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Vuelta á Espana 2016
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| Strydz |
Posted on 05-09-2016 16:43
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Team Leader
Posts: 5894
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He was well rested after the rest day yesterday 
Hells 500 Crew and 6 x Everester
Don Rd Launching Place
Melbourne Hill Rd Warrandyte
Colby Drive Belgrave South
William Rd The Patch
David Hill Rd Monbulk
Lakeside Drive Emerald
https://www.everesting.cc/hall-of-fame/ |
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| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 05-09-2016 17:53
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15830
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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just re watched yesterday . Great stuff. This is where Bertie is still best. He can surprise..
Powermeter wont help a lot on these situations.
Usually annoying Kirby was like mourning. Good day
Edited by Guido Mukk on 05-09-2016 18:04
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| Shonak |
Posted on 05-09-2016 18:05
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15615
Joined: 16-07-2013
PCM$: 350.00
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Avin Wargunnson wrote:
There are situation like extreme conditions or mass crashes where i can see the time limit not applied and it happened in the past, but riders completely ignoring the limit and just crusing to the finish as during the weekend ride? Lol, no...
Pretty much this all the way. When you don't give a shit about the race, you shouldn't stay in it anymore. Simples. Good to see that on this forum most people actually have the same opinion on that.
A GT with just 70 odd riders, why not, it'd be an anarchic edition worth remembering.
Also, the time limit discussion is not about SKY, I couldn't care less about sky. It's about the rules and the sport's lackluster handling of it.
"It’s a little bit scary when Contador attacks." - Tommy V
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| Strydz |
Posted on 05-09-2016 18:24
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Team Leader
Posts: 5894
Joined: 02-08-2011
PCM$: 1625.00
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Today's result really goes to prove how bad that decision was yesterday, the top 13 riders all took a vacation yesterday, then you have the example of Bennati who is a terrible climber yet suffered and managed to finish 19 minutes down yesterday and today still goes for it and naturally runs out of steam while he gets chased and passed by those riders who gave up yesterday. Hardly a fair contest in my opinion.
Hells 500 Crew and 6 x Everester
Don Rd Launching Place
Melbourne Hill Rd Warrandyte
Colby Drive Belgrave South
William Rd The Patch
David Hill Rd Monbulk
Lakeside Drive Emerald
https://www.everesting.cc/hall-of-fame/ |
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 22-11-2024 20:43
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| Guido Mukk |
Posted on 05-09-2016 20:34
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15830
Joined: 08-02-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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Miguel98 wrote:
That is possibly one of the cancerous sprints I've ever seen. jesus fuck, that was awful.
Old record mode:
this is what you get when you have Riis123 planning stages (no offence). You scare all sprinters away from GT. Yeaah Valverde has 21 possibilitys to win a stage...for me GT without sprinters just sucks as GT without mountain top finishes. |
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 06-09-2016 08:02
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3472
Joined: 03-01-2008
PCM$: 1348.00
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Guido Mukk wrote:
Miguel98 wrote:
That is possibly one of the cancerous sprints I've ever seen. jesus fuck, that was awful.
Old record mode:
this is what you get when you have Riis123 planning stages (no offence). You scare all sprinters away from GT. Yeaah Valverde has 21 possibilitys to win a stage...for me GT without sprinters just sucks as GT without mountain top finishes.
It says something when the Tour of Britain has a better sprint line up than the Vuelta  |
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| vismitananda |
Posted on 06-09-2016 08:19
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Domestique
Posts: 452
Joined: 23-02-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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for me GT without sprinters just sucks.
Well, I relly need a GT with out sprint stage/s. I find it boring.
-Pain is temporary, Quitting lasts forever-
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 06-09-2016 08:24
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3472
Joined: 03-01-2008
PCM$: 1348.00
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vismitananda wrote:
for me GT without sprinters just sucks.
Well, I relly need a GT with out sprint stage/s. I find it boring.
Cycling isn't simply about riding up hills. Sprinting at the end of a 200k stage takes just as much endurance, strength and skill then any other discipline and sprinters deserve at least 3/4 stages out of 21 to do their thing.
Besides, time trials are much more tedious then sprint stages but everyone is happy to keep them.
