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Giro d'Italia 2009
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| Blues Brother |
Posted on 28-04-2009 22:45
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Under 23
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I've got more the feeling that it would be CSF Navigare Group. But they also got a bit troubled story around doping.
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 24-11-2024 15:07
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Bot Agent
Posts: Countless
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| Roman |
Posted on 28-04-2009 22:50
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4386
Joined: 29-05-2007
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Miche, Amica Chips, Ceramica Flaminia, CSF Navigare.. or no team and Serramenti with Xacobeo stay in roster Giro 09..
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| SotD |
Posted on 29-04-2009 10:19
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World Champion
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Van Goolen could do fairly decent imo. Top 10 for sure. 16th in the Vuelta while acting as helper is a good result, when it's the first shot at the liutenant role... And now as a 1 year of added experience it's not too unlikely that he could perform a top 5 or so imo... He won't get podium, but somewhere between 5th and 8th would be a good guess I think. He did ride a decent first half of the Vuelta according to what I remember. |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 29-04-2009 10:34
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Tour de France Champion
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SotD wrote:
Van Goolen could do fairly decent imo. Top 10 for sure. 16th in the Vuelta while acting as helper is a good result, when it's the first shot at the liutenant role... And now as a 1 year of added experience it's not too unlikely that he could perform a top 5 or so imo... He won't get podium, but somewhere between 5th and 8th would be a good guess I think. He did ride a decent first half of the Vuelta according to what I remember.
Basso, Pellizotti, Menchov, Sastre, Valjavec, RodrÃguez, Di Luca, Cunego, Simoni, Armstrong, Leipheimer.
You're saying he's going to beat 4 of those guys at the very least? |
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 29-04-2009 10:44
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Classics Specialist
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issoisso wrote:
SotD wrote:
Van Goolen could do fairly decent imo. Top 10 for sure. 16th in the Vuelta while acting as helper is a good result, when it's the first shot at the liutenant role... And now as a 1 year of added experience it's not too unlikely that he could perform a top 5 or so imo... He won't get podium, but somewhere between 5th and 8th would be a good guess I think. He did ride a decent first half of the Vuelta according to what I remember.
Basso, Pellizotti, Menchov, Sastre, Valjavec, RodrÃguez, Di Luca, Cunego, Simoni, Armstrong, Leipheimer.
You're saying he's going to beat 4 of those guys at the very least?
while i'm not agreeing that Van Goolen will beat those guys, their not all that. Di Luca and Cunago are more classics riders. yes they've won it but there form since suggests that it was a 1 off. Sastre will only be riding for fitness i guess and wont go for the win. Liephiemer i just don't think is good enough (at least from what i've seen in the past) and Armstong isn't fit enough after his injury problems. Simoni is, i think, too old to compete for the whole 3 weeks. Menchov will also be riding for fitness. Pellizotti will be helping Basso so his own position will suffer.
As i said, i don't think Van Goolen will get as high a place as SotD says but most of the riders issoisso mentions have things going against them as well.
Personally i can't realy see past Basso. If he's at the same level he was before the ban then he will be very hard to beat. |
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| SotD |
Posted on 29-04-2009 11:00
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World Champion
Posts: 12188
Joined: 29-11-2006
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issoisso wrote:
SotD wrote:
Van Goolen could do fairly decent imo. Top 10 for sure. 16th in the Vuelta while acting as helper is a good result, when it's the first shot at the liutenant role... And now as a 1 year of added experience it's not too unlikely that he could perform a top 5 or so imo... He won't get podium, but somewhere between 5th and 8th would be a good guess I think. He did ride a decent first half of the Vuelta according to what I remember.
Basso, Pellizotti, Menchov, Sastre, Valjavec, RodrÃguez, Di Luca, Cunego, Simoni, Armstrong, Leipheimer.
You're saying he's going to beat 4 of those guys at the very least?
Yeah it wouldn't surprise me all too much. I doubt Sastre is going for the win. Same goes for Menchov. Valjavec and Rodriguez aren't much better overall imo. Cunego and Di Luca are for me big questionmarks. If they top they are podium, if not they might not be in top 10. Leipheimer is helper for Armstrong, or the other way around, so no problem in beating one of them, while Simoni isn't top of the crop any more.
