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News in August
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| Riis123 |
Posted on 02-08-2016 23:36
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However, there are always positives; keep on expanding and it becomes even more meaningless and less prestigious. Maybe that's Cookson hidden agenda after all, apart from getting the €€€€€€ out of Arabia, obviously, which isn't that much of a hidden agendaafter all |
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| Gustavovskiy |
Posted on 02-08-2016 23:40
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Waghlon wrote:
Strydz wrote:
How is it possible to escape a ban if you've missed 3 tests in 12 months
Because due to the ruling, she's only missed two now.
Didn't get to that conclusion, tbh, thanks for clearing that out, I take back what I've said about the CAS.
However before putting the nail in the coffin I'd just like to point out that it's quite unimpressive to see such a top cyclist as Armistead getting to this point. Everyone's entitled to their opinion, obviously, but the history of the sport tells us that these many coincidences are likely to be no coincidences at all.
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| Riis123 |
Posted on 02-08-2016 23:44
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Grand Tour Specialist
Posts: 5075
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Gustavovskiy wrote:
Waghlon wrote:
Strydz wrote:
How is it possible to escape a ban if you've missed 3 tests in 12 months
Because due to the ruling, she's only missed two now.
Didn't get to that conclusion, tbh, thanks for clearing that out, I take back what I've said about the CAS.
However before putting the nail in the coffin I'd just like to point out that it's quite unimpressive to see such a top cyclist as Armistead getting to this point. Everyone's entitled to their opinion, obviously, but the history of the sport tells us that these many coincidences are likely to be no coincidences at all.
If Michael Rasmussen was Danish, he would've had at least one Tour right now. #FeelsBadMan |
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| Strydz |
Posted on 03-08-2016 00:06
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Team Leader
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emre99 wrote:
Ollfardh wrote:
All good calls except Turkey????
TheManxMissile wrote:
Tour of Turkey (erm... what?)
ivaneurope wrote:
Really, Tour of Turkey? I wouldn't pick a race held in an country where the president thinks he's untouchable
especially with additions like Turkey and AToC
Torku
I get it, I know.I'll TRY to explain you guys why it is okay.
1.Tour of Turkey is not a lot worse than races like Abu Dhabi (which i think its better in every category), Frankfurt and Cadel Evans Great Ocean Race...
2.The time. Tour of Turkey is held before Giro, which allows teams to go there and not just Romandie which is only 1 week away.
3.The organization, where the all hotels in 2015 (except 1) had teams were 5*.
4.Politics have nothing to do with cycling.
5.The route, Turkey is a big country, and the terrain suits every kind of stage.
6.UCI likes Turkey, I saw UCI presidents (incl. Cookson) coming to here not the Ardennes, and make some shit speeches that the race is pretty valuable.
7.Tour of Turkey is the representive race for the asia, which doesnt have a lot of race, and i dont really put United Money Emirates to Asia.
well, those look shit, but the truth.
If you think sport and politics having nothing to do with eachother then you haven't been paying attention
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| SSJ2Luigi |
Posted on 03-08-2016 00:06
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World Champion
Posts: 11971
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Riis123 wrote:
Gustavovskiy wrote:
Waghlon wrote:
Strydz wrote:
How is it possible to escape a ban if you've missed 3 tests in 12 months
Because due to the ruling, she's only missed two now.
Didn't get to that conclusion, tbh, thanks for clearing that out, I take back what I've said about the CAS.
However before putting the nail in the coffin I'd just like to point out that it's quite unimpressive to see such a top cyclist as Armistead getting to this point. Everyone's entitled to their opinion, obviously, but the history of the sport tells us that these many coincidences are likely to be no coincidences at all.
If Michael Rasmussen was Danish, he would've had at least one Tour right now. #FeelsBadMan
#neverforget #onlytimeIwaspissedatrabobank #Iwouldnotevenbemadifhistourwastakenaway |
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| Strydz |
Posted on 03-08-2016 00:09
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Team Leader
Posts: 5894
Joined: 02-08-2011
PCM$: 1625.00
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Riis123 wrote:
Gustavovskiy wrote:
Waghlon wrote:
Strydz wrote:
How is it possible to escape a ban if you've missed 3 tests in 12 months
Because due to the ruling, she's only missed two now.