I'm sure it would be different if Spain had at least one semi-decent sprinter. But they don't. Who is the best current Spanish sprinter? |
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 06-09-2016 09:17
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 18187
Joined: 12-05-2012
PCM$: 0.00
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ringo182 wrote:
Guido Mukk wrote:
Miguel98 wrote:
That is possibly one of the cancerous sprints I've ever seen. jesus fuck, that was awful.
Old record mode:
this is what you get when you have Riis123 planning stages (no offence). You scare all sprinters away from GT. Yeaah Valverde has 21 possibilitys to win a stage...for me GT without sprinters just sucks as GT without mountain top finishes.
It says something when the Tour of Britain has a better sprint line up than the Vuelta
The ToB is growing itself excellently as the pre-Worlds race to go to for some final serious racing. Surprisingly tough but very managebale in comparision to not just a GT, but a GT with 22 summit finishes
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| Croatia14 |
Posted on 06-09-2016 09:30
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Directeur Sportif
Posts: 9099
Joined: 13-03-2013
PCM$: 2100.00
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ringo182 wrote:
It says something when the Tour of Britain has a better sprint line up than the Vuelta
Well it says nothing but that there is a sprinters WC ahead. Riding a GT before that would be just stupid...
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 06-09-2016 09:36
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3472
Joined: 03-01-2008
PCM$: 1348.00
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Croatia14 wrote:
ringo182 wrote:
It says something when the Tour of Britain has a better sprint line up than the Vuelta
Well it says nothing but that there is a sprinters WC ahead. Riding a GT before that would be just stupid...
If the Vuelta had proper sprinter stages they would do the first couple of weeks of the Vuelta and drop out, like they usually do. More prize money/prestige at the Vuelta.
ToB has attracted the sprinters this year because of the Vuelta' course. The Best sprinter at last years ToB was Viviani, and he was only there cause he riders for Sky. Griepel was there but didn't do anything despite the weak field. If the Vuelta has proper sprinters stages next year the big Sprinters will be back there. |
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| AbhishekLFC |
Posted on 06-09-2016 09:50
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Directeur Sportif
Posts: 11676
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Wildfire causes mass evacuation near Vuelta a España time trial start town https://trib.al/rwbQMia
Edited by AbhishekLFC on 06-09-2016 10:14
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 06-09-2016 09:54
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World Champion
Posts: 14563
Joined: 08-08-2011
PCM$: 9100.00
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Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 06-09-2016 10:06
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3472
Joined: 03-01-2008
PCM$: 1348.00
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So a shortened tt then. This Vuelta is falling into Quintana's lap
Granted he has ridden excellently but he has been helped by a weak Contador, weak Team Sky and no riders coming out of the left field to compete as usually happens at the Vuelta. |
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| Shonak |
Posted on 06-09-2016 12:09
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15615
Joined: 16-07-2013
PCM$: 350.00
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Like Croatia has said, there is the WC in Doha and it's later than usual, thus most sprinters need a different prep and schedule in these months. No a GT is not a viable option, because if they drop out, they are forbidden to race for the remainder of ongoing Grand Tour and they need the racing trainig rather now than 2 weeks earlier. This means no potential Tour of Britain, no classics. Classics are very important to race for a single-day event like WCs.
Sprinters always show up for the Vuelta on occassion but there is no huge importance to it since the season highlight for most of them is le Tour and the various small races a sponsor is interested in, eg belgian, french races.
The Vuelta has to take that into its calculation that most of the top sprinters just don't show up or may not bother at all. Even if they had suitable stages! Different to the GT riders mind you, who also have a reason to come here: Why? Because honestly what else is a GT rider to do this time off the year. Either pause & cash in at crits, or go Vuelta.
Also, it has been a long tradition by now that the Vuelta likes it punchy and I am the first to admit that Vuelta's stage design has been rather one-dimensional lately, but unsurprisingly guys like Degenkolb and Bouhanni have performed in stellar ways here. But what do you guys want, make stages just so that maybe Kittel or Cavendish show up. Cavendish hasn't done this race for 5 years, I'm sure neither party is missing each other, same goes for Kittelz.
