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Other Races 2010
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| issoisso |
Posted on 18-04-2010 17:13
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Tour de France Champion
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SportingNonsense wrote:
Tell me, how many Grand Tour stages have they won?
I believe the answer is 2, and those were both Furlan's, and both back in 2002.
So yes, weak.
In other words, Cavendish was beaten in 2 out of 3 sprints this season by even worse sprinters, because they have zero GT stages between them 
Look at Modolo. 4th at Milano San Remo? Pfff, he sucks. I mean he's never won a Giro stage 
Also by wour own logic: since Greipel has 5 stages from just 2 GTs, one of them while working for another sprinter even, then he's a top sprinter 
SportingNonsense wrote:
issoisso wrote:
SportingNonsense wrote:
Greipel's big tests to establish himself as a major sprinter, rather than one largely succesful in the smaller races, are still to come.
4 stage wins and points jersey at the Vuelta ring a bell?
You already know my thoughts on them, and why I therefore think the upcoming Giro will be a more accurate test.
No, I don't. Please do explain.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 18-04-2010 17:21
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issoisso wrote:
SportingNonsense wrote:
Tell me, how many Grand Tour stages have they won?
I believe the answer is 2, and those were both Furlan's, and both back in 2002.
So yes, weak.
In other words, Cavendish was beaten in 2 out of 3 sprints this season by even worse sprinters, because they have zero GT stages between them
Look at Modolo. 4th at Milano San Remo? Pfff, he sucks. I mean he's never won a Giro stage
Also by wour own logic: since Greipel has 5 stages from just 2 GTs, one of them while working for another sprinter even, then he's a top sprinter
I couldnt give a damn about who beats an out of form Cavendish in meaningless races. The fact that you bring those sort of races up though, shows why you rate Greipel so much.
Modolo? Sure he has potential, and MSR was a great result. But he is still an inexperienced neopro whose best result in a bunch sprint is 3rd.
And funny how you mention the Giro stage that Cavendish let him win
issoisso wrote:
SportingNonsense wrote:
issoisso wrote:
SportingNonsense wrote:
Greipel's big tests to establish himself as a major sprinter, rather than one largely succesful in the smaller races, are still to come.
4 stage wins and points jersey at the Vuelta ring a bell?
You already know my thoughts on them, and why I therefore think the upcoming Giro will be a more accurate test.
No, I don't. Please do explain.
Yes you do, as we already discussed/debated it, about a month ago.
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If Greipel is the best sprinter in the Giro, with I assume strong competition from the likes of Petacchi, then yes he can make a very strong claim to be the #2 sprinter in the world. But he won't be comparable to Cavendish until they are on separate teams, as it does not look likely that they will ride many, if any, races together - let alone being allowed by the team to then race against each other in them.
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| issoisso |
Posted on 18-04-2010 17:28
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Tour de France Champion
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SportingNonsense wrote:
I couldnt give a damn about who beats an out of form Cavendish in meaningless races. The fact that you bring those sort of races up though, shows why you rate Greipel so much.
Actually, you brought up the quality of opposition in smaller races. I just took your logic and ran with it
SportingNonsense wrote:
Modolo? Sure he has potential, and MSR was a great result. But he is still an inexperienced neopro whose best result in a bunch sprint is 3rd.
And funny how you mention the Giro stage that Cavendish let him win
So the fact that he comprehensively beat all the other sprinters behind Cavendish, even though he went from a looooooong way out, is irrelevant?
SportingNonsense wrote:
Yes you do, as we already discussed/debated it, about a month ago.
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I fully believe we did. But you surely understand that I can't remember every conversation I have. If you feel it's relevant to the discussion, please do make your points known here. Or link to them.
SportingNonsense wrote:
If Greipel is the best sprinter in the Giro, with I assume strong competition from the likes of Petacchi, then yes he can make a very strong claim to be the #2 sprinter in the world. But he won't be comparable to Cavendish until they are on separate teams, as it does not look likely that they will ride many, if any, races together - let alone being allowed by the team to then race against each other in them.
