement and a stand. I just can't believe how many of you are so seemingly anti anti-doping.
It's got nothing to do with being anti anti-doping. I just find it completly irrational that you can get 10 years in prison just for taking certain products, which happendto improve your sporting performances. People are allways going to cheat, and are always going to take certain risks. Such a big punishment will have very little impact I think (most hard core dopers will keep doping), while people who for instance need to take a medicine for health problems they have, may take illegal substances(in theur medicines) which they dont even know about, get caugth while not wanting to do anything wrong.
Maybe I'm biased for being Dutch (with drugs being "allowed" here), but the bottomline is that you cannot compare a doper with a murderer. 10 years is too much. |
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| kumazan |
Posted on 17-11-2009 15:29
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Team Leader
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It isn't comparing a doper with a murderer. Drug dealing is a different offense and has different punishments, and to compare them is a nonsense. I wonder why, so far, drug traffickers got more jail years than the doctor who supply drugs to the athletes. Those are comparable offenses.
Anyway, the only doubt I understand on this matter is the duration of the sentence, but, then, what is the most adequate figure? 8? 5? 10 is fine for me.
Edited by kumazan on 17-11-2009 15:30
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| mrlol |
Posted on 17-11-2009 15:55
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 5005
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It's not about drug dealing... It's about the sporters who get caugth doping... |
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| kumazan |
Posted on 17-11-2009 16:02
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Team Leader
Posts: 6662
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They're just another part of the puzzle. The weaker btw. |
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| CrueTrue |
Posted on 17-11-2009 16:35
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 29989
Joined: 20-10-2006
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The following teams have sent a 'correct' Pro Continental application to UCI (this does not mean that it will be accepted, though):
Acqua & Sapone (Ita)
Andalucia Cajasur (Spa)
Androni Giocattoli (Ven)
BBox Bouygues Telecom (Fra)
BMC Racing Team (USA)
Carmiooro NGC (GBr)
Ceramica Flaminia (Irl)
Cervélo TestTeam (Swi)
Cofidis (Fra)
Colnago - CSF Inox (Irl)
De Rosa - Stac Plastic (Irl)
ISD - Neri (Ita)
Landbouwkrediet (Bel)
Saur - Sojasun (Fra)
Skil - Shimano (Ned)
Topsport Vlaanderen - Mercator (Bel)
Vacansoleil Pro Cycling Team (Ned)
Vorarlberg Corratec (Aut)
Xacobeo Galicia (Spa) |
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| CrueTrue |
Posted on 17-11-2009 18:20
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 29989
Joined: 20-10-2006
PCM$: 200.00
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IOC has announced that they will 'withdraw' Rebellin's silver medal from the Olympics. |
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| swsquires |
Posted on 17-11-2009 18:31
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Junior Rider
Posts: 45
Joined: 18-06-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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I think some of you need to look at the ten year prison story from a different perspective. By doping you are obtaining money through fraud. Unlike a person who maybe cheats in the UK (for example, as that is where I am) to get extra benefits from the Government, getting that money in theory doesn't deprive anyone else of their money. However, for this kind of fraud they can go to jail. If a cyclist dopes they earn money and a status. By doing so they deprive a clean rider from making as much money and the status that comes with it. Thus in that sense, it is a serious form of fraud.
If the threat of prison works I'm all for it. The threat of being caught and banned doesn't seem to be an issue, but the threat of spending the next ten years as your cell mate's "boyfriend" might be effective...
Simon
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| rjc_43 |
Posted on 17-11-2009 21:22
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Team Leader
Posts: 6716
Joined: 13-10-2007
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mrlol wrote:
rjc_43 wrote:
mattiasgt wrote:
So you will get 10 years in jail but at the same time only suspended 2-4 years from cycling. Where is the logic in that.
To prevent cyclists and coaches to supply the drugs to anyone else. The risk is instantly doubled if you start supplying. You may not get suspended, but you'd get the jail time. I say kudos to Austria for making a statement and a stand. I just can't believe how many of you are so seemingly anti anti-doping.
