From the experience of the Race of Champions and Sali's databases I decided to work on a 2000 database, with the purpose to make the best historical database fixing the common errors of every historical dbs.
It will be the most complete historical db, like a new pro cycling manager 2000.
Features
Thanks to all the kits makers and stages makers
- 62 teams (around 60 teams with real "2000" equipments) List:
Spoiler
1.Cofidis
2.Saeco - Valli & Valli
3.Banesto
4.Rabobank Cycling Team
5.Kelme - Costa Blanca
6.Vini Caldirola - Sidermec
7.Team Deutsche Telekom
8.Lotto - Adecco
9.Mapei - Quick Step
10.Farm Frites
11.O.N.C.E. - Deutsche Bank
12.Team Polti
13.Lampre - Daikin
14.Fassa Bortolo
15.Us Postal Service
16.Festina Lotus
36.Alexia - Alluminio
37,Mat - Ceresit - CCC
38.Navigators Cycling Team
39.Tonissteiner - Colnago
40.Post Swiss Team
41.Team Nurnberg
42.Agro Adler Brandeburg
43.PSK - Unit Expert
44.Bankgiroloterij - Batavus
45.Saturn Cycling Team
46.Wustenrot - ZVVZ
47.Kia - Villiger Suisse
48.Sport Lisboa e Benfica
49.Mercury Cycling Team
50.Maia - MSS
51.Team Coast
52.L.A. Aluminios - Pecol - Calbrita
53.Relax Fuenlabrada
54.Phonak Hearing Systems
55.Collstrop - De Federale Verzekeringen
56.Team Fakta
57.Vlaanderen 2002 - Eddy Merckx
58.Porta da Ravessa
59.Krka - Telekom Slovenjie
60.Mroz - Supradyn Witaniny
61.Big Mat - Auber 93
62.Besson Chaussures
- Most important teams with real "2000" frame
- More than 1000 cyclists with accurate characteristics and correct to potential to have the same grow of the reality (for example Petacchi become really strong in 2004 and Basso) I made a lot of tests in order to have this.
- More than 100 young talents that will be stars in the futures years (like Fabian Cancellara, Alejandro Valverde, Cadel Evans, Damiano Cunego, etc etc)
- Historical palmares of the best races updated since 1996, all the results from 1999 season and cyclists historical palmares updated since 1996
- Records updated to start of 2000
- Real 2000 calendar with real dates.
- More than 100 new stages, list:
Spoiler
Giro d'Italia 2000
Tour de France 2000
Tirreno - Adriatico 2000
Milano - Sanremo 2000
Giro di Lombardia 2000
World Championships 2000
Zurich 2000
Italian Championships 2000
Giro di Campania
Trofeo Pantalica
Giro della Provincia di Siracusa
Giro del Veneto
Giro della Provincia di Lucca (4 tappe)
Alps Classic
Coppa della Nazioni - Memorial Fausto Coppi
Subida Urkiola
Trofeo Luis Puig
Vuelta a Galicia (4 tappe)
Internationale Niedersachsen-Rundfahrt (5 Tappe)
And all the races of 2000 calendar with fake route (Deutschland Tour, GP Midi Libri, Euskal Bizikleta, Regio Tour etc etc)
- 2000 World Cup with a personalized leader shirt for all the teams
- Real starting list for all the GT of 2000
And:
- An adding Sponsorkits pack with more than 100 real sponsor of 00s
Avalaible in a month.
Helps on stages or shirts are appreciated
Edited by Stylus on 10-04-2014 08:45
Those screens look great! The graphics are amazing Did you get all these equipment made for the DB or did you find some of it already created? It's very nice
Concerning the stats, I'm by no means an expert but imho here are a few things I'd change: lower Tchmil's COB (up HIL though), up Museeuw's HIL, up Hincapie COB (specially when you also think of the '01 P-R) and perhaps a few points at SP. In sprints, Cipollini seems a bit overpowered (specially in STA/RES/REC, mainly the latter - I'd lower REC and up MO). Zabel could be put a bit lower, if you take the TdF for example, he got the podium 7 times but only one win (and also in the 3rd week when some sprinters like Wust, Steels and O'Grady weren't racing anymore). But Zabel should also have at least 80 STA and definitely more HIL. Speaking of Marcel Wust, he should definitely have a higher SP/ACC.
