baseballlover312 wrote:
And Atlantius I really don't think you looked into what I was saying. I was not talking about the bible or religion in that sense.
I know the post turned in to more of a general post a bout how I view religion and why I'm not religious.
And I'm not talking about endangered species or that. I was talking about how there happen to be elements existing, and that they just happens to make things that made Earth able to contain life forms which are also things made out of things that exist.
I used the endangered animals as an example because you said "everything on Earth just works so perfectly". There's plenty of examples to that not being the case.
And like I said before,I don't think you actually looked into what I said. You took it realistically and only for what it is as humans always do. And maybe that's partly my fault because I couldn't explain it well because I really don't understand it either, and you can't read my raw thoughts.
I did have a bit of trouble figuring out exactly what you meant, hence the very general post on my part.
My human brain just can't process it all. it's overwhelming. But I feel like I have to go deeper into this all for myself. I am not content just living like that. Ignorance may be bliss for you on this, but not for me.
That gets me to what I tried to say when setting out originally. For me science makes more sense then the concept of God. Yes we don't understand everything, but for me the concept of a creating God is even more weird and mindblowing than the fact that the Universe is very big and complex and I'm merely one animal on one planet. Why should I be able to understand every little thing?
Having an invisible, undocumenteable force pulling all the strings and setting rules for micromanaging how people should live their lives (and then not telling people to adjust those rules when they stop living in the desert).
There is plenty of things that science can't answer. As I said before I don't care if people fill the blank spots with "God", but for me it's just something we doesn't know yet and a place for imagination to roam free. Our civilization is build on things we didn't know 500 years ago. Things the Church said we shouldn't worry about because it was the acts of God.
For me the notion of God is ignorance as it disencourages chasing an answer to these questions.
Ever since human existence most if not all creatures extinctions and endangera have been cause of humans. Moas, Haast Eagles, Tasmanian Tigers, Tigers, Other African Creatures, sea cretures, etc. I will explain if you want.
Most, but not all. Occasionally evolution just fucks up as in the case of the Panda's who at some point collectively have decided to change to a diet their organism can't process effectively.
History before humans became a force to reckon (which is the main part of Earth history) has plenty of examples like that.
Generally I believe we have an obligation to protect endangered species, but that is mainly because at this point in time we are in 99,999 % of the cases the people making the species endangered.
Also the reason that animals go extinct when we move into their environment in general (except hunted down ones) is because their habitat is destroyed. However this in not why they go extinct, the reason they go extinct is they cannot adapt to a new environment or move off to a similar one.
What I'm not saying is that that's the sort of things animals should be able to do, obviously they can't but then the success stories of this process are animals like the pigeon which now thrive in cities as they used to in woods and fields. So humans are not the sole cause of evolution, and maybe now it is a trend that only the adaptable animals will survive, so the only things left will be habitat chaemelions like, ultimately, humans.
Also the reason that animals go extinct when we move into their environment in general (except hunted down ones) is because their habitat is destroyed. However this in not why they go extinct, the reason they go extinct is they cannot adapt to a new environment or move off to a similar one.
What I'm not saying is that that's the sort of things animals should be able to do, obviously they can't but then the success stories of this process are animals like the pigeon which now thrive in cities as they used to in woods and fields.
I would agree if it wasn't because humans are accelerating the destruction of habitats. Evolution takes time and when we remove habitats with force to replace it with concretes (putting it harshly I know) the animals just has no chance to adapt. The pigeons are lucky because of all the food we throw around in the cities ultimately making big city plaza's better for them than fields and meadows seen over the whole year.
So humans are not the sole cause of evolution, and maybe now it is a trend that only the adaptable animals will survive, so the only things left will be habitat chaemelions like, ultimately, humans.
Which ultimately would result in a broken ecosystem resulting in dying lakes and forests and ultimately the end of life on earth and thus no humans either.
We need to find some sort of balance, where the planet is able to sustain the life we lead. We can't continue using the planet in the manner we do at the moment if we want the planet to be inhabited by humans in 10.000 years.
baseballlover312 wrote:
I know that starting a religous war but I need to speak about this.
Not many people believe in a God anymore or anything like that, and I always have.It's the way I was raised. Perhaps that was close minded but it made sense as a kid.
Recently I have been thinking that maybe I was wrong, but then I thought, how was the world made?
Now people say the Big Bang, but then I think, how? When people picture the big bang, they picture a speck in darkness. But no. The theory says that this was the only thing existing. But yet, how? How was there nothingness? How can humans understand that in it's reality.
How did everything just happen for no reason. In fact, how do reasons even be?