Besides that, it is credible to allow for different sprinter types to get their stages. Not everybody is like Kittel or Cav. A man like Meersman who has so much speed after great climbing or especially Felline is a berserker. Those guys deserve to have chances too in a GT, but you need to make stages that lets them have chances. And not just one or two chances it needs to be a philosophy and the Vuelta has done well in that regard.
Both Giro and Tour are much more strict when it comes to their flat stages. If the top sprinter guys don't show up and regularly don't, than it's a win:win actually.. top sprinters get more suited races, Vuelta gets people who are hungry for wins, lesser known riders can sprint it out. Well, win win for all except for people who only judge a winner by their name.
ringo182 wrote:
I'm sure it would be different if Spain had at least one semi-decent sprinter. But they don't. Who is the best current Spanish sprinter?
Oh boy, same old story... 
"It’s a little bit scary when Contador attacks." - Tommy V
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 06-09-2016 12:51
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World Champion
Posts: 14563
Joined: 08-08-2011
PCM$: 9100.00
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Best Spanish sprinter right now? Probably still Freire even though he retired a while ago?
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 06-09-2016 13:11
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3472
Joined: 03-01-2008
PCM$: 1348.00
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Shonak wrote:
ringo182 wrote:
I'm sure it would be different if Spain had at least one semi-decent sprinter. But they don't. Who is the best current Spanish sprinter?
Oh boy, same old story...
What story is that? It's a perfectly valid point and question.
Spain don't have any decent sprinters. Do you deny that statement? |
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| Riis123 |
Posted on 06-09-2016 13:16
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 5075
Joined: 07-08-2008
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There are plenty of sprint stages this Vuelta - Meersman x2, Van Genechten, Drucker and there are 2 completely flat stages left. Thats 7 including the stage Keuk won in Bilbao. Whats the problem? 7 stages to contest for the sprinters seem very fair in the span of 21 days. |
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| Shonak |
Posted on 06-09-2016 13:27
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 15615
Joined: 16-07-2013
PCM$: 350.00
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ringo182 wrote:
Shonak wrote:
ringo182 wrote:
I'm sure it would be different if Spain had at least one semi-decent sprinter. But they don't. Who is the best current Spanish sprinter?
Oh boy, same old story...
What story is that? It's a perfectly valid point and question.
Spain don't have any decent sprinters. Do you deny that statement?
The continuous narrative push that southern european race organizations (spanish, italian) just care and favor their own riders (up to illegal means and setting "extra rules" for them), whilst penaziling foreign riders, most promiment recent example Porte's Giro 2015. It's mostly present on the facebook sites of VeloNews, cyclingnews, but there have also been enough statements of this sorts on daily.
I also think like Riis there were enough sprint stages here. It's not Vuelta's fault that top level sprinters are prepping for WC by doing smaller races. Nor it's the sprinters' fault, they just want the best prep.
"It’s a little bit scary when Contador attacks." - Tommy V
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 06-09-2016 13:36
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3472
Joined: 03-01-2008
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Riis123 wrote:
There are plenty of sprint stages this Vuelta - Meersman x2, Van Genechten, Drucker and there are 2 completely flat stages left. Thats 7 including the stage Keuk won in Bilbao. Whats the problem? 7 stages to contest for the sprinters seem very fair in the span of 21 days.
Possibly. But the fact that not a single top tier sprinter is present speaks for itself. In the past the big names have started and raced for a couple of weeks before dropping out for the WC. I know that the organisers possibly don't want riders dropping out, but surely they'd prefer two weeks of top sprinters clashing than 3 weeks of mediocrity.
I'm sure sprinters would prefer to prep for the Worlds in sunny Spain than wet and cold Britain or elsewhere.
They could include a couple of sprinter stages early on to attract the big name sprinters. How does it help the Vuelta if the big Sprint showdown in the race is Meersman Vs Arndt? No wonder the flat stages are crap if thats the level of fast men taking part.
As to Shonak's post, I wasn't aware of any such narrative. I was simply stating that if Spain had a decent sprinter the organisers would at least make an attempt to have a couple of stages to suit sprinters. |
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![imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg](https://imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg)
