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PCMdaily DB Stat Discussion
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 09-06-2015 17:35
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Tour de France Champion
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Why's that? Both need good RES.
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| Forever the Best |
Posted on 09-06-2015 17:37
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3803
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Because Valverde can go on a high pace for a long time and limit his damages while Rodriguez usually blows after getting caught/dropped |
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| evanroche7898 |
Posted on 09-06-2015 17:51
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Amateur
Posts: 2
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You cannot base their stats on one race !
Contador 83
Froome 83
Quintana 82
Nibali 81
Porte 81
Valverde 80
Rodriguez 80
Uran 79
Aru 79
MORE
Landa77
ALOT MORE
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 22-11-2024 14:04
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 09-06-2015 17:52
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15274
Joined: 21-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Nah, I can follow your logic, but Purito needs his yellow bar in his performances as well.
Basically any top rider(at least climber and puncher) needs a good or at least decent RES stat to perform, in PCM.
It might not be very hard to define which types of riders should have good RES, but it is very hard to do it individually per rider.
RES is therefore also often used as variable ''backup stat'' if someone for instance would be ''79,4MO'' essentially, so too weak at 80MO but a bit underpowered on 79. An easy solution is then to give the rider a bit stronger RES stat.
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PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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| Forever the Best |
Posted on 09-06-2015 17:54
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3803
Joined: 27-06-2014
PCM$: 400.00
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What I mean is that Valverde should have one of the highest RES stats of stage racers while Rodriguez should have one of the lowest RES stats while still being decent in it.
Edited by Forever the Best on 09-06-2015 17:55
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| Forever the Best |
Posted on 09-06-2015 18:00
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3803
Joined: 27-06-2014
PCM$: 400.00
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evanroche7898 wrote:
You cannot base their stats on one race !
Contador 83
Froome 83
Quintana 82
Nibali 81
Porte 81
Valverde 80
Rodriguez 80
Uran 79
Aru 79
MORE
Landa77
ALOT MORE
Lol Porte 81,same with Nibali,1 higher than Valverde and Rodriguez,2 higher than Aru,4 higher than Landa and only 1 lower than Quintana? |
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| Forever the Best |
Posted on 09-06-2015 18:03
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3803
Joined: 27-06-2014
PCM$: 400.00
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Contador 82-83
Froome 82-83
Quintana 82
Nibali 82
Landa 80-81
Aru 80-81
Pinot 80-81
Porte 79-80
Uran 79-80
What do you think guys on these stats?And what they should be?
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 09-06-2015 22:38
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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The Schleck Fan wrote:
Contador 82-83
Froome 82-83
Quintana 82
Nibali 82
Landa 80-81
Aru 80-81
Pinot 80-81
Porte 79-80
Uran 79-80
What do you think guys on these stats?And what they should be?
Quintana should be 83 same as Contador and Froome, for the simple reason climbing is his speciality and he doesn't have the TT skills to match those two in the game, on 83 he has a chance to beat them in a GT.
You forgot to put Rodriguez and Valverde and both should be 80 and Uran 79. Porte 80 but with poor rec for a big GT contender |
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| bob7 |
Posted on 09-06-2015 22:46
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Stagiare
Posts: 220
Joined: 27-01-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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How do you rate Fuglsang's ? 78MO, 74TT, 75REC ? |
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 09-06-2015 22:47
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15274
Joined: 21-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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What Alak and I currently have:
83 - Contador(bit weaker REC after Giro), Froome, Quintana
82 - Nibali
81 - /
80 - Landa, Aru, Pinot, Porte, Purito
79 - Valv, TVG, Peraud, Bardet, Uran
However, with PCM 15 coming soon, we are considering getting a bit closer to the Cyanide matrix(who have more 80+ guys than we have).
Basically that would be upping some of the subtop by one.
Meaning guys like Pinot, Landa and Aru would end up 81, Valv to 80, etc.
What would your opinions be about that? Would it be okay to get the subtop a bit closer to the ''Big 4''?
Note that we would still not be too close to the Cyanide matrix, but one step closer can't hurt.
@bob7
that's exactly what I have him on.
Edited by Jesleyh on 09-06-2015 22:49
Feyenoord(football) and Kelderman fanboy
PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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| bob7 |
Posted on 09-06-2015 22:58
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Stagiare
Posts: 220
Joined: 27-01-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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IMO too many riders have great MO stat. There's 27 cyclists beetwen 83-78. Quite a lot.. |
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 09-06-2015 23:00
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15274
Joined: 21-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Too many?
Well, you know, the thing is, Cyanide has even way more than 27 on 78+, they have 39.