Adam and Eve may have not happened but there is the blatant fact that existence is a thing. What is isness, huh? Everything just is according to Atheists but what is existence anyone. No way there is nothing more. People say believers are small minded but I swear it's the other way around. And not only that, but how everything on Earth just works so perfectly.
Maybe I have turned away from clear cut organized religion, because how can people know that much. And I don't have much understanding of anything. If there is a God, or something like it, as I do believe, what is it really or anything? No way of knowing.
But no matter how much I think about everything I can't conceive that everything just is because it is and that's how it is.
Feel free to comment. I know this will spawn hate but this has been on my mind, and is very hard to put into words, so I wanted to put it out there.
Interesting questions that most or many of us have probably been through at some point. Believe (!) it or not, I was choir boy once.
Then, as you grow up, you develop a critical mind and a sense of priorities.
How was the world created ? It's figured out quite well how Earth was created ~4.6 billion years ago, how life appeared on Earth 3.8 to 3.5 billion years ago.
If you mean World as the big picture, aka the whole Universe, it gives me headaches too. The thing I had more troubles to figure out is that it was the commencement of time.
Apparently the whole universe was packed in as a sphere in an almost perfectly balanced state, and all of a sudden there was no more balance and everything blew. Why the balance broke is unknown (at least as far as I know), the rest is science.
To come back with the "sense of priority" I mentioned earlier, there's so much to think about, down here, and to do, that finding an answer is not really a priority for me. Plus I'm probably clever enough to know I'm not the one who'll figure it out, so I'll leave it to people with a clue.
Then, what do we know of God or gods ? It's an idea, a concept, or something like that that Man came up with when it started developing shamanism (pre-religious rituals). It was a convenient answer to every question that couldn't be figured out.
For the pleasure of thinking, let's admit there'd be a God out there. How would we know ? I can hardly believe that it showed up to some special people a dozen or hundreds of times in history. None of those people who've seen or heard God has been able to come up with an absolute proof.
So, if there's a God or some sort of supreme being above us :
1) in the past and present state of knowledge : we cannot tell
2) we should opt for the most probable option : there's none
3) we should have other priorities anyway, and not waste time on he/she/it
4) we should by no way harm other people or creatures in the name of something that most likely does not exist
We have the following discussion in the Netherlands. Some of you might already have heard of Sinterklaas. For those who haven't, he's a sort of equivalent of Santa. He has these helpers, called Zwarte Pieten. They have been in the Dutch culture for 200 years or so. However, suddenly, 21(!) activists in Amsterdam have now called it racist. The story goes, that they are black because of the soot. What do you think, is it racist anyway? The UN, believe it or not, have now decided to start an investigation on it. On the other hand, it could become heritage as well. This world is really weird
So, say it is racist and it should be banned/changed, how can we tell the children of 2-7 who still believe he's real. That would have a big impact on them for sure. And I don't know why they say they are just like slaves, they are just very nice guys
True, in fact the children love them more than Sinterklaas, considering every little kid dresses up as one and the Pieten always give the candy and gifts
In Estonia, we just had out local elections and some people are thinking that retired people shouldn't be allowed to vote. The problem is that most of them vote for 'Keskerakond'. That party is only popular with old people and russians. But because rest of people are divided between 3 parties, 'Keskerakond' takes a lot of election wins. The problem is that they are being elected for their promises (higher pension etc) that they can't do in local governments.
I'm inclined to agree a little. Considering what pensioners say on the news (we get a lot of interviews on the streets just before elections, hate that they show it on the news, opinion of some random dude is not news) they have little interest in anything but pension (increase pension? but then we can't repair the roads? sure).
Now an investigator wants to abolish our entire Sinterklaas-idea. According to him, it's racist. A: Zwarte Piet is black thanks to the soot. B: Saint Nicholas actually helped former young (black) child slaves to freedom. Now where's the racism?
Also the reason that animals go extinct when we move into their environment in general (except hunted down ones) is because their habitat is destroyed. However this in not why they go extinct, the reason they go extinct is they cannot adapt to a new environment or move off to a similar one.
What I'm not saying is that that's the sort of things animals should be able to do, obviously they can't but then the success stories of this process are animals like the pigeon which now thrive in cities as they used to in woods and fields.
I would agree if it wasn't because humans are accelerating the destruction of habitats. Evolution takes time and when we remove habitats with force to replace it with concretes (putting it harshly I know) the animals just has no chance to adapt. The pigeons are lucky because of all the food we throw around in the cities ultimately making big city plaza's better for them than fields and meadows seen over the whole year.