Apart from that, Armstrong's gap to everyone else in MO, TT (3 more points than Ullrich?) and specially REC is a bit too big I'd say - speaking of REC, most GC contenders seem to have quite low values in that, I'd also change that (the same goes for DH/sprinters, btw). I'm also unsure why Armstrong is insanely ahead of everyone else on STA. On the other hand, not sure why Ullrich has better HIL than Armstrong (and better HIL than most riders for that reason - 79 seems pretty high for him). I also don't think I'd put Pantani lower than Ullrich in MO, and why 67 REC?
Lastly - Ekimov being the 4th best rider in AVG doesn't look much correct He seems a bit overrated in TT. Jan Svorada also looks overrated, he's currently the 9th! best rider overall and 3rd best sprinter? Ah, and Felix Cardenas, 79 MO, wut?
In terms of calendar, not sure how much depth you're intending to put on the 2000 calendar, but you should definitely consider renaming the categories since the class of the WT races is divided in 5 in the DB, you could make it like: 2 for the GTs, then 1 for the monuments - which you could re-use as the 'CDM' races, and then the "AutresClassiques" for the 1.HC and "AutresTours" for the 2.HC. Then the game's 2.HC becomes 2.1 (or a merge between 2.1 and 2.2, since there weren't many 2.1 races and there are prestigious races among the .2 races, like Criterium International and Giro del Trentino), game's 2.1 becomes 2.2, etc.
Speaking of the race categories, any chance you're playing with the original DB/original Local.cdb? I noticed that the race classes still say "CWT" ( = Cyanide World Tour) rather than just WT, same for the race category logo (above Il Lombardia's logo in the 1st screen), while any decent DB should already fix these things. Ah, and speaking about it: don't forget to change the team division names to Division I, II and III
Things are looking great so far, keep it up!
Edited by lluuiiggii on 06-04-2014 04:01
Very nice screenshots and I think it is a great idea with the year of 2000! Nice riders indeed.
Anyway, I think it is more important to have great stats than "thousand" so I hope that the stats will be your priority in this project and secondly the graphic which is also important.
Very good work so far. I agree with lluuiiggii, but the stats are probably the last step of the project. If I finish my 2009 TDF, I will see if I can support you a little bit here.
Edited by bigggassi on 06-04-2014 17:35
bigggassi wrote:
Very good work so far. I agree with lluuiiggii, but the stats are probably the last step of the project. If I finish my 2009 TDF, I will see if I can support you a little bit here.
Thank you bigg.. your help is precious!
@lluigi. Thank you for your suggests, I immediatly corrected some thing:
The first thing is that I spent / I'm spending a lot of time to have the correct potential, for example Hincapie will be exactly so strong in 2001.
About Recover and Pantani. I made a lot, a lot, a lot of test to have the most realistic Pantani (in 2000) and result is the statistic that you see.
2000 was the first year of fall for Pantani. He started to loss half an hours in the flat and hilly stages, and, at the same time, he made difference during the climbs only three times, (two in tour and once during the giro). During the Tour he was retired before the third week.
In a first time I gave a major value on mountain to Pantani and a good value for recover: the result is that Pantani win all the mountain stages of the Giro and was always second in TDf. And it was unrealistic.
Another thing that I discovered and it is quite terribile is the fact the recover's value as something similar to no effect for the I.A.! I make a Giro simulation when Pantani has a lower value of recover (like 60): well, after three week he was stil winning all the mountain stages and he won the Giro with a lot of a time of advantage. With this stats Pantani has got a balance value I think.
(I fixed all the othere values, Zabel, Museuuw, tchmil, svorada etc etc)
Another thing is not to consider the overal value given by the game: is quite strange! Look at Rebellin: he has got all the stats worst than boogerd (except one) and he has got an overal value bigger then boogerd!