Didn't get to that conclusion, tbh, thanks for clearing that out, I take back what I've said about the CAS.
However before putting the nail in the coffin I'd just like to point out that it's quite unimpressive to see such a top cyclist as Armistead getting to this point. Everyone's entitled to their opinion, obviously, but the history of the sport tells us that these many coincidences are likely to be no coincidences at all.
If Michael Rasmussen was Danish, he would've had at least one Tour right now. #FeelsBadMan
But he is Danish 
I do get your point, if he was better connected or a different nationality he would have a very underserved Tour victory
Hells 500 Crew and 6 x Everester
Don Rd Launching Place
Melbourne Hill Rd Warrandyte
Colby Drive Belgrave South
William Rd The Patch
David Hill Rd Monbulk
Lakeside Drive Emerald
https://www.everesting.cc/hall-of-fame/ |
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| emre99 |
Posted on 03-08-2016 07:01
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3332
Joined: 19-07-2012
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Strydz wrote:
emre99 wrote:
Ollfardh wrote:
All good calls except Turkey????
TheManxMissile wrote:
Tour of Turkey (erm... what?)
ivaneurope wrote:
Really, Tour of Turkey? I wouldn't pick a race held in an country where the president thinks he's untouchable
especially with additions like Turkey and AToC
Torku
I get it, I know.I'll TRY to explain you guys why it is okay.
1.Tour of Turkey is not a lot worse than races like Abu Dhabi (which i think its better in every category), Frankfurt and Cadel Evans Great Ocean Race...
2.The time. Tour of Turkey is held before Giro, which allows teams to go there and not just Romandie which is only 1 week away.
3.The organization, where the all hotels in 2015 (except 1) had teams were 5*.
4.Politics have nothing to do with cycling.
5.The route, Turkey is a big country, and the terrain suits every kind of stage.
6.UCI likes Turkey, I saw UCI presidents (incl. Cookson) coming to here not the Ardennes, and make some shit speeches that the race is pretty valuable.
7.Tour of Turkey is the representive race for the asia, which doesnt have a lot of race, and i dont really put United Money Emirates to Asia.
well, those look shit, but the truth.
If you think sport and politics having nothing to do with eachother then you haven't been paying attention
I meant the political situation of Turkey won't effect the event.
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| Luxemburger |
Posted on 03-08-2016 08:23
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My opinions:
Shonak wrote:
New WT calendar 2017 announcaed, UCI shooting for insane amount of races now. WT teams with some extra race days will have a fun time..
- 29 January: Cadel Evans Great Ocean Road Race (Australia) I'm surprised tbh
- 6-10 February: Tour of Qatar (Qatar) oh no, why this?
- 23-26 February: Abu Dhabi Tour (United Arab Emirates) expected the "more prestigious" Oman race at this point, but if I remember right Abu Dhabi has also one mountain at least.
- 25 February: Omloop Het Nieuwsblad (Belgium) deserved one
- 4 March: Strade Bianche (Italy) didn't expect the UCI to include this race, thou it's deserved I fear now that the WT status hampers the action a bit
- 22 March: Dwars Door Vlaanderen / A travers la Flandre (Belgium) instead of more hills more cobbles now
- 18-23 April: Presidential Cycling Tour of Turkey (Turkey) its at least not as boring as Qatar or London, but with the political situation no good addition. But I'll probably see now WT racing!
- 1 May: Eschborn-Frankfurt « Rund um den Finanzplatz » (Germany) Surprised, but nice addition!
- 14-21 May: Amgen Tour of California (United States) Nice one
- 30 July: Prudential RideLondon-Surrey Classic (Great Britain) ugh, with the many new stage races it was clear that the British race will be just a one day race now.
https://www.uci.ch...r-for-207/
EDIT oh well zabeled ;(
Quoted Shonaks post out of sympathy
Kirchen's second account according to Spilak23, 21-07-2016 17:16
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 03-08-2016 09:12
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World Champion
Posts: 14563
Joined: 08-08-2011
PCM$: 9100.00
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emre99 wrote:
Ollfardh wrote:
All good calls except Turkey????
