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News in June
issoisso
Juan wrote:
issoisso, you didn't say Steegmans made a counter-proposition to Katushe guys Wink


I had no idea. Thanks.
The preceding post is ISSO 9001 certified

i.imgur.com/YWVAnoO.jpg

"I love him, I think he's great. He's transformed the sport in so many ways. Every person in cycling has benefitted from Lance Armstrong, perhaps not financially but in some sense" - Bradley Wiggins on Lance Armstrong
 
chuckie
Does anyone honestly think that their going to throw Steegmans off the team for not signing?..Doubt it.

This is like the UCI's "all riders must sign or forfit a years wage" thing a couple of years back.No credibility.
www.pezcyclingnews.com/photos/races09/tdf09/tdf09st08gc-wegmann.jpg
 
zemaria
5 years is a lot. I would't sign it, too. Or I would, if it was something like:

If we find strong evidences of you being doped (like unexpected results linked to some blood bags in your room or you getting caught in the bathroom taking some suspicious pills,...) you would have to pay us 5 years's salary and run naked aroud your home town.
 
Xavier
hmm they dont have to pay when they test positive but when they are 'strongly linked to doping or other forbidden substances', thats why steegmans doesnt want to pay
a) because 5y of wages is a lot
b) because if they sack them for something which later turns out to be untrue or unfounded, then the money still would be gone Smile
 
zemaria
Xavier wrote:
hmm they dont have to pay when they test positive but when they are 'strongly linked to doping or other forbidden substances', thats why steegmans doesnt want to pay
a) because 5y of wages is a lot
b) because if they sack them for something which later turns out to be untrue or unfounded, then the money still would be gone Smile


"because if they sack them for something which later turns out to be untrue or unfounded, then the money still would be gone "

That's hardly possible, "strongly linked" is strongly linked, i don't see that would turn out to be untrue...
 
jacknic
issoisso wrote:
jacknic wrote:
No, not really. To demand five years salary back is totally ridiculous. In no way or form is that demand even remotely reasonable, so I am not surprised that some of the riders are refusing to sign the contract.


A clean rider has nothing to fear at all.

It's like your boss saying "you can only work here if you agree to pay us money if you murder someone".

If you're an honest person, you don't think twice about taking it.

The counter argument here is, that if you are an honest person, it would be very insulting to be proposed such a contract, as it assumes you are going to cheat. It's like saying videosurvailance everywhere is alright, because honest people have nothing to hide.
 
zemaria
jacknic wrote:
issoisso wrote:
jacknic wrote:
No, not really. To demand five years salary back is totally ridiculous. In no way or form is that demand even remotely reasonable, so I am not surprised that some of the riders are refusing to sign the contract.


A clean rider has nothing to fear at all.

It's like your boss saying "you can only work here if you agree to pay us money if you murder someone".

If you're an honest person, you don't think twice about taking it.

The counter argument here is, that if you are an honest person, it would be very insulting to be proposed such a contract, as it assumes you are going to cheat. It's like saying videosurvailance everywhere is alright, because honest people have nothing to hide.


Yes, you got it
 
Smowz
issoisso wrote:
Smowz wrote:
Instead Lance concentrated his efforts in an Indurain like way, that concentrated everything on the tour.


That's not what IndurĂ¡in did.


Perhaps my misconception, my reading of Indurains career was that he built up his career winning small stage races such as the Paris Nice and then took over from Pedro Delgado as a man for the Tour for his team.

He seemed to use the Giro almost to build up for the TdF, but also races like the Dauphine and Volta.

A different rider to Armstrong who used to follow on mountains and completely destroy on Time Trials - I thought however his season was pretty much exclusively built for the TdF and perhaps Olympic/World Time Trials and tilts at the would hour record.

Did Indurain ride other races too, low key a la Sastre in low key build up like the small spainish stage races and the Paris Nice?
 
fenian_1234
On Katusha - I'd sign on the condition that if I didn't test positive, they'd give me five times my annual salary at the end of the season. Only fair, isn't it?

On Hinault and LA - The Badger was able to ride at an extremely high level most of the season.

LA could do the same for 3 weeks in July.

I know whose palmares I would rather have.

Hinault winning P-R was an absolutely magnificent achievement. LA would never even dream of riding it, just in case he grazed his shin.

Comparing the two is ludicrous, so I'll stop. :lol:
 
KurtinSC
fenian_1234 wrote:
On Katusha - I'd sign on the condition that if I didn't test positive, they'd give me five times my annual salary at the end of the season. Only fair, isn't it?

On Hinault and LA - The Badger was able to ride at an extremely high level most of the season.

LA could do the same for 3 weeks in July.

