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PCM.daily Stat Discussion
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| cunego59 |
Posted on 12-06-2023 13:16
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Team Manager
Posts: 6508
Joined: 14-09-2008
PCM$: 1090.00
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Welcome to the new thread where you can discuss the stats for the PCM.daily Projects for PCM 23.
Everything commented here will be considered for the next releases of our projects.
Keep in mind that while top stats are the most noticeable stats, for us it's especially useful to discuss stats about smaller riders, those are often easier to miss.
1. If you comment on someone's post, comment on the contents of the post, not on the person!
2. Don't make fun of suggestions of other members. Everyone can post their suggestions. It's up to our statmakers to decide what to do with them.
3. Keep your posts strictly on-topic.
Any posts that violate these rules will be deleted immediately and without notification. Consistent violation of the rules could result in suspension or even a ban.
Edited by cunego59 on 12-06-2023 14:12
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| jacob_lion |
Posted on 21-06-2023 09:30
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Amateur
Posts: 2
Joined: 28-08-2012
PCM$: 200.00
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Does Anyone what database editors work for PCM 2023?
Neither PCM fast editor og PCM Tools by Davys work any more for PCM 2023. They worked great for PCM 2022.
Hope someone can help.  |
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| Ho0liGaN |
Posted on 22-06-2023 19:48
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Junior Rider
Posts: 42
Joined: 30-06-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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jacob_lion wrote:
Does Anyone what database editors work for PCM 2023?
Neither PCM fast editor og PCM Tools by Davys work any more for PCM 2023. They worked great for PCM 2022.
Hope someone can help.
PCM Fast Editor still works, here I edited WVA with fast Editor
https://imgur.com...
Edited by Ho0liGaN on 22-06-2023 19:56
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| MarvinEhre |
Posted on 04-07-2023 08:46
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Amateur
Posts: 1
Joined: 02-07-2023
PCM$: 100.00
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Ho0liGaN wrote:
jacob_lion wrote:
Does Anyone what database editors work for PCM 2023?
Neither PCM fast editor og PCM Tools by Davys work any more for PCM 2023. They worked great for PCM 2022.
Hope someone can help.
PCM Fast Editor still works, here I edited WVA with fast Editor
https://imgur.com...
For me, it worked 2 days ago, after the 3rd or 4th time reinstalling, and now it it again unable to save/export anything. Edit: After testing multiple saves from the weekly saves folder, only some of them dont work.
Edited by MarvinEhre on 04-07-2023 09:35
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| Ho0liGaN |
Posted on 11-07-2023 01:02
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Junior Rider
Posts: 42
Joined: 30-06-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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Shame PCM is being played less and less each year. I remember 15 years ago a lively community, even 3-4 years ago it was a lot more active. Anyway, thanks for always making this DB.
Just to get some discussion going, I'll share my thoughts on current GC contenders.
These are all the riders that I believe have a shot at winning any of the 3 grand tours.
I've changed (all) their stats to what I believe to be the best in-game representation of real-life performance. So don't go crazy at the Hill stat as it's only used from 88+ effort and represents the maximum uphill speed that rider can attain. Pure MO is used up till 77 then mixes with MM being used from ~77 to ~87. At 82 effort, it's 50/50 for MO/MM. At 87 it's Pure MM.
Of course, Flat, TT and especially REC are important in PCM 23 (STA and RES only do something when green bar drops below 67%).