TheManxMissile wrote:
Tour of Turkey (erm... what?)
ivaneurope wrote:
Really, Tour of Turkey? I wouldn't pick a race held in an country where the president thinks he's untouchable
especially with additions like Turkey and AToC
Torku
I get it, I know.I'll TRY to explain you guys why it is okay.
1.Tour of Turkey is not a lot worse than races like Abu Dhabi (which i think its better in every category), Frankfurt and Cadel Evans Great Ocean Race...
2.The time. Tour of Turkey is held before Giro, which allows teams to go there and not just Romandie which is only 1 week away.
3.The organization, where the all hotels in 2015 (except 1) had teams were 5*.
4.Politics have nothing to do with cycling.
5.The route, Turkey is a big country, and the terrain suits every kind of stage.
6.UCI likes Turkey, I saw UCI presidents (incl. Cookson) coming to here not the Ardennes, and make some shit speeches that the race is pretty valuable.
7.Tour of Turkey is the representive race for the asia, which doesnt have a lot of race, and i dont really put United Money Emirates to Asia.
well, those look shit, but the truth.
1) It's not, but the races you mention at least had nice winners the last few years, not some doped up Turk.
2) I still see most riders do Ardennes/Romandie instead of Turkey, WT status or not
3) That's a plus for sure, although it's probably shit compared to Qatar and Abu Dhabi
4) My reply to this would be too long
5) The route can be good, but some 2.2 races have better routes then WT races
6) Maybe, but the doping winners of the last few years have stained it
7) Didn't you guys want to be in Europe? If they wanted an Asian race, they should've picked Japan Cup or something. Turkey for me is the Middle East, which should have a race of its own, but 3 seems a bit too much. Not saying Turkey is the one that should be cut though.
All in all I'd rather have a African race like Gabon or a South American like San Luis included. That's a better globalisation of cycling.
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 03-08-2016 09:16
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3472
Joined: 03-01-2008
PCM$: 1348.00
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Strydz wrote:
Riis123 wrote:
Gustavovskiy wrote:
Waghlon wrote:
Strydz wrote:
How is it possible to escape a ban if you've missed 3 tests in 12 months
Because due to the ruling, she's only missed two now.
Didn't get to that conclusion, tbh, thanks for clearing that out, I take back what I've said about the CAS.
However before putting the nail in the coffin I'd just like to point out that it's quite unimpressive to see such a top cyclist as Armistead getting to this point. Everyone's entitled to their opinion, obviously, but the history of the sport tells us that these many coincidences are likely to be no coincidences at all.
If Michael Rasmussen was Danish, he would've had at least one Tour right now. #FeelsBadMan
But he is Danish
I do get your point, if he was better connected or a different nationality he would have a very underserved Tour victory
Didn't Rasmussen blatantly lie about his whereabouts. If I remember correctly he wasn't even in the same country he said he would be in and it was proved he intentionally mislead the testers.
I find this whole "she's been let off because she's British" thing a bit boring. It was the British doping authority who reported her. It was an international body who cleared her. What has anyone's nationality got anything to do with it? |
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 03-08-2016 09:16
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World Champion
Posts: 14563
Joined: 08-08-2011
PCM$: 9100.00
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Strydz wrote:
Spilak23 wrote:
Strydz wrote:
Spilak23 wrote:
It's no longer that all WT teams have to participate right?
That was announced but not 100% it was confirmed, looking at the calendar I'd expect it to be the case.
Got to feel for the US Conti squads who count on participating in races like ToC, surely going WT means they will be left out in the cold now.
Yes AToC never wanted to be WT cause it meant the American teams couldn't get in.
But it's also important for non WT races on the calender that would be dead if WT teams had to ride 2 WT programs. For example Ronde van Belgie, Tour of Norway, Settimana Lombarda or the unfortunately already dead Bayern Rundfahrt.
