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PCM.daily » Pro Cycling Manager 2020 » PCM 20: General
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Pro Cyclist - Optimizing rider to win all types of race?
Pieroku
Hey, I was wondering if any of you guys had try to have a rider able to win all types of race? (Extreme difficulty, no changing stats in editor)
For ex able to win Tours, cobblestone, classics (LBL, La fleche, etc etc), World championship.
And I mean winning (or close) on a regular basis, not just winning by "luck" (breakaway, favorite falls...)
I havent played for a few years and now i just finished my 1st career 2020. For my 2nd run I'm gonna try to have a guy able to win everything.
Has anybody tried?
I need any advice to be able to optimize my rider as much as I can
This is what i know from my 1st playthrough:
- Can win tours/mountains with 82/83 moutain
- Can win hills (some some classics) with 81 hill, 81 Acc, 74 res, low sprint (but hard).
- Baroudeur is only used for AI
- I think I can win more classics with probably 78/80 sprint.
This is what I dont know:
- What do I need to win cobblestone?(would you guys say around 80 flat/sprint/cob? And can I win with low res like 75?)

Any idea whats the best axis combo to start with?

I've done a few different axis combination, using an editor to see the real potential stats. I'm uploading the file if anyone want to have a look.
i.ibb.co/1JW4fkm/pcm-axis.png
Looks like I might go for COB/Stage, but RES max would be 75, not sure if it's enough, what do you guys think?

And last but MOST important question: What do you guys know about stats and potential increase?
If I increase the potential too many times I know i wont be able to reach it.
- But what about if you increase it only once ? Are you still going to achieve your max potential? What's the optimal number of potential increase?
- is the stat increase based on potential or is it random? For ex lets say I have 60 mountain, and I'm increasing climber. Would I get a bigger increase if my potential is 85 compared to if it was 75? Or not necessarly
- is it better to increase potential at the beginning, towards the end, or doesnt matter?

And something I dont understand:Last playthrough I raised my guy's sprint potential probably around level 20-25, I had 66 sprint and 75 potential but later when I tried to increase sprint I couldnt, I got stuck at 66?


Didnt think I was going to write so many questions but I cant find much infos about pro cyclist.


Thanks!

----------------------------------------------------


Infos:
Levels where you can increase your stats in Pro Cyclist:
2
3
4
5
6
8
10
12
14
16
19
22
25
28
31
34
37

Max increase possible per level per stat (it varies, don't know if it's random or if it's set per axis we're chosing):

Cob Climber Stat increase level 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 8.

i.ibb.co/4TCq2ST/pcm-training-increase-part-1.png

Cob Climber Stat increase level 10, 12, 14, 16, 19, 22

i.ibb.co/ysT0q0C/pcm-training-increase-part-2.png
Edited by Pieroku on 20-09-2020 01:59
 
Ripley
I don't think anybody's gone into so much detail yet. It's up to you to figure out and report back with your best results. Smile I doubt it can be done, winning both Le Tour and Paris-Roubaix... maybe you could push towards one goal first and then switch for the last upgrades to achieve the latter?
i.imgur.com/itY17df.png

pcmdaily.com/files/Awards2019/team%20story.png
pcmdaily.com/files/Awards2019/avatar.png
 
Pieroku
Exactly what I'm trying to do Smile Focus on COB/Sprint first, then mountain

I'm halfway trough the 1st season, mountain doesnt want to go up even if I take a stage racer training.... Thats why I do the rest 1st, Stuck at 63 ATM hopefully it will increase later....

I'll keep you posted then Wink
 
Pieroku
Alright so after 1 season:
i.ibb.co/PG34cLW/PCM.png
Level 9, 8 victories, mainly sprint + couple in hills
Skills upgrade: 6/6
Potential upgrade: 0/6
Upgrade level 2,3,4,5,6,8
 
kreten
your type is north classic?
 
Pieroku
Yeah 1st axis classic, 2nd stage race
 
Pieroku
End of Season 2, Level 19
i.ibb.co/RSRFCKY/PCM.png
Skills upgrade: 4/5
Potential upgrade: 1/5
I'm trying to max out Sprint and TT before increasing climber potential (as it decreases max sprint and TT)

17 victories but very hard when your rider is average everywhere.

I've edited the excel sheet on the 1st post as I realized I made a mistake

Levels where you can increase your stats in Pro Cyclist:
2
3
4
5
6
8
10
12
14
16
19
22
25
28
31
34
37

My starting potential was 1024 (total of stats)
As of lvl 19, my total is 946, so 78 points to go with only 6 level left to up stats. Doesnt look like I'm gonna reach it.