Based on a somewhat crude x5 x3 x2 or x1 multiplier for how important each of these stats are according to me (besides just the stats themself, this is also up to debate) I've been able to create something I call the GC stat (simply a combination of all stats timed by their multiplier and then divided again)
| MO 5x | MM 2x | Hill 1x | Fla 1x | TT 3x | Rec 3x | Total | GC stat | | Pogacar | 405 | 166 | 83 | 78 | 234 | 246 | 1212 | 80,80 | | Vingegaard | 415 | 162 | 78 | 74 | 231 | 249 | 1209 | 80,60 | | Roglic | 400 | 164 | 82 | 76 | 231 | 237 | 1190 | 79,33 | | Evenepoel | 395 | 162 | 82 | 80 | 243 | 225 | 1187 | 79,13 | | Thomas | 405 | 152 | 77 | 77 | 234 | 234 | 1179 | 78,60 | | Hart | 400 | 156 | 78 | 73 | 231 | 231 | 1169 | 77,93 | | Mas | 400 | 158 | 78 | 75 | 222 | 234 | 1167 | 77,80 | | Almeida | 405 | 152 | 77 | 76 | 231 | 228 | 1169 | 77,93 | | Carapaz | 400 | 158 | 78 | 72 | 216 | 240 | 1164 | 77,60 | | Rodriguez | 400 | 158 | 78 | 75 | 222 | 225 | 1158 | 77,20 | | Hindley | 400 | 158 | 79 | 72 | 207 | 237 | 1153 | 76,87 | | Vine | 400 | 156 | 77 | 71 | 222 | 219 | 1145 | 76,33 | | Kuss | 410 | 152 | 77 | 70 | 204 | 228 | 1141 | 76,07 |
I really like the results for the GC stat (I just did this as an afterthought) to me it gives a really good representation of who's most likely to win any given GC.
Pogi and Vingegaard are head and shoulders above everyone else.
Roglic, Evenepoel, and Thomas are the main favorites if the top 2 aren't there.
A TT-heavy parcours definitely favors Remco and would see him ranked slightly higher than currently.
After that it becomes harder to judge, most of them are really close in real life as well and can win any GT if the terrain suits them or who's luckier or in better form.
Edited by Ho0liGaN on 11-07-2023 01:41
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| Arberg |
Posted on 12-07-2023 17:14
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 265
Joined: 09-04-2018
PCM$: 200.00
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SP:
83: Philipsen
82: Merlier
81: Cavendish, Jakobsen
80: Ewan, Groenewegen
79: Pedersen, Bauhaus
78: Van Aert, Girmay
77: Sagan, Kristoff
Edited by Arberg on 15-07-2023 08:46
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| Ollfardh |
Posted on 13-07-2023 16:05
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World Champion
Posts: 14612
Joined: 08-08-2011
PCM$: 9500.00
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Træen 50 downhill
Changed my sig, this was getting absurd.
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 15-07-2023 10:03
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Ho0liGaN wrote:
Shame PCM is being played less and less each year. I remember 15 years ago a lively community, even 3-4 years ago it was a lot more active. Anyway, thanks for always making this DB.
Just to get some discussion going, I'll share my thoughts on current GC contenders.
These are all the riders that I believe have a shot at winning any of the 3 grand tours.
I've changed (all) their stats to what I believe to be the best in-game representation of real-life performance. So don't go crazy at the Hill stat as it's only used from 88+ effort and represents the maximum uphill speed that rider can attain. Pure MO is used up till 77 then mixes with MM being used from ~77 to ~87. At 82 effort, it's 50/50 for MO/MM. At 87 it's Pure MM.
Of course, Flat, TT and especially REC are important in PCM 23 (STA and RES only do something when green bar drops below 67%).
Based on a somewhat crude x5 x3 x2 or x1 multiplier for how important each of these stats are according to me (besides just the stats themself, this is also up to debate) I've been able to create something I call the GC stat (simply a combination of all stats timed by their multiplier and then divided again)
| MO 5x | MM 2x | Hill 1x | Fla 1x | TT 3x | Rec 3x | Total | GC stat | | Pogacar | 405 | 166 | 83 | 78 | 234 | 246 | 1212 | 80,80 | | Vingegaard | 415 | 162 | 78 | 74 | 231 | 249 | 1209 | 80,60 | | Roglic | 400 | 164 | 82 | 76 | 231 | 237 | 1190 | 79,33 | | Evenepoel | 395 | 162 | 82 | 80 | 243 | 225 | 1187 | 79,13 | | Thomas | 405 | 152 | 77 | 77 | 234 | 234 | 1179 | 78,60 | | Hart | 400 | 156 | 78 | 73 | 231 | 231 | 1169 | 77,93 | | Mas | 400 | 158 | 78 | 75 | 222 | 234 | 1167 | 77,80 | | Almeida | 405 | 152 | 77 | 76 | 231 | 228 | 1169 | 77,93 | | Carapaz | 400 | 158 | 78 | 72 | 216 | 240 | 1164 | 77,60 | | Rodriguez | 400 | 158 | 78 | 75 | 222 | 225 | 1158 | 77,20 | | Hindley | 400 | 158 | 79 | 72 | 207 | 237 | 1153 | 76,87 | | Vine | 400 | 156 | 77 | 71 | 222 | 219 | 1145 | 76,33 | | Kuss | 410 | 152 | 77 | 70 | 204 | 228 | 1141 | 76,07 |
I really like the results for the GC stat (I just did this as an afterthought) to me it gives a really good representation of who's most likely to win any given GC.