Yeah I can see some of the lower tier races disappear if they keep expanding the WT like this.
On WT teams competing in WT races next season
'As of 2017 season, all existing UCI WordTour events will have all UCI WorldTeams participating and for new UCI WorldTour events, participation rules which will ensure that a minimum of 10 UCI WorldTeams take part will be proposed by the UCI for approval at the next meeting of the PCC'
I can already see it happening: "We don't want Turkey" - We don't want Turkey either" - "Ok, if I take Turkey, you'll take Abu Dhabi and Qatar"
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| Ian Butler |
Posted on 03-08-2016 09:31
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Tour de France Champion
Posts: 21854
Joined: 01-05-2012
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Unfortunately I'm afraid these races will now officially start to suck.
Non-WT events are always more fought for. Win or lose - attitude.
Now all these being WT-events. It's like: Okay I'm in 7th position here. Shit this is good for the WT points.
I hope races like Strade and Omloop don't suffer from it. |
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| ivaneurope |
Posted on 03-08-2016 09:32
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 2933
Joined: 09-05-2011
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I think the expansion overseas of the WT would hurt it more that it would help. There are reasons why Tour of Beijing was canceled. IMO too many races outside of Europe would strain the budgets of some teams and especially the small teams like FDJ.
Some of the races are during the preparation for GT or in the case of AToC - during the GT itself. Also why would anyone choose Tour of Turkey instead of LBL for example. Anyone would choose LBL as it is more prestigeous race than ToT would ever be.
In conclusion - IMO some of the new events will suffer from the clashes with more decorated and prestigeous UCI WorldTour events. But I don't think they'll end up like Beijing as they are already established events prior to their WT status
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 03-08-2016 09:45
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Posts: 3472
Joined: 03-01-2008
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The problem with the World tour is that the teams aren't guaranteed to be around the following season so it makes the whole system pointless. In effect the Best team one season could not exist the following season.
In football you have leagues with relegation and promotion but the teams will always be there so it means something.
In cycling a team can finish bottom of the World Tour but they know at least 2 or 3 teams will cease to exist so they will be OK. Also, as admission to the World Tour is based on money and riders the whole point system is completely pointless. What do you get for winning the World Tour? Do teams even bother about World Tour Points? Teams with enough financial backing can just buy a place in the World Tour so what is the point of it? |
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| jandal7 |
Posted on 03-08-2016 09:48
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World Champion
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afaik WT points are for a bit of pride and a nice place in classics car convoys
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| Strydz |
Posted on 03-08-2016 13:54
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Team Leader
Posts: 5894
Joined: 02-08-2011
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ringo182 wrote:
The problem with the World tour is that the teams aren't guaranteed to be around the following season so it makes the whole system pointless. In effect the Best team one season could not exist the following season.
In football you have leagues with relegation and promotion but the teams will always be there so it means something.
In cycling a team can finish bottom of the World Tour but they know at least 2 or 3 teams will cease to exist so they will be OK. Also, as admission to the World Tour is based on money and riders the whole point system is completely pointless. What do you get for winning the World Tour? Do teams even bother about World Tour Points? Teams with enough financial backing can just buy a place in the World Tour so what is the point of it?
Have you read the proposed changes to the WT including the new team licences? Teams will get 3 years licences and in a couple of seasons they will have a promotion/relegation system in place
Hells 500 Crew and 6 x Everester
Don Rd Launching Place
Melbourne Hill Rd Warrandyte
Colby Drive Belgrave South
William Rd The Patch
David Hill Rd Monbulk
Lakeside Drive Emerald
https://www.everesting.cc/hall-of-fame/ |
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| Strydz |
Posted on 03-08-2016 13:58
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Team Leader
Posts: 5894
Joined: 02-08-2011
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ivaneurope wrote:
I think the expansion overseas of the WT would hurt it more that it would help. There are reasons why Tour of Beijing was canceled. IMO too many races outside of Europe would strain the budgets of some teams and especially the small teams like FDJ.