It is a matter of matrix, and I reckon Cyanide knows best how the game responds to certain matrixes(I actually had a talk with them about that).
Moving away further from the Cyanide matrix would be a foolish thing to do, if anything, it should be closer.
Edited by Jesleyh on 09-06-2015 23:01
Feyenoord(football) and Kelderman fanboy
PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 09-06-2015 23:04
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Jesleyh wrote:
What Alak and I currently have:
83 - Contador(bit weaker REC after Giro), Froome, Quintana
82 - Nibali
81 - /
80 - Landa, Aru, Pinot, Porte, Purito
79 - Valv, TVG, Peraud, Bardet, Uran
However, with PCM 15 coming soon, we are considering getting a bit closer to the Cyanide matrix(who have more 80+ guys than we have).
Basically that would be upping some of the subtop by one.
Meaning guys like Pinot, Landa and Aru would end up 81, Valv to 80, etc.
What would your opinions be about that? Would it be okay to get the subtop a bit closer to the ''Big 4''?
Note that we would still not be too close to the Cyanide matrix, but one step closer can't hurt.
@bob7
that's exactly what I have him on.
At the moment the 81 looks lonely with no riders on 81, which is why both Aru and Landa should be on 81.
The only problem I see with putting more riders up in the 80s, is that it might become too much like the hill stat with too many riders competing near the top of the final climb, but admittedly mountains are much longer than hills so it might work out.
Like most things it's an experiment that could work or it might not. |
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| bob7 |
Posted on 09-06-2015 23:06
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Stagiare
Posts: 220
Joined: 27-01-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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You have contact with them, not me, it's obvious that you know better than me, how game engine work  |
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 09-06-2015 23:07
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15274
Joined: 21-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Hmm, thanks for the input.
Well, it is a fact that there's more difference between 79 and 80MO than there is between 80MO and 81MO in-game, so I'm not so sure about that.
And well, as I mentioned, Cyanide does it as well(in a more extreme way, as well), I'm sure they have reasons for that 
@Bob
Haha maybe, I was just wondering about the general opinion here though
I don't want Alak and I to be criticised afterwards 
Edited by Jesleyh on 09-06-2015 23:08
Feyenoord(football) and Kelderman fanboy
PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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| bob7 |
Posted on 09-06-2015 23:14
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Stagiare
Posts: 220
Joined: 27-01-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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I wonder, aren't these good stats make races too unpredictable ? I mean that a huge difference beetwen how computer rides and how I ride with the same cyclist. |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 09-06-2015 23:14
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Out of interest why did the PCM stats initially move away from the Cyanide matrix, was it because they seemed unreal?
If that was the case, why is there a move to go back towards them, is it because that Cyanide now have a better understanding of their own matrix system? |
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| bob7 |
Posted on 09-06-2015 23:24
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Stagiare
Posts: 220
Joined: 27-01-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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And about stats, in MO of course,
76: VdB, Zakarin, A.Yates, Nieve
And maybe Wiggins need to be really downgraded. |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 09-06-2015 23:26
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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bob7 wrote:
And about stats, in MO of course,
76: VdB, Zakarin, A.Yates, Nieve
And maybe Wiggins need to be really downgraded.
Wiggins is retired from this level has gone back to the track etc. |
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| Jesleyh |
Posted on 09-06-2015 23:27
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15274
Joined: 21-07-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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@bob7
Well, a DB has to find the right balance between gameplay and realism. In my opinion, especially with weaker form, the top riders should be beatable. Not structural, but now and then.
Of course the top 4 are the guys that should fight for the TdF win, theoretically, and they will, a 78MO guy will normally not be able to threaten them when on top form, which is realistic. But well, since Froome, Conta etc. do not win every race they enter in real life either, the gaps in the stats shouldn't be too big either.
@Tafiolmo
That is a very interesting question, that I, to be honest, don't know the answer to. As far as I know and as long as I'm around here, the PCMdaily top stats have always been like this, and it's definitely not as if I want to change the matrix PCMdaily is, well, "known for", but small changes in the subtop won't do any harm.
So the change would have to be made years ago, but what I also can't exclude is that it was the Cyanide matrix which changed. I could look into this later.
Oh and Wiggins is a very difficult issue.
Since the game starts at 1 Jan 2015 and he was riding for Sky at that point. But as you know, he stopped aftet Roubaix, but also winning a TT earlier the year, if I recall correctly...
Cyanide has him at Sky I know, at least, but I am undecided what to do with him.
Edited by Jesleyh on 09-06-2015 23:29
Feyenoord(football) and Kelderman fanboy
PCMdaily Awards: 12x nomination, 9x runner-up, 0x win.
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