Pogi and Vingegaard are head and shoulders above everyone else.
Roglic, Evenepoel, and Thomas are the main favorites if the top 2 aren't there.
A TT-heavy parcours definitely favors Remco and would see him ranked slightly higher than currently.
After that it becomes harder to judge, most of them are really close in real life as well and can win any GT if the terrain suits them or who's luckier or in better form.
Thanks for posting this and we have worked our climbing stats using a similar formula as this with the emphasis still being on main mountain but we have made heavy use of the medium mountain stat as well. We have had problems with Remco due to his TT and high backup stats as well and have constantly changed his stats: We have thought of giving him 78/82/80, 79/81/81 and the one I most favour 79/82/80 because we still really don't know how he is on a longer climbs in a GT under pressure from other top GT riders, we nearly found out last year in the Vuelta till Roglic crashed and we know he had to abandon the Giro this year as well, so we still don't really know.
What we do know of course is that Pogacar and Vingegaard are a world above the others with possibly only Roglic able to come close to them and we have worked the climbing stats to reflect this. As for other riders like Thomas we have gone for higher mountain but lesser medium mountain and hill etc
We have worked this formula through most of the riders in the DB with climbing stats of 70 and above and with the sprinters as well.
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 15-07-2023 10:03
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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He's one of the worst now with Latour
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| Ad Bot |
Posted on 15-01-2025 13:43
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Bot Agent
Posts: Countless
Joined: 23.11.09
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| IP: None |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 15-07-2023 10:05
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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Arberg wrote:
Mountain:
83: Pogacar, Vingegaard
81: Roglic, Evenepoel, Kuss
80: Hindley, Thomas, RodrÃguez, S.Yates, A.Yates, Carapaz, Mas
79: Pidcock, Almeida, Gaudu, Ayuso
78: Skjelmose, Gall, O'Connor, Bardet, Landa
You forgot to take into account medium mountain which is now a new stat and changes the distribution of the mountain stats for some riders
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| Neilstrong |
Posted on 17-07-2023 11:33
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Under 23
Posts: 77
Joined: 04-01-2012
PCM$: 300.00
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Just nerf Van Aert
please |
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| quadsas |
Posted on 18-07-2023 16:59
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Small Tour Specialist
Posts: 2537
Joined: 18-01-2013
PCM$: 300.00
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Arberg wrote:
Vingegaard
Fla 75
MO 84
MM 81
Hill 80
TT 81
Pro 80
Cob 67
Spr 66
Acc 74
DH 77
Sta 81
Res 79
Rec 85
Pogacar
Flt 74
MO 83
MM 82
Hill 82
TT 79
Pro 79
Cob 82
Spr 71
Acc 79
DH 75
Sta 80
Res 80
Rec 80
Vingegaard should be 85TT, because he put the greatest TT performance of all time that will never be replicated
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| Arberg |
Posted on 20-07-2023 06:43
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 265
Joined: 09-04-2018
PCM$: 200.00
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Van Aert
Flt 83
MO 74
MM 77
Hill 78
TT 82
Pro 82
Cob 82
Spr 78
Acc 77
DH 82
Sta 81
Res 82
Rec 80
Van der Poel
Flt 82
MO 64
MM 72
Hill 80
TT 76
Pro 78
Cob 83
Spr 76
Acc 84
DH 83
Sta 82
Res 83
Rec 68
Edited by Arberg on 06-08-2023 16:49
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| Arberg |
Posted on 22-07-2023 12:35
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 265
Joined: 09-04-2018
PCM$: 200.00
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Cobble:
83: Van Der Poel
82: Pogacar, Van Aert
80: Mads P, Asgreen, Kung, Van Baarle
79: Mohoric, Laporte
78: Pidcock, Kristoff, Stuyven, Lampaert, Turgis
77: Philipsen, Ganna, Politt, Benoot, Degenkolb |