Basso, Pellizotti are definately ahead of him, Menchov and Armstrong probably aswell, and then it's pretty much a matter of who are in the right form, + who are helper for who. Di Luca and Cunego could end up ahead of Van Goolen easily, but you can't really say that they will all end ahead of him, so 7th or 8th isn't unrealistic imo, while 4th or 5th is realistically in case Menchov, Sastre and Simoni isn't going for the win. |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 29-04-2009 11:03
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Tour de France Champion
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ringo182 wrote:
while i'm not agreeing that Van Goolen will beat those guys, their not all that. Di Luca and Cunago are more classics riders.
Yes, but they're good enough, especially in Italy, to be in the top 10.
ringo182 wrote:
yes they've won it but there form since suggests that it was a 1 off.
quite.
ringo182 wrote:
Sastre will only be riding for fitness i guess and wont go for the win.
Actually, he's there for the win.
ringo182 wrote:
Liephiemer i just don't think is good enough (at least from what i've seen in the past)
The type of climbs in the Giro isn't for him. This year the giro isn't as hard as usual and the climbs suit him far more than usual, but they're still not for him.
Also, I'm pretty sure he'll be riding for fitness.
ringo182 wrote:
and Armstong isn't fit enough after his injury problems. Simoni is, i think, too old to compete for the whole 3 weeks.
Agreed on both counts.
ringo182 wrote:
Menchov will also be riding for fitness.
Riding for the win. Last year he was at near top form and might very well have won if not for a flu during the toughest mountain stages. This year he's aiming to peak earlier and be in absolute top form for the Giro.
Then again, he's very inconsistent with his form, so it's only "normal" (for him) that he completely misjudges it and finishes 3 hours down
ringo182 wrote:
Pellizotti will be helping Basso so his own position will suffer.
Only in the last week or so. He goes into the Giro as co-leader, with half the team working for him.
ringo182 wrote:
As i said, i don't think Van Goolen will get as high a place as SotD says but most of the riders issoisso mentions have things going against them as well.
of course. It's just that Van Goolen has far more 
I'm expecting Van Goolen to top 15, if he gives a damn...which is hardly ever the case with him.
ringo182 wrote:
Personally i can't realy see past Basso. If he's at the same level he was before the ban then he will be very hard to beat.
Same. |
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| Wyman |
Posted on 29-04-2009 11:09
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Domestique
Posts: 645
Joined: 28-02-2007
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If Basso's at the same level as he was before the ban surely he'd be on dope again xD I don't want to see him ride up those mountains like E.T. again.
Seriously though yes, if he's anywhere near what he was in that giro he will be a serious force to be reckoned with.
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| CrueTrue |
Posted on 29-04-2009 11:10
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 29989
Joined: 20-10-2006
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Even if he's only 70 % of his level from back then, he'lll win with ease |
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 29-04-2009 11:16
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3472
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i think both sastre and menchov will be more interested in the tour. they might go to the giro to try to finish as high as possible, but if it comes down to going into the red to achieve it will they go all out or hold a little in reserve? |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 29-04-2009 11:23
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
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ringo182 wrote:
i think both sastre and menchov will be more interested in the tour. they might go to the giro to try to finish as high as possible, but if it comes down to going into the red to achieve it will they go all out or hold a little in reserve?
They both said they'd hold nothing in reserve, and the reason both gave was the same: if you hold something back at the Giro, you're not going to finish very high. |
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| knasen |
Posted on 29-04-2009 11:38
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Domestique
Posts: 416
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Lövqvist hasn't shown that he can handle a Grand Tour yet. Those 10days race like Tour de Suisse and Tirreno he can handle great. But like in last year tour he faded away. But if he can keep it together he can be top 10 in the Giro. But maybe Rogers or Kirchen will be captain. |
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| SotD |
Posted on 29-04-2009 12:04
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World Champion
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issoisso wrote:
ringo182 wrote:
i think both sastre and menchov will be more interested in the tour. they might go to the giro to try to finish as high as possible, but if it comes down to going into the red to achieve it will they go all out or hold a little in reserve?
They both said they'd hold nothing in reserve, and the reason both gave was the same: if you hold something back at the Giro, you're not going to finish very high.
But there are also a difference between going all out with 85% form and going all out with 98 % form...
And imo none of them are in the best possible shape atm. Not that I know anything about it, it's all guessing... |
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| SotD |
Posted on 29-04-2009 12:05
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World Champion
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knasen wrote:
Lövqvist hasn't shown that he can handle a Grand Tour yet. Those 10days race like Tour de Suisse and Tirreno he can handle great. But like in last year tour he faded away. But if he can keep it together he can be top 10 in the Giro. But maybe Rogers or Kirchen will be captain.