I know whose palmares I would rather have.

Hinault winning P-R was an absolutely magnificent achievement. LA would never even dream of riding it, just in case he grazed his shin.

Comparing the two is ludicrous, so I'll stop. :lol:


While I agree on Hinault's accomplishments far outshining Armstrong's... Lance was smart about how he road in terms of maximizing his exposure in the US.

Here... maybe one out of every 10,000 people even know what Milano-Sanremo, Liege-Bastogne-Liege, the Giro d'Italia or Paris-Roubaix are. But most know what the Tour de France is. It's hard to fault him for deciding it made the most sense to focus on the only major race that anyone in the US really knew about.

Nobody in the US knew who Lance was when he won the Settima Ciclista Lombardia in 1991. Nobody here knew who he was when he won the world championships in 1993. Nobody knew who he was when he got second in the Clasica San Sebastian and in Liege-Bastogne-Liege in 1994. Nobody knew who he was when he won the Clasica San Sebastian in 1995. Nobody knew who he was when he was second in Liege-Bastogne-Liege and Paris-Nice in 1996. Nobody really cared about the Tour DuPont wins he had either.

Even though some heard about his cancer battle, he still wasn't recognized for winning the Tour of Luxembourg in 1998, or his 2nd place finish in Amstel Gold in 1999.

But when he won the Tour in 1999... he became famous in the US.


Lance could have won the Giro this year and most people in the US would have thought the win meant something similar to winning the Tour of Georgia. Just a warmup race for the only bike race they know about... The Tour de France.


If you look at his results, he could have been a successful Ardennes rider. He could have won many more 1-week tours as well. But if he had won 3 ardennes classics, 5 more big 1-week races, the Giro twice and a world championship.... at the expense of a single Tour victory... it would have been a negative for him in terms of how he was viewed in the US.

Sad... but if you look at it in that light you can't really fault him for the choice he made when it came to how he managed his seasons in his best years.
 
Biathlon
I've heard that it was Bruyneels idea that Lance should give it all for the tour in 99. And the other years.. Or something..
Words to live by
"What would Lance do?"
i666.photobucket.com/albums/vv23/Biiathlon/livestrong_tdf.jpg
 
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doddy13
There's a UCI/ASO Press Conference this wednesday.

Rumors suggest it's on ths subject of Anti Doping.
There's no point slapping a schleck - Sean Kelly on "Who needs a slap"
 
Andreas93
Why should it not?
m1.2mdn.net/viewad/2222913/Nuevo_banner_ROTOR.gif
 
doddy13
Prediction: You'll sign some sort of anti-doping register etc.
There's no point slapping a schleck - Sean Kelly on "Who needs a slap"
 
Andreas93
Or...maybe a result of the blood program Grin
m1.2mdn.net/viewad/2222913/Nuevo_banner_ROTOR.gif
 
chuckie
Or maybe....all sponsors must commit for five years or leave immediately.
www.pezcyclingnews.com/photos/races09/tdf09/tdf09st08gc-wegmann.jpg
 
fenian_1234
KurtinSC wrote:
While I agree on Hinault's accomplishments far outshining Armstrong's... Lance was smart about how he road in terms of maximizing his exposure in the US.

Sad... but if you look at it in that light you can't really fault him for the choice he made when it came to how he managed his seasons in his best years.


Nice post. I don't disagree with much of what you said.
 
Biathlon
Robbie McEwen about the Katusha stuff.

I would like to inform all my fans and followers and anyone else that contrary to some media reports, I am not against an addendum to my contract with Katusha in relation to anti-doping as such.

I have been legally advised that the terms of the addendum to the contract are not judicially correct as well as being too vague and broad in their definition of what constitutes a breach as there is no reference to existing official anti-doping guidelines.

I fully support the principles behind the anti-doping stance of my team and when the issues concerning the details of the addendum are clarified I will add my weight to the Katusha Team campaign. I already submit to and support the various programs of the WADA, UCI, IOC, the Flemish Community and the ASADA (Australia) etc who between them have tested me several hundred times during my 14 year professional career always with a negative result.

I want it clearly understood that I am absolutely anti-doping. I'm confident that this matter will be resolved soon and when my knee is healed I will return to racing and winning with my Katusha Team.

Robbie McEwen

Words to live by
"What would Lance do?"
i666.photobucket.com/albums/vv23/Biiathlon/livestrong_tdf.jpg
 
Juan
According to L'Equipe, Colom found positive out of competition on the 2nd of April
 
Wolfos
Yeah, on Cyclingnews now. His blood profile and race schedule was used to target him for tests.

https://www.cyclin...jun09news3
Edited by Wolfos on 09-06-2009 18:09
 
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