So humans are not the sole cause of extinction, and maybe now it is a trend that only the adaptable animals will survive, so the only things left will be habitat chaemelions like, ultimately, humans.
Which ultimately would result in a broken ecosystem resulting in dying lakes and forests and ultimately the end of life on earth and thus no humans either.
We need to find some sort of balance, where the planet is able to sustain the life we lead. We can't continue using the planet in the manner we do at the moment if we want the planet to be inhabited by humans in 10.000 years.
Firstly I tend to agree with you, humans are definitely accelerating climate change destroying habitats etc etc. it is also true that if the only animals that survive are adaptable then almost all non sustained habitats will die off. This may not seem great, but there will probably be an upside, new environments will take over,the world won't become a barren wasteland like those disaster things think, if animals can evolve so can plants and tolerate new conditions, not all of them will, but hopefully some will. Maybe it is a good thing that what was there is being destroyed and we are making way for the new.
^^ don't really believe this I just like arguing.
Sorry it's a bit late
Selwink wrote:
We have the following discussion in the Netherlands. Some of you might already have heard of Sinterklaas. For those who haven't, he's a sort of equivalent of Santa. He has these helpers, called Zwarte Pieten. They have been in the Dutch culture for 200 years or so. However, suddenly, 21(!) activists in Amsterdam have now called it racist. The story goes, that they are black because of the soot. What do you think, is it racist anyway? The UN, believe it or not, have now decided to start an investigation on it. On the other hand, it could become heritage as well. This world is really weird
why are people so stupid
seriously all this complaining about fictional stuff being racist.
Selwink wrote:
We have the following discussion in the Netherlands. Some of you might already have heard of Sinterklaas. For those who haven't, he's a sort of equivalent of Santa. He has these helpers, called Zwarte Pieten. They have been in the Dutch culture for 200 years or so. However, suddenly, 21(!) activists in Amsterdam have now called it racist. The story goes, that they are black because of the soot. What do you think, is it racist anyway? The UN, believe it or not, have now decided to start an investigation on it. On the other hand, it could become heritage as well. This world is really weird
why are people so stupid
seriously all this complaining about fictional stuff being racist.
Yup, and even Food now has to be politically correct.
Selwink wrote:
We have the following discussion in the Netherlands. Some of you might already have heard of Sinterklaas. For those who haven't, he's a sort of equivalent of Santa. He has these helpers, called Zwarte Pieten. They have been in the Dutch culture for 200 years or so. However, suddenly, 21(!) activists in Amsterdam have now called it racist. The story goes, that they are black because of the soot. What do you think, is it racist anyway? The UN, believe it or not, have now decided to start an investigation on it. On the other hand, it could become heritage as well. This world is really weird
why are people so stupid
seriously all this complaining about fictional stuff being racist.
Yup, and even Food now has to be politically correct.
Yup, we used to have things called Negerzoenen (translated Nigger kisses), name changed. Nobody even thougt of racism there. Racism is treating other races worse. I don't see how this is racist then. Just like Zwarte Piet...
Selwink wrote:
We have the following discussion in the Netherlands. Some of you might already have heard of Sinterklaas. For those who haven't, he's a sort of equivalent of Santa. He has these helpers, called Zwarte Pieten. They have been in the Dutch culture for 200 years or so. However, suddenly, 21(!) activists in Amsterdam have now called it racist. The story goes, that they are black because of the soot. What do you think, is it racist anyway? The UN, believe it or not, have now decided to start an investigation on it. On the other hand, it could become heritage as well. This world is really weird
why are people so stupid
seriously all this complaining about fictional stuff being racist.
Yup, and even Food now has to be politically correct.
Yup, we used to have things called Negerzoenen (translated Nigger kisses), name changed. Nobody even thougt of racism there. Racism is treating other races worse. I don't see how this is racist then. Just like Zwarte Piet...
That was actually just what i meant. Or in Germany they have "zigeunerschnitzel" (literally gypsie schnitzel), but apparently it's racist now, so just doesn't exist anymore. People don't want the Name, because it's racist, and nobody thought of a new Name, so nobody eats it anymore, because there's no Name for it.
Sorry but forget food, the dumbest as usual comes from the USA. Washington Redskins (as seems to happen every year) called racist and looked into changing their name away from Redskins. (yes i do know the history and arguments of both sides, but christ it's pointless)
But in this world of political correctness and lawsuits, it is an inevitable consequence that someone will be offended and request changes. Sometimes it is a good thing to stop with certain traditions and that has to be accepted. And yes sometimes it really is dumb, but hey live with it and play GTA where you can shoot hookers, say the N-word then get high on meth
![imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg](https://imgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpg)