Please stop trying to make this Greipel vs Cavendish. You disputed that Greipel is an impressive top sprinter.
Stick to the topic and don't run away. Thank you
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| wackojackohighcliffe |
Posted on 18-04-2010 17:33
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Grand Tour Champion
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issoisso wrote:
I fully believe we did. But you surely understand that I can't remember every conversation I have.
You have a surprisingly good knack for it
To be honest, greipel is a top quality sprinter but cavendish vs greipel in real money i wait to see
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| issoisso |
Posted on 18-04-2010 17:36
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
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wackojackohighcliffe wrote:
issoisso wrote:
I fully believe we did. But you surely understand that I can't remember every conversation I have.
You have a surprisingly good knack for it
I'll admit I have a knack for remembering things that don't matter at all. When it's important I can never seem to remember 
wackojackohighcliffe wrote:
To be honest, greipel is a top quality sprinter but cavendish vs greipel in real money i wait to see
I don't think there's much doubt Greipel's not at Cavendish's level.
As with anything, I could be dead wrong, of course.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 26-11-2024 11:22
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| SportingNonsense |
Posted on 18-04-2010 17:41
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issoisso wrote:
SportingNonsense wrote:
I couldnt give a damn about who beats an out of form Cavendish in meaningless races. The fact that you bring those sort of races up though, shows why you rate Greipel so much.
Actually, you brought up the quality of opposition in smaller races. I just took your logic and ran with it
I brought up the quality of opposition, because you felt his Turkish wins were impressive. That logic does not apply to the Cavendish races, since at no point did I claim I was impressed by Cavendish in them
issoisso wrote:
SportingNonsense wrote:
If Greipel is the best sprinter in the Giro, with I assume strong competition from the likes of Petacchi, then yes he can make a very strong claim to be the #2 sprinter in the world. But he won't be comparable to Cavendish until they are on separate teams, as it does not look likely that they will ride many, if any, races together - let alone being allowed by the team to then race against each other in them.
Please stop trying to make this Greipel vs Cavendish. You disputed that Greipel is an impressive top sprinter.
Stick to the topic and don't run away. Thank you
You are the one who brought Cavendish into this discussion
But I repeat
"If Greipel is the best sprinter in the Giro, with I assume strong competition from the likes of Petacchi, then yes he can make a very strong claim to be the #2 sprinter in the world."
If this happens, I will happily accept that he is a top sprinter.
I still wont like him though
(And Im going out now, just so you dont accuse me of running away when I dont respond to your next response )
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| issoisso |
Posted on 18-04-2010 17:46
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
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SportingNonsense wrote:
I brought up the quality of opposition, because you felt his Turkish wins were impressive. That logic does not apply to the Cavendish races, since at no point did I claim I was impressed by Cavendish in them
So I can't mention something because you didn't mention it first, not even if I'm using your own logic? Eh?
SportingNonsense wrote:
You are the one who brought Cavendish into this discussion
But I repeat
"If Greipel is the best sprinter in the Giro, with I assume strong competition from the likes of Petacchi, then yes he can make a very strong claim to be the #2 sprinter in the world."
If this happens, I will happily accept that he is a top sprinter.
You still haven't said anything to support your assertion he isn't a top sprinter, which is the entire point of the discussion here
SportingNonsense wrote:
I still wont like him though
(And Im going out now, just so you dont accuse me of running away when I dont respond to your next response )
Hah! running away! running away!
Edited by issoisso on 18-04-2010 17:49
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| wackojackohighcliffe |
Posted on 18-04-2010 17:47
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Grand Tour Champion
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issoisso wrote:
wackojackohighcliffe wrote:
To be honest, greipel is a top quality sprinter but cavendish vs greipel in real money i wait to see
I don't think there's much doubt Greipel's not at Cavendish's level.
As with anything, I could be dead wrong, of course.