So it looks like if you do any potential increase, your rider wont be able to reach its max stats

I will edit the 1st post to put all the infos I'm finding out
 
Ripley
Too much FLA, also too much SPR and probably too much TTR. I know you want to be able to win everything, but you have to "be realistic". You won't win the WC title in a mass sprint, you'll want a difficult course, and for the TdF your best best would be a route with little TT so you could mostly ignore that skill. Generally it'd be much easier winning a GT with MON 85 TTR 60 than, say, with MON 75 TTR 85. And how many classics really needs SPR 78+?
i.imgur.com/itY17df.png

pcmdaily.com/files/Awards2019/team%20story.png
pcmdaily.com/files/Awards2019/avatar.png
 
Pieroku
Ripley wrote:
Too much FLA, also too much SPR and probably too much TTR. I know you want to be able to win everything, but you have to "be realistic". You won't win the WC title in a mass sprint, you'll want a difficult course, and for the TdF your best best would be a route with little TT so you could mostly ignore that skill. Generally it'd be much easier winning a GT with MON 85 TTR 60 than, say, with MON 75 TTR 85. And how many classics really needs SPR 78+?


yep true for TT.

Hard with the "random" stat increase, I mean for flat it just goes up without me chosing to up it. went from 77 to 81 last level.

I think all but 1 level I chose the upgrade that gave me the most total points, the 1 that didnt was giving me more res hence why I took it.

I wanted to up TT til 75 but now you mention it i might just focus on mountain from now on.

Sprint 75, if I end up with the best 5-6 riders on hills or cobbles it might be a bit light

See how it goes, hopefully I'll get sprint points when I up mountain
 
Pieroku
End of Season 3, level 29
i.ibb.co/ZcGcySv/PCM.png

Skills upgrade: 3/3
Potential upgrade: 0/3

3 levels left, 53 points from max starting potential

Wont reach it. Looks like even if i didnt do 1 potential upgrade I wouldnt have reached it. Mountain potential is 74 and I only got 4 points in the last 3 upgrades (all climber)

So increasing potential seems like a waste of time?

I lost one point in flat as well, didnt know you could lose points :lol:


I manage to win hills (with 73, won national championship and other stuffs) and follow in mountains as long as the climb is not too long.
Finished Giro 22nd with 65 mountain. Was the leader until the last 3-4 stages with big mountains.
Im wondering If it's possible to win a tour with 75? Might try next career
Dont know about cobbles, my team hasnt been invited to any of the maj cobble
Edited by Pieroku on 13-09-2020 08:33
 
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Ripley
Great rider, but not a TdF winner.

is the stat increase based on potential or is it random? For ex lets say I have 60 mountain, and I'm increasing climber. Would I get a bigger increase if my potential is 85 compared to if it was 75?


That's still the question after your disappointing 3 upgrades. My guess is it does make a difference. But in any case, in your primary focus you'll have a high potential, maybe even 85, but at least 83, but in the secondary axis you'll only have a potential of 73 or 74. So you'd probably have to use three or even five upgrades to get to 80 potential in the other stat and you just cannot afford that.
i.imgur.com/itY17df.png

pcmdaily.com/files/Awards2019/team%20story.png
pcmdaily.com/files/Awards2019/avatar.png
 
Pieroku
Ripley wrote:
Great rider, but not a TdF winner.

is the stat increase based on potential or is it random? For ex lets say I have 60 mountain, and I'm increasing climber. Would I get a bigger increase if my potential is 85 compared to if it was 75?


That's still the question after your disappointing 3 upgrades.


Just realised we can find out a bit more playing around with the editor, 2 different tests here
i.ibb.co/n6Rj8dD/level-up.png
Looks like there is at least 3 different hard cap, maybe more, but which one? The one for sure are:
- Max increase cap per level: For ex level 22 you cant increase more than 2 in mountain (but is it for everyone or just northern riders?)
- Max increase cap with max potential: the closer you are from your max potential, the smaller the increase is: for ex flat could increase by 4 points but only 1 because close to max
- Max increase cap per specialisation: ex sprint: can increase by 2, but if you select stage race you only get 50% of the max increase possible

There is a lot to it, it's more complicated than what i first thought. I'm done for the tests here I think, If anyone see anything else form the tests let us know Smile

Edit: I think I got my answer, it's not possible to have a rider great at everything, you wont be able to increase one main stat
 
TheManxMissile
In setting up a rider to win TDF + Monuments you've gone from the wrong side of the question. It is much much harder to make a Classics rider win a Tour, then it is to make a Tour rider win Classics.

A good Tour rider will have strong HL, good ACC, and be up there in Res/Sta ability. All of which are needed to take on the Monuments, much more so than SP or CB skill.

But the best play i think would be to sacrifice TT of the main stats. Yes it's useful to win a GT, but you can get routes heavily mountain focused (like almost every Giro or Vuelta).
And i think SP is not required either. Ok if you reach the end of Lombardia or whatever in a goup you'll struggle, but just change your tactic and try to win these races solo.