2000 being his first year of decadence should be represented in the gene_i_age_decline value. That said, his problems were mostly psychological rather than physical. His cocaine use started after 1999, when he got disqualified on the penultimate stage of the Giro because of too high hematocrit (52% when the limit was 50%), and also later in 99 he had to face the investigation of his hematocrit being over 60% after a crash in the '95 Milano-Turino. I also imagine his depression problems started somewhere at this point.
In early 2000, he was talking about how he wanted to win all 3 GTs, but eventually didn't start in any preparation race which he had been planned to ride on his calendar except for the Tour of Valencia, which he abandoned after 2 stages. These 2 were his only race days before the Giro, which he decided to ride 1 day before the start (earlier he had confirmed he wouldn't be riding it) and from the start was already claiming his main intention was to build form (Garzelli would be the leader for Mercatone). Summing up, his Giro 2000 results aren't worth looking at; even in the 19th stage, the only one where he showed something good, he was mostly in conflict between riding for Garzelli or for himself.
In the TdF, he didn't lose any time in non-GC stages (flat ones). In the Hautacam, he was already 5 minutes behind Armstrong because of the ITT and TTT. Only Armstrong could follow when Pantani attacked at the beginning of the climb, and when Armstrong left him behind he might have cracked mentally/physically, since at that point he was ahead of all the other favorites but eventually he'd be caught and left behind by them all.
On the remaining stages, he was always only behind Armstrong: in Ventoux, left everyone else behind, despite riding against a strong headwind (later Armstrong caught him and gifted him the win); in stage 14, he also attacked in the finishing hill in Briançon and finished a few seconds ahead of the favorites group; in Courchevel, he dropped everyone - including Armstrong - to take the win solo; and in stage 16, he attacked with 120 kms to go and kept a gap to the Postal chasers through most of the stage. He then cracked in the final climb after such suicidal move but did manage to make Armstrong suffer (losing more than a minute to Ullrich&co) and thus was sort of successful in trying to 'blow the race up' (he said that's what he wanted). Then in the following day he abandoned with a stomach bug, but honestly there wasn't much left for him in that Tour.
Summing up: even if he wasn't in his best physically and mentally speaking, he was probably the 2nd best climber in that year, just behind Armstrong. If you want to reproduce his mental problems that faded his career in the following years, then you should give him a age of decline value of 30 (meaning from 31 onwards, that is, 2001 onwards - he will lose stats), but in 2000 I'd still rate him only behind Armstrong in climbing.
Stylus wrote:
In a first time I gave a major value on mountain to Pantani and a good value for recover: the result is that Pantani win all the mountain stages of the Giro and was always second in TDf. And it was unrealistic.
Did you change Pantani's racing fitness to 0 and worse training fitness before the Giro? If not then it won't be realistic indeed
Recovery: in earlier games, it didn't have any effect in simulation mode, so if this is still the same in PCM13, I wouldn't be surprised. I don't think remember reading about it not working for the AI in 3D mode, but I wouldn't discount that possibility.
About Hincapie: even if in 2001 he probably was even better than one year earlier, I still think he deserves at least 79 COB already in 2000. In the '00 P-R, he was the very first rider covering Tafi's wheel in the Arenberg section (Tafi led the peloton through that section, creating a select group) and was always among the very first riders (following Wesemann's attack on one of the final sections); he would likely have a good shot at the podium if he hadn't ridden the final kms with a soft tire, which made it hard for him to sprint. Speaking of Tafi, he perhaps might deserve another 1 or 2 points in COB, he was up there chasing anyone who tried to attack in the group of chasers of Museeuw chasers until puncturing just a few kms away from the finish. If not, he would also be a candidate for the podium.
And even if the game's AVG calculation might be a bit weird, it's still important to try to fit the stats to the calculation, since several of the game's decisions are based on it
perhaps having a discussion thread where others can come with their input, or will it just be here ? 
Looking forward to this db 