I just want to see what happens when they actually end up racing each other. hopefully this talk will lead to something
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| doddy13 |
Posted on 18-04-2010 17:50
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7891
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In all fairness, there was similar talk about Ciolek in 2008.
There's no point slapping a schleck - Sean Kelly on "Who needs a slap"
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| issoisso |
Posted on 18-04-2010 17:57
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
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doddy13 wrote:
In all fairness, there was similar talk about Ciolek in 2008.
Not at this level. Ciolek wasn't having anywhere near these results.
In all fairness, Ciolek is at a team that's stuck in the stone age in terms of methods, doesn't give a crap about its riders and should be euthanized at the end of the season for the good of all involved.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| doddy13 |
Posted on 18-04-2010 18:08
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Grand Tour Champion
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issoisso wrote:
doddy13 wrote:
In all fairness, there was similar talk about Ciolek in 2008.
Not at this level. Ciolek wasn't having anywhere near these results.
In all fairness, Ciolek is at a team that's stuck in the stone age in terms of methods, doesn't give a crap about its riders and should be euthanized at the end of the season for the good of all involved.
but it's milk...
There's no point slapping a schleck - Sean Kelly on "Who needs a slap"
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| issoisso |
Posted on 18-04-2010 18:15
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 22918
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doddy13 wrote:
issoisso wrote:
doddy13 wrote:
In all fairness, there was similar talk about Ciolek in 2008.
Not at this level. Ciolek wasn't having anywhere near these results.
In all fairness, Ciolek is at a team that's stuck in the stone age in terms of methods, doesn't give a crap about its riders and should be euthanized at the end of the season for the good of all involved.
but it's milk...
So the fact that they suck should come as no surprise
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified
"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
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| wackojackohighcliffe |
Posted on 18-04-2010 19:04
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Grand Tour Champion
Posts: 7681
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anyone who goes about sucking milk needs their head checked
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| Wilier |
Posted on 20-04-2010 16:07
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Grand Tour Specialist
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Vino was just faster than Garzelli to win the first stage of the Giro del Trentino and take the first leader's jersey.
Giro del Trentino, Stage 1 (I.T.T. 12.5km)
1. Alexandre Vinokourov (Astana) KAZ
2. Stefano Garzelli (Acqua & Sapone) ITA s.t.
3. Matteo Montaguti (De Rosa - Stac Plastic) ITA 18"
Edited by Wilier on 20-04-2010 16:09
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| markene2 |
Posted on 20-04-2010 16:28
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Domestique
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Actualy he won by 16 seconds
1 Alexandre Vinokourov - Astana
2 Stefano Garzelli - Acqua & Sapone 0.16
3 Matteo Montagurti - De Rosa Stac Plastic 0.18
4 Michele Scarponi - Androni Diquigiovanni 0.23
Venga Vino
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| Wilier |
Posted on 20-04-2010 16:30
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markene2 wrote:
Actualy he won by 16 seconds
1 Alexandre Vinokourov - Astana
2 Stefano Garzelli - Acqua & Sapone 0.16
3 Matteo Montagurti - De Rosa Stac Plastic 0.18
4 Michele Scarponi - Androni Diquigiovanni 0.23
You're right. Saw it on CQ ranking, but they changed it now. |
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| roturn |
Posted on 20-04-2010 17:02
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8 Riccardo Ricco (Ceramica Flaminia) 0:30
13 Ivan Basso (Liquigas) 0:34
All my favorites together....not. |
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| Il Grillo |
Posted on 21-04-2010 14:51
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Domestique
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Trentino 2nd stage
1.Ricco
2.Vinokourov
3.Basso |
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| SotD |
Posted on 21-04-2010 14:58
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World Champion
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Decent peloton
Atleast if that was a top 3 of a race 3-4 years ago
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| Ozzy |
Posted on 21-04-2010 14:59
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Domestique
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Il Grillo wrote:
Trentino 2nd stage
1.Ricco
2.Vinokourov
3.Basso
1.Dope
2.Dope
3.Dope
Nice! |
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