I would put my money on Rogers, as I think Kirchen will be the Tour captain... Rogers/Lövkvist for the Giro captaincy and Kirchen/Lövkvist for the Tour... |
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 29-04-2009 12:08
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3472
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SotD wrote:
issoisso wrote:
ringo182 wrote:
i think both sastre and menchov will be more interested in the tour. they might go to the giro to try to finish as high as possible, but if it comes down to going into the red to achieve it will they go all out or hold a little in reserve?
They both said they'd hold nothing in reserve, and the reason both gave was the same: if you hold something back at the Giro, you're not going to finish very high.
But there are also a difference between going all out with 85% form and going all out with 98 % form...
And imo none of them are in the best possible shape atm. Not that I know anything about it, it's all guessing...
agreed, sastre and menchov may go all out but won't be in the same form as riders like basso because the tour is their main objective. Basso will have been training specifically for the giro and so will be in better shape. |
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| issoisso |
Posted on 29-04-2009 12:15
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
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SotD wrote:
knasen wrote:
Lövqvist hasn't shown that he can handle a Grand Tour yet. Those 10days race like Tour de Suisse and Tirreno he can handle great. But like in last year tour he faded away. But if he can keep it together he can be top 10 in the Giro. But maybe Rogers or Kirchen will be captain.
I would put my money on Rogers, as I think Kirchen will be the Tour captain... Rogers/Lövkvist for the Giro captaincy and Kirchen/Lövkvist for the Tour...
They're both at the Giro to train for the Tour.
ringo182 wrote:
SotD wrote:
issoisso wrote:
ringo182 wrote:
i think both sastre and menchov will be more interested in the tour. they might go to the giro to try to finish as high as possible, but if it comes down to going into the red to achieve it will they go all out or hold a little in reserve?
They both said they'd hold nothing in reserve, and the reason both gave was the same: if you hold something back at the Giro, you're not going to finish very high.
But there are also a difference between going all out with 85% form and going all out with 98 % form...
And imo none of them are in the best possible shape atm. Not that I know anything about it, it's all guessing...
agreed, sastre and menchov may go all out but won't be in the same form as riders like basso because the tour is their main objective. Basso will have been training specifically for the giro and so will be in better shape.
Basso will beat them because he's better than them.
Mark my words: they will be aiming to win the Giro and won't be giving the Tour a thought.
And if you disagree with me again, I'll make a note to come back to you at the end of the Giro to rub it in your face   |
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 29-04-2009 12:22
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3472
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issoisso wrote:
ringo182 wrote:
SotD wrote:
issoisso wrote:
ringo182 wrote:
i think both sastre and menchov will be more interested in the tour. they might go to the giro to try to finish as high as possible, but if it comes down to going into the red to achieve it will they go all out or hold a little in reserve?
They both said they'd hold nothing in reserve, and the reason both gave was the same: if you hold something back at the Giro, you're not going to finish very high.
But there are also a difference between going all out with 85% form and going all out with 98 % form...
And imo none of them are in the best possible shape atm. Not that I know anything about it, it's all guessing...
agreed, sastre and menchov may go all out but won't be in the same form as riders like basso because the tour is their main objective. Basso will have been training specifically for the giro and so will be in better shape.
Basso will beat them because he's better than them.
Mark my words: they will be aiming to win the Giro and won't be giving the Tour a thought.
And if you disagree with me again, I'll make a note to come back to you at the end of the Giro to rub it in your face
deal
so your saying the top 3 will be basso, sastre and menchov, not in that order?
Edited by ringo182 on 29-04-2009 12:24
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| issoisso |
Posted on 29-04-2009 12:31
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
Joined: 08-02-2007
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ringo182 wrote:
so your saying the top 3 will be basso, sastre and menchov, not in that order?
No, I never said that.
But I do think it's the most likely podium. |
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 29-04-2009 12:36
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3472
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well if sastre and menchov are both going to give 100% to the giro and they are as well prepared as you say then potentially this should be the podium. They are the 3 strongest riders there and if they are all going for the overall win it will be hard to beat them.
personally i don't think Sastre and Menchov will be going all out and think a top 10 is more likely.
do you think Cervelo are good enough to supprt Sastre to a win in the Giro or Tour?
we'll see who will rub whose face in it at the end of may?
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| chuckie |
Posted on 29-04-2009 14:01
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Breakaway Specialist
Posts: 828
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Menchov's tactics failed him big time in the tour.Drove it on,dropped the favourites,eased off,got dropped when the jumps started,got back on-repeat again.
If Cunego and Di Luca are in form they'll tear him to shreads.
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