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PCMdaily DB Stat Discussion
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 26-04-2015 18:07
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 18168
Joined: 12-05-2012
PCM$: 0.00
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Personally i'd drop Purito to 81 rather than raising Valverde to 83. Valv was by far the best across the week yet again, the Ardennes are his b*tch these last couple of years. Certainly i wouldn't drop Gerrans or Martin HL stat seeing as they both had extenuating circumstances, but i guess you could drop some of the supporting stats like FL or something. Same for Gilbert but don't drop anything as he showed what he had in AGR before falling down.
Betancur for a drop, we've seen less than nothing since Paris-Nice last year and he doesn't look like delivering a result any time soon either. You could argue for drops to some of the GC guys like Quintana and Contador and Froome but this is where PCM lacks as they can do different "hills" in game. I'd drop Ulissi as well. Vanendert is also on the edge of a drop, he's been not great this season.
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 26-04-2015 18:25
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Sprinter
Posts: 1961
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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I'm more inclined to drop Purito to 81 and keep Valverde at 82 as well. As Manx said he's been the best over the three races and as is often the case the difference between the riders at the Ardennes is very minimal anyway. |
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| Omloop |
Posted on 26-04-2015 18:35
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Domestique
Posts: 433
Joined: 08-01-2014
PCM$: 200.00
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What hill stat does Kwiatek have? Allthough he won Amstel(struggled on the climb) he hasn't been magnificent on the hills this year. |
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| TankNL |
Posted on 26-04-2015 18:38
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Domestique
Posts: 440
Joined: 19-03-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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Tafiolmo wrote:
I'm more inclined to drop Purito to 81 and keep Valverde at 82 as well. As Manx said he's been the best over the three races and as is often the case the difference between the riders at the Ardennes is very minimal anyway.
remember, Purito still has a number of good results this year in the hills;
- stage 4 Tirenno (3th)
- stage 3 Pais Vasco (1st)
- stage 4 Pais Vasco (1st)
- La Flèche Wallonne (4th)
- Liège - Bastogne - Liège (3th)
I think he still is one of the strongest riders, so for a database, he should be 1 of the top contenders for the Hilly classics. |
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 29-09-2024 20:23
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 26-04-2015 18:43
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 18168
Joined: 12-05-2012
PCM$: 0.00
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@Tank - 81 would still make him joint 2nd in HL stat and still one of the Top3/5 Ardennes riders in the game
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 26-04-2015 20:06
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Sprinter
Posts: 1961
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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At the moment this is what I'm going with (even though a lot of these riders didn't ride the Ardennes) Also the hill stat is used often in the big tours so no major GC guy should have a hill stat below 77 imo. Also worth bearing in mind, the LBL I was once told on here also uses the mtn stat a bit which is why the big GC guys can contest it. Other guys like Ulissi are great hill climbers but have lower stamina etc. Also I know some of the riders below didn't do that well like Mollema but hill stat is also not just about the Ardennes races.
Alejandro Valverde 82
Joaquim Rodriguez 81
Philippe Gilbert 81 (only really at AG)
Dan Martin 81 (crashed at FW and LBL)
Michal Kwiatkowski 81
Daniel Moreno 80
Simon Gerrans 80 (coming back to fitness)
Julian Alaphilippe 80
Giampaolo Caruso 79
Alberto Contador 79
Vincenzo Nibali 79
Rui Costa 79
Diego Ulissi 79
Domenico Pozzovivo 78
Roman Kreuziger 78
Richie Porte 78
Sergio Henao 78
Roman Bardet 78
Bauke Mollema 78
Jakob Fuglsang 78
Jelle Vanendert 78
Nairo Quintana 78
Rigoberto Uran 78
Tom-Velte Slagter 78
Michael Albasini 78
Enrico Gasparotto 78/77
Have a whole load of other guys on 77
(no idea what to give him now)
Carlos Betancur ? |
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| MartijnVDD |
Posted on 26-04-2015 20:23
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Breakaway Specialist
Posts: 801
Joined: 26-06-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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You don't drop Dan Martin because of his crash, as is right, but you do drop Vanendert?
I'm curious about Meintjes btw.
Edited by MartijnVDD on 26-04-2015 20:24
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 26-04-2015 20:34
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Sprinter
Posts: 1961
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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MartijnVDD wrote:
You don't drop Dan Martin because of his crash, as is right, but you do drop Vanendert?
I'm curious about Meintjes btw.
Well Vanendert finished 34th at Amstel and 22nd at LBL, or are you saying that his crash at FW affected him at LBL like it did with Gilbert? But even then his low placing at AG was not great, as he's done well at that race before.