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| Arberg |
Posted on 02-09-2023 03:54
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Neo-Pro
Posts: 265
Joined: 09-04-2018
PCM$: 200.00
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Vingegaard
Flt 73
MO 84
MM 81
Hill 80
TT 80
Pro 79
Cob 70
Spr 65
Acc 73
DH 77
Sta 82
Res 80
Rec 83
Pogacar
Flt 76
MO 82
MM 82
Hill 82
TT 79
Pro 78
Cob 82
Spr 70
Acc 78
DH 75
Sta 81
Res 81
Rec 80
Roglic
Flt 74
MO 82
MM 81
Hill 81
TT 79
Pro 78
Cob 66
Spr 68
Acc 75
DH 74
Sta 80
Res 80
Rec 79
Evenepoel
Flt 81
MO 81
MM 81
Hill 81
TT 82
Pro 81
Cob 68
Spr 67
Acc 74
DH 70
Sta 81
Res 81
Rec 78
Edited by Arberg on 08-09-2023 16:27
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| irdalopez |
Posted on 27-09-2023 10:43
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Under 23
Posts: 75
Joined: 06-04-2009
PCM$: 200.00
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Will we have an update when we finish Lombardy? |
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 30-09-2023 21:10
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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There is now a new update just released and after this attention will switch to the 2024 season. There might be a possibility though of a final stats update after Lombardia.
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| Arberg7DK |
Posted on 26-04-2024 14:58
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Amateur
Posts: 1
Joined: 26-04-2024
PCM$: 100.00
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Cobble:
83: Van Der Poel
82: Van Aert, Pogacar
80: Mads P, Van Baarle, Philipsen
79: Mohoric, Laporte, Kung
78: Pidcock, Kristoff, Stuyven, Turgis, Asgreen
77: Ganna, Politt, Benoot, Degenkolb, Lampaert
Edited by Arberg7DK on 19-05-2024 17:05
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 28-04-2024 21:47
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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We've done more testing with the stats over the last several months than ever before. We've tested multiple Tour de France and races like Flanders, Roubaix and LBL etc and these were done in both pure test mode (all random form and RDC deactivated and also with these options activated as well for contrast)
Pogacar with 81/82/82 was able to win 75% of all TDF because of his huge sta/res which can't be lowered as he needs this to win in classics, Vingegaard because of his lower sta/res needs very high climbing stats as so far he is not a classics rider and he was able to win the other 25%, so if Pogacar is raised anymore he will probably win 100% unless of course random form is used and he has bad form. Remco like Pogacar has huge sta/res and even higher flat and TT and in testing with even 78 mtn was able to finish second more times than Vingegaard and at 77 mtn was easily the third best ahead of Roglic it was only when he was reduced to 76 mtn and Roglic increased to 83 med that Roglic was the third best and Remco the fourth. We have to assume still that Remco is the fourth best in a TDF until he gets a huge result. ,
Edited by Tafiolmo on 28-04-2024 21:55
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| Tafiolmo |
Posted on 28-04-2024 21:53
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Sprinter
Posts: 1962
Joined: 10-04-2013
PCM$: 200.00
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In the classics giving Pogacar 83 cobble would be a nightmare as he would win a huge amount of Roubaix as well as Flanders. Even with 79 cobble in testing he was able to win Roubaix and so far we have no idea how he would do at Roubaix.
The object of the cobble testing was also to separate Roubaix cobble riders (big cobble and flat) and Flanders cobble riders (good climbing stats) and those that are good at both a combination of these two, which is why riders like Pogacar, Powless and Madaous are able to do well at Flanders but not so well at Roubaix, while riders like Degenkolb and Rex are going to be better at Roubaix and not so good at Flanders
Grand Tour testing proved to be easier than classics with problem races being Milan San-Remo, Flanders and LBL whereas races like Roubaix have been very easy to test.
Edited by Tafiolmo on 28-04-2024 22:00
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