Some of the races are during the preparation for GT or in the case of AToC - during the GT itself. Also why would anyone choose Tour of Turkey instead of LBL for example. Anyone would choose LBL as it is more prestigeous race than ToT would ever be.
In conclusion - IMO some of the new events will suffer from the clashes with more decorated and prestigeous UCI WorldTour events. But I don't think they'll end up like Beijing as they are already established events prior to their WT status
Beijing got cancelled because it was Pat McQuaid's baby, who was the holding company that set up the Beijing race? A company that McQuaid had money in so it was no surprise that Cookson completely canned the race once he took over as the new Darklord of the UCI
Hells 500 Crew and 6 x Everester
Don Rd Launching Place
Melbourne Hill Rd Warrandyte
Colby Drive Belgrave South
William Rd The Patch
David Hill Rd Monbulk
Lakeside Drive Emerald
https://www.everesting.cc/hall-of-fame/ |
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| ringo182 |
Posted on 03-08-2016 14:20
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3472
Joined: 03-01-2008
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Strydz wrote:
ringo182 wrote:
The problem with the World tour is that the teams aren't guaranteed to be around the following season so it makes the whole system pointless. In effect the Best team one season could not exist the following season.
In football you have leagues with relegation and promotion but the teams will always be there so it means something.
In cycling a team can finish bottom of the World Tour but they know at least 2 or 3 teams will cease to exist so they will be OK. Also, as admission to the World Tour is based on money and riders the whole point system is completely pointless. What do you get for winning the World Tour? Do teams even bother about World Tour Points? Teams with enough financial backing can just buy a place in the World Tour so what is the point of it?
Have you read the proposed changes to the WT including the new team licences? Teams will get 3 years licences and in a couple of seasons they will have a promotion/relegation system in place
Didn't read that but will it make any real difference? Teams will still disappear once the licence runs out. Therefore the relegation issue will still be null and void after a few years. Also, will the system mean that all new teams must start at the bottom? If teams can still buy there way into the World Tour then it still doesn't solve the issue.
It could also have a negative effect because you can't force sponsors to be there if they don't want to be. What happens if a team wants to pull out and has two years left? They will sign useless cheap riders and you will end up with useless teams where sponsors are simply fulfilling their contractual obligation as cheaply as possible.
How about a system where each team is based in a country/city. They could use local sponsors, or just sponsors from anywhere, and each of the countries cycling governing bodies could also be involved. Teams could still sign riders from any country, so they aren't national teams, but if teams had a proper base then they could build a fan base and therefore generate money. The problem at the moment is that most teams have no identity and so have no fans. Other then prize money, which usually goes straight back to riders, how do teams generate money? It all comes from sponsors at the moment which is why so many teams collapse as soon as a sponsor pulls out. The sport is not able to support itself at the moment which is no way to run a sport. What happens if there is another major doping scandal? All the sponsors pull out and the whole sport collapses. |
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| emre99 |
Posted on 03-08-2016 15:16
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Classics Specialist
Posts: 3332
Joined: 19-07-2012
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@ivaneurope, Tour of Turkey is a prep race for giro, especially for sprinters where romandie usually has only 1 or none flat stage.
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| ivaneurope |
Posted on 03-08-2016 15:55
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Posts: 2933
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emre99 wrote:
@ivaneurope, Tour of Turkey is a prep race for giro, especially for sprinters where romandie usually has only 1 or none flat stage.
And what rider type wins the Giro - climbers. And mind you that Romandie is taking place in the Swiss Alps which is as close conditions as you can get in the Giro. And not many GT GC riders have raced in ToT - Adam Yates is perhaps is the only big name that have won it. Don't think something will change and suddenly the teams will start to care. Oh, and expect Torku to apply for PCT license after their race is now promoted.
And bit off-topic, but could affect Turkish cycling and the place of Tour of Turkey in the UCI calendar at all as well - Erdogan is reportedly removing alleged pro-Gülen directors in some sports like football. And it's common practice to suspend any sporting activities if it's proven that there's an governmental interference.
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