Meintjes finshed 11th at LBL and didn't race the other two, so it's kind of difficult. I think he's at 77 hill but with a good mtn stat he could finish high in the game as well.
Edited by Tafiolmo on 26-04-2015 20:34
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| gotlandrules |
Posted on 26-04-2015 20:43
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1358
Joined: 07-05-2007
PCM$: 200.00
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Ulissi lower then 79 IMO... |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 26-04-2015 20:48
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Sprinter
Posts: 1961
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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gotlandrules wrote:
Ulissi lower then 79 IMO...
His 79 is based on lesser-classics and stage races, something he's very strong at.
His stamina for races like AG and LBL is lower than most of the other hill guys, so that's his big Achilles heel in the more endurance races. |
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| AiZaK |
Posted on 26-04-2015 21:48
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1190
Joined: 13-04-2008
PCM$: 200.00
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In my opinion Betancur 77 |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 26-04-2015 22:11
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Sprinter
Posts: 1961
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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AiZaK wrote:
In my opinion Betancur 77
Are you his agent? |
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| sgdanny |
Posted on 26-04-2015 22:16
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3591
Joined: 18-03-2014
PCM$: 200.00
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Drastic decreases shouldn't happen after the results after 3 races  Betancur at least 79 Allaphillipe on 80 is too high, considering he could just do well here, but fail in making continuous results in the future
Cobbles season us over and we can see back at that as a whole, but hilly stats shouldn't be changed much after this few races
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| TheManxMissile |
Posted on 26-04-2015 22:20
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 18168
Joined: 12-05-2012
PCM$: 0.00
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Carlos has only Top50'd two days this year, and only two Top30's since Paris-Nice last year. That's OVER a year without a Top30... I don't know about you but that says decrease to me...
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 26-04-2015 22:24
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Sprinter
Posts: 1961
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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sgdanny wrote:
Drastic decreases shouldn't happen after the results after 3 races Betancur at least 79 Allaphillipe on 80 is too high, considering he could just do well here, but fail in making continuous results in the future
Cobbles season us over and we can see back at that as a whole, but hilly stats shouldn't be changed much after this few races
But the Ardennes are the truest 'hill stat' with 'stamina stat' around, the only other race that is a guide is Lombardia and the WC (if it's a hilly circuit) but that comes at the end of the season. So these three races are kind of important for that.
I don't think Alaphilippe is too high, he challenged for victory and is similar to Valverde and Gerrans in that he has a fast finish as well. Admittedly we don't know if he would've finished so high if Gerrans, Gilbert and Martin had been at their best. |
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| AiZaK |
Posted on 26-04-2015 23:07
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Protected Rider
Posts: 1190
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Betancur is a very good rider but only sometimes, only when he wants. Buts he never wants to run.
If you give him 79, he will be a very good Liege, Amstel, WC,... and it's not true
Edited by AiZaK on 26-04-2015 23:08
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| Paul23 |
Posted on 26-04-2015 23:11
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4411
Joined: 10-08-2011
PCM$: 400.00
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AiZaK wrote:
Betancur is a very good rider but only sometimes, only when he wants. But he never wants to run.
If you give him 79, he will be a very good Liege, Amstel, WC,... and it's not true
I would rather give Carlos 75 HI
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| fidjim2013 |
Posted on 27-04-2015 03:19
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 348
Joined: 20-11-2013
PCM$: 300.00
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Paul23 wrote:
AiZaK wrote:
Betancur is a very good rider but only sometimes, only when he wants. But he never wants to run.
If you give him 79, he will be a very good Liege, Amstel, WC,... and it's not true
I would rather give Carlos 75 HI
It won't make sense to give him 75 its better 77 |
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| fidjim2013 |
Posted on 27-04-2015 04:58
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 348
Joined: 20-11-2013
PCM$: 300.00
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Julian alaphilippe is quite good on hills but I really questing myself about his sprint stat because he got beat 2 times by valverde during sprint in those classics |
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| Paul23 |
Posted on 27-04-2015 04:59
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 4411
Joined: 10-08-2011
PCM$: 400.00
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fidjim2013 wrote:
Paul23 wrote:
AiZaK wrote:
Betancur is a very good rider but only sometimes, only when he wants. But he never wants to run.
If you give him 79, he will be a very good Liege, Amstel, WC,... and it's not true
I would rather give Carlos 75 HI
It won't make sense to give him 75 its better 77
Why wouldn't it make sense? Matthews will get 77 or 78...Where was Betancur at AGR or at FW or at LBL...right! He got dropped.
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