It's got nothing to do with being anti anti-doping. I just find it completly irrational that you can get 10 years in prison just for taking certain products, which happendto improve your sporting performances. People are allways going to cheat, and are always going to take certain risks. Such a big punishment will have very little impact I think (most hard core dopers will keep doping), while people who for instance need to take a medicine for health problems they have, may take illegal substances(in theur medicines) which they dont even know about, get caugth while not wanting to do anything wrong.
Maybe I'm biased for being Dutch (with drugs being "allowed" here), but the bottomline is that you cannot compare a doper with a murderer. 10 years is too much.
I can understand that you struggle to find the logic behind such a harsh sentence if you come from a background where drugs are "allowed". I too would find it very very odd if, for example, taking caffeine in any way for sporting enhancement was banned.
From my background, any method; improvement; movement forward, in the fight against using; selling; or supplying drugs to cyclists is a good thing.
swsquires point about fraud is very valid and may well be the rational reasoning behind such a sentence. Regardless, I'm very "pro" any movement towards a cleaner image of the sport, even if that doesn't mean the sport is actually any cleaner (which I'm realistic to realise will never occur in my lifetime certainly). |
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| wackojackohighcliffe |
Posted on 17-11-2009 21:50
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7681
Joined: 19-02-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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I am pro but i certaintly think that a 10 year sentence for just use is a bit harsh. Hiwever, i do think that until we get jail sentences people are'nt going to take this seriously soo... probably side with rjc on this one
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| Sherpa |
Posted on 17-11-2009 22:41
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Stagiare
Posts: 200
Joined: 18-06-2009
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wackojackohighcliffe wrote:
I am pro but i certaintly think that a 10 year sentence for just use is a bit harsh. Hiwever, i do think that until we get jail sentences people are'nt going to take this seriously soo... probably side with rjc on this one
In cases like Operacion Puerto, or when you can be 100% sure that the doctor or the riders are guilty, I totaly agree, it's pure fraud.
But I don't think a positive sample is enough to give 10 year prison for someone. For some positive samples, like CERA or others where the intention of the rider is clear, i would like to see lifetime bans though
Edited by Sherpa on 17-11-2009 22:41
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| ruben |
Posted on 18-11-2009 00:06
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7721
Joined: 23-10-2006
PCM$: 200.00
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Whole Vacansoleil team had their condition tests in Weert (city 20km from here) for the new season.
Hoogerland's results where off the charts compared to his teammates. In the wattage threshold test he even scored 525W (for example, Gesink is the only Rabobank rider above 500W)..
Completely insane. He didn't even train since the Tour of Lombardia...
I'm completely flabbergasted by this. If these tests are correct than it's no suprise he could attack all the time and still finish decently, with those results he would have insane amounts of physical talent. |
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| Deadpool |
Posted on 18-11-2009 00:11
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Team Leader
Posts: 7357
Joined: 06-10-2007
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ruben wrote:
Whole Vacansoleil team had their condition tests in Weert (city 20km from here) for the new season.
Hoogerland's results where off the charts compared to his teammates. In the wattage threshold test he even scored 525W (for example, Gesink is the only Rabobank rider above 500W)..
Completely insane. He didn't even train since the Tour of Lombardia...
I'm completely flabbergasted by this. If these tests are correct than it's no suprise he could attack all the time and still finish decently, with those results he would have insane amounts of physical talent.
Or a big collection of used needles... |
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| kumazan |
Posted on 18-11-2009 06:13
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Team Leader
Posts: 6662
Joined: 02-07-2009
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Mauro Gianetti, current manager of Footon-Servetto, might become the marketing manager of a Spanish 3rd Division (equivalent to League Two in England, if I remeber well) team, the CD Badajoz.
Good signing, if he has found sponsors year over year for the Spanish biggest producer of positive tests, I wonder what can he do with the Badajoz.
Edited by kumazan on 18-11-2009 06:14
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| mrlol |
Posted on 18-11-2009 08:22
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 5005
Joined: 24-06-2007
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ruben wrote:
Completely insane. He didn't even train since the Tour of Lombardia...
That's something I don't believe at all.
Johnny and no cycling for a full month? No way. |
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