That leaves you working on MO, HL + CB (i think ACC is a half-main stat but almost everything helps you boost that with STA/RES as well). And put the focus on the first two. Get those above 80 isn't too hard and will put you in the fight for a GT. Get CB to 78 and RVV is a real posiblity along with LBL + Lombardia (MSR in PCM is always a bit weird with the late climb making it too easy). And at 78 with luck and smart riding you can win Roubaix.
But as in your tests above, from a sub-70 MO you can never win a GT. Even at 78MO you're a long shot. Focus on the GT winning stats first and you'll have a more complete rider in what PCM allows.
i.imgur.com/UmX5YX1.jpgi.imgur.com/iRneKpI.jpgi.imgur.com/fljmGSP.jpgi.imgur.com/qV5ItIc.jpgimgur.com/dr2BAI6.jpgimgur.com/KlJUqDx.jpg[/img[img]]https://imgur.com/yUygrQ.jpgi.imgur.com/C1rG9BW.jpgi.imgur.com/sEDS7gr.jpg
 
ignarocaruso
what about cobble + grimpeur?
 
Pieroku
Yeah I do need more mountain but I took a Cob main axis, stage 2nd just because It has the higher total potential, and it looked like the easier profile to have a rider being able to win everything as I "just" needed to increase the mountain potential a couple of times and I could have reached 80.

Or at least that was the plan Smile

Didnt know all the ins and out of stats increase, didnt think there would be a cap.
Lots of stats increase on their own, like i didnt raise TT sacrificing another stat, same for flat.

Looking back now I think you're right, my best bet would be a stage/COB, and increasing cob first up to 78 then. But the sprint wouldnt reach 70....
I might try if I'm motivated
 
Pieroku
ignarocaruso wrote:
what about cobble + grimpeur?


I havent looked at that one, i went for stage and cob as they are the most complete axis.. But it might be interesting, I need to double check Smile

Edit:
i.ibb.co/n3x7TZ1/climb-cob.png
Not too bad, same potential as stage cob but starting with 7 less points. Higher sprint, higher accel lower TT....

Very interesting..
Edited by Pieroku on 13-09-2020 17:09
 
Pieroku
Ok so I've ran a few more tests.
i.ibb.co/LxzZmrC/training-tests.png

It confirms a few things, this is what I can say from it:
- Every level has a max you can increase per stat (not sure if it's linked to your rider type though). For exemple, level 31, thats what you can gain max:
Flat: 2
Mountain: 4
Hills: 2
TT: 2
Prologue: 1
Cob: 1
Sprint: 1
Acc: 1
DH: 2
Baroud: 1
Stamina: 1
Res: 2
Rec: 2
- If your stat is more than 15 points lower than your potential, you get max increase regardless of the specialisation you chose
- Every specialisation will give you max in certain stats, and (max -1,-2 -3 ) in other stats, for ex stage race, you get max in mountain, TT, (max -1) in hills etc etc
- Then you get less and less the closer you are to your potential


The numbers I'm giving are not 100% accurate but it gives you a good idea on how it works and I dont think it's necessary to get the exacts numbers


Bottom line is, if you want to reach your max potential, only increase your stats, dont increase your potential.
If you dont care about having say 85 mountain and you are happy with 82, you can increase your potential somewhere else, but it's better to do it at the beginning
 
Pieroku
Alright so I've maxed out my guy, this is his stats:
i.ibb.co/2ZQ23FH/lvl-37.png
I've won everything so far except La Fleche (but I screw up, might be able to win it with these stats) and the national TT (3rd, cant do better)
Finished 16th in the Giro (best sprinter)
Havent done the World Championship yet (currently riding the TDF)

And I've also noted the max upgrade for the last few levels, if anyone is interested:
i.ibb.co/C78mrMT/training-stats.png


I came a bit short in Mountain, thats a shame, but if I try again I know I have to up mountain at the beginning rather than leaving it too late.

Also there is a good increase on Cob and res on the last level, so I could sacrifice it early on, chose mountain, and up it on the last level
If I do try again :lol:
 
aflfan
I haven't had much time to play recently but I think northern classic main axis, climber 2nd axis was very good. You will also be able to have a good sprint and acceleration. Time trial will still be ok you just pick the grand tours without many time trial kilometers. The priority for the upgrades is to improve cobble and mountain, if you get a bad roll then you improve potential. For classic + climber you will only need to improve climber potential once and maybe another increase for stage racer.
 
Pieroku
aflfan wrote:
I haven't had much time to play recently but I think northern classic main axis, climber 2nd axis was very good. You will also be able to have a good sprint and acceleration. Time trial will still be ok you just pick the grand tours without many time trial kilometers. The priority for the upgrades is to improve cobble and mountain, if you get a bad roll then you improve potential. For classic + climber you will only need to improve climber potential once and maybe another increase for stage racer.

i.ibb.co/sbstHRt/Cob-climb.png
You're right, it's probably the best combo possible, might give it a go
Thanks